Six million people a year would use train to Melbourne Airport

I'd define commercial airlines as entities that fly aircraft commercially. I know my definition of public transport may not be generally accepted one - that's why I gave it and specified it as my own.

Sorry for the silly reply, but just reflecting the way this discussion is going. :rolleyes:

Yes, well I left out a word. Fair enough.

It was serious question, however. How do you define airlines as a type of transport. I'd really like to know how they fit given your definition of public transport.
 
Looking at what I currently get for my $13 SkyBus trip (a 10 trip ticket is $130; great if you use it frequently):
  • Dedicated vehicles with plenty of luggage space
  • 10 minute frequency
  • 24 hour operation
  • 20 minute trip most of the time, never taken more than 35 even with a crash on the freeway in peak hour (the SkyBus drivers know all the tricks!)

I reckon we'd be lucky to get all of that in a train. For a start, the trip time would be an issue - trains currently take 21 minutes from Albion to Southern Cross, stopping only at Sunshine, Tottenham, Footscray, and North Melbourne (they'd probably only remove Totty from the airport services). [EDIT: Ugh, what am I saying? There's West and Middle Footscray too - so could probably chop 5 minutes out] Trains are timetabled to take about 20 minutes from Albion to Jacana on the goods line at the moment. So without a lot of money on some big speed upgrades, 30 minutes is probably the best we could hope for. The Metro Tunnel would provide capacity increases but not speed.

As to the other points, they're all doable but rely on quite a lot of money being poured in for it. More money than I think they will put in. So while I'd love to have a train to MEL, I'm skeptical that they'll actually make it worthwhile.
 
Your a bit out of touch with reality if you think airports and public transport don't involve premiums, look at Brisbane or Sydney which has similar fares but a lot closer to the city. Unfortunately both involve a hybrid system where there is no express option to the CBD and use the same rolling stock as metro rail. I think the KLIA express at KUL is what most users would like to see, $10 each way, on board WiFi for free and