LTG Life Time Gold - who actually uses this?

[justinbrett]

I've been gold for about 12 years, never got to Plat. Probably never will.

I never get to fly J for work so the only time I do is if I do a point upgrade or I pay for it (I've done it a few times but don't make a habit of it).

I'll get LTG in about 8 years I think - and I'm in my mid 30s. I figure it will be good when I get older and don't travel as much. It would also be handy if I have to move overseas for a few years (making the 4 QF segments difficult).

I'm just worried about QF getting rid of it before I get there - like they did with QP lifetime passes.

 

[Ikara]

I achieved LTG through work (all in Y) before I retired 10 years ago. These days I fly (maybe) three times a year and believe me it is a very nice feeling to be able to walk into the lounge every time I fly as a "relative newbie". It's like a set of golden handcuffs that Qantas have caught me with but it's definitely a very comfortable cushion to have.
JB

 

[mviy]

I would use LTG if I had it. I can't see myself maintaining WP indefinitely. The greater availability of QF award seats (compared with lower status), lounge access, upgrade priority, better seats available, free seat selection (except extra legroom/exit row) are nice benefits.

I'm just worried about QF getting rid of it before I get there - like they did with QP lifetime passes.

Indeed. I'm working towards LTG but like you way too far away to contemplate status runs to get there in a very short space of time if they were to discontinue it suddenly any time soon.

If QF did get rid of LTG I'd be much more inclined to try other airlines knowing that there's no lifetime benefits for my loyalty.

 

[juddles]

The consensus appears to be that the value of LTG is the fallback position of status for “when I am older and travel less”. I get that feeling, and am not disagreeing with the warm fuzzy feeling. What I want to discus sis the real COST of gaining that, and whether it is worth it. If all your travel to qualify was paid for by someone else, then the cost issue is not applicable and it is just a freebie that your life gained you.

To further my ponderings on LTG value and the reality (or not) of its actual real benefit, I just played around with some mathematics. (please feel free to throw rocks at my figures)

But first a few things:

I know that theoretically there are ways to achieve SC very fast at lower cost, such as status runs in the US and so forth. But these (for the vast majority of people) are not real. Sure, many on this forum have managed shenanigans, but if we go into that it probably would actually further my position that “LTG is a carrot that most end up paying a lot of unnecessary cash to chase, and will probably never eat”

For my example I start by whittling down the myriad scenarios to get some sort of baseline situation that is probably very real for “most”. I use the following:

1.- Average time to amass LTG = 20 years (ie 700 SC per year) Here I am discounting all the P1’s and so forth, using the argument that if you were a P1 you (a) probably had work of a decent income level, and (b) are really sick of flying , so in combination this means that you would probably travel in premium cabins in retirement anyway, so Gold does nothing for you.

2.- Average cost per year of travel spend is $7,500. This would be $10,000 if flying was domestic Y RedE deals, or $5,000 if you used cheap J trans-tasman deals – so I split the difference. (BTW this gives an average of about $10 per SC – YES I KNOW THAT THERE ARE CHEAPER TRICKS)

3.- I “reckon” that if spend was done on economics alone (not keeping loyalty to QF nor doing status runs or other modifications to pursue LTG), it would be very easy to save $1000 per year (ie save about 15%)

4.- I use a life scenario of 20 years working/gaining LTG status, then a “retirement phase" of another 20 years where the person does 10 trips a year whilst enjoying their LTG status.


Anyway, if this notional person put that $1000 saved per year into savings, at an interest rate of 4% (not unreasonable over a twenty year time frame), they would have amassed $30,000 by the time they gained LTG.

Travelling those ten flights a year for those next 20 years, this means their LTG benefits will have cost them $150 per flight!!

 

[TonyHancock]

QF LTG was not something I sought, it just sort of came as a result of a fair bit of flying. QFF, when the mASA was in place, was a mighty fine FF program; Simpler and Fairer saw that off.

I was a little nervous about leaving QFF at first and kept a foot in both camps for a year holding P1 and GGL simultaneously. This was a mistake I should have dumped QF immediately, had I done so I would be LTG with BA now rather than having to wait another year or so and keep my fingers crossed BA won't move the goal posts or my flying won't fall off. LTG with BA is something I consider to be very valuable.......although I do wonder whether this will be dumped as more and more qualify.

 

[Matt_01]

I tend to agree with TonyH above. I spent nearly 20 years as as paid up QP member and did not care about SC or LT SC. A change in situation (work) saw me move QF NB to P1 in the space of 12 months. I also travel with VA and SQ and have WP and *G with these programs. I went from stuff all LT SC to LTG within 2-3 years.

Recently @JessicaTam suggested that I make better use of by BA account and go for an alternative. It is a proposition I am considering as her logic made perfect sense.

 

[serfty]

I would be LTG with BA

To be clear for those playing at home, BA lifetime gold is lifetime oneworld Emerald.

 

[Matt_01]

To be clear for those playing at home, BA lifetime gold is lifetime oneworld Emerald.

Thanks, yes I am at home and am aware BA LTG is essentially QF LTP if such a thing existed. And whilst on the topic I am at home while my +1 and daughter are at the first P1 event I could have attended. So I am here posting, at least I am not in a hotel . No offence intended

 

[Flying mermaid]

We gained LTG as a by product of the flying we were doing anyway and I loved Qantas and didn’t want to fly anything else. We only fly F or J and eventually I had to admit Qantas didn’t measure up anymore, especially in F.

So we abandoned Qantas and the whole status thing and just fly internationally what we feel is the best option on that route.

However domestically the life time status has come into its own. Many of the planes out of Canberra are all economy, so the only way we have lounge access is via our status. Of course we could buy a Club membership, but that’s expensive for the amount we would use it.

I am not sure it’s worth paying extra to get LTG, but it depends on your circumstances - for us maintaining status seemed pretty pointless, but for many keeping gold or platinum is worth it.

 

[serfty]

No offence intended

None taken ... I presume while you are at home, playing you are not.

My post was more for those reading not aware of the naunces of BAEC.

 

[Matt_01]

We gained LTG as a by product of the flying we were doing anyway and I loved Qantas and didn’t want to fly anything else. We only fly F or J and eventually I had to admit Qantas didn’t measure up anymore, especially in F.

So we abandoned Qantas and the whole status thing and just fly internationally what we feel is the best option on that route.

However domestically the life time status has come into its own. Many of the planes out of Canberra are all economy, so the only way we have lounge access is via our status. Of course we could buy a Club membership, but that’s expensive for the amount we would use it.

I am not sure it’s worth paying extra to get LTG, but it depends on your circumstances - for us maintaining status seemed pretty pointless, but for many keeping gold or platinum is worth it.

Could not agree more. I am a creature of habit so OW (QF) for myself was the way to go. The 3 main DOM sectors I travel 2 of them have J lounges so that is a plus. Internationally in order are SIN, JP, HK, LAX and NYC and I am quite used to the OW carriers on these routes. Now I have LTG under my belt I am finding that I am using SQ and other *A carriers more often something that I did not foresee.

 

[Aus ATC]

I have started to benefit from LTG - having my work travel (which was largely responsible for me achieving it) curtailed the past 2 years, and little prospect of more work funded trips now.

It is certainly a valuable "perk", and it has influenced our choice of airlines - e.g recently for a Y trip to Europe we chose EK (at a slight cost premium) for the Gold benefits (lounge, extra luggage). It will certainly make Y and PE travel, on any One World airline or Emirates - not wedded to Qantas, more attractive. Though where possible, J travel via points will be preferred....

 

[Stevo.1702]

I guess the true value of LTG won't be known until your very last QF flight....

I'm similar to many where I occasionally fork out more $$ for a QF flight so long as LTG is still a target. Albeit, I'll only fork out more to meet an annual SC target (earn or retain). I'm in my mid 20's and have 4000SC to go before achieving Qantas LTG. I imagine for the foreseeable future I will continue to prioritise QF flying because 100% for work and 95% of personal travel is in Y. Travelling in Y with LTG is where I will see my return on investment.

 

[juddles]

I guess the true value of LTG won't be known until you're very last QF flight. I'm similar where I will occasionally fork out more $$ for a QF flight where LTG is still a target....

You are honest to us and to yourself I suspect that the QF game of enticement does exactly that - it is a very skillful marketing thing to so entice us all to "dig a little deeper" for them

 

[Stevo.1702]

You are honest to us and to yourself I suspect that the QF game of enticement does exactly that - it is a very skillful marketing thing to so entice us all to "dig a little deeper" for them

Sunk Cost Fallacy.

At work, I'm cautioned to avoid it. Personally, I can't accept the notion of defeat.

 

[juddles]

Sunk Cost Fallacy. ...

I get the term. Is there another for expressing the situation where you finally get to a goal, then when get there feel there is nothing left to strive for? (said as P1, already requalified for next year, have LTG, so SC are suddenly completely worthless for all my current travels)

 

[Stevo.1702]

But you couldn't possibly change because then you'd become an entirely new fish in a different pond?
I don't know

I've read forums from those who have changed which airline they credit their flights to for a new target, but to do so without the benefits/recognition of the incumbent is a question I won't have to face for another few years.

 

[juddles]

But you couldn't possibly change because then you'd become an entirely new fish in a different pond?
I don't know

I've read forums from those who have changed which airline they credit their flights to for a new target......

I think (hope?) I have learnt, that status is a mug's game, used by airlines to entice spend. I don't think I will do the usual and concentrate on another program. Instead I will concentrate on learning ever more tricks to REDUCE spend yet accomplish my needs to travel well.

 

[levelnine]

Anyway, if this notional person put that $1000 saved per year into savings, at an interest rate of 4% (not unreasonable over a twenty year time frame), they would have amassed $30,000 by the time they gained LTG.

I really like your rational/mathematic approach to determining the cost of LTG.

However, it raises a question: who is bearing that $30,000 cost for obtaining LTG?

I would guess that there are very, very few people who obtain LTG who are not doing most of that travel for work. (I exclude rich people because you also excluded them in Point 1 of your calculation.)

Thus, the marginal cost of flying Y on QF as opposed to Y on a competitor is generally borne by the employer, not the employee.

I'm inclined to agree with you that there is a considerable cost to obtaining LTG, but only a small part of that cost is borne by the individual. Qantas is essentially leveraging the interests of employees (obtain LTG) to get the employer to spend more (buy tickets on QF rather than a cheaper competitor).

 

[TonyHancock]

I think (hope?) I have learnt, that status is a mug's game, used by airlines to entice spend. I don't think I will do the usual and concentrate on another program. Instead I will concentrate on learning ever more tricks to REDUCE spend yet accomplish my needs to travel well.

I believe that status can be used to the benefit of the frequent flyer......but it does need a bit of "gaming". When the mASA was around the QF program was excellent, the points earn, increased by status, on mASA's and paid fares helped me fund an extra MEL-LHR-MEL a year. It allowed me to keep 6-7 of these trips in J or F, to the AUS$4.5k mark. Once things got "simpler and fairer" the program became pretty much unusable for me.

BA has one of the best FF programs out there. (....So they'll be changing that I suspect!!). I can keep my 8-9 MEL-LHR-MEL, in F, under AUS$4.5k per trip. Status plays a big part in this, as does ex EU fares. Status gave me 10 upgrade vouchers last year which can be used at the time of booking to move up a cabin. I can then use points for OW short haul and a couple of long hauls to reduce costs further.

Obviously one needs to be flying on BA routes to maximise the benefits.

The big "thing" for me is not chasing status, not moving programs to gain lifetime benefits, it is about keeping costs down to a minimum whilst not actually sending myself to an early grave. I also look at and have tried nesting in HKG, BKK and SIN, but BA status and ex EU fares are still "winning" for me hands down.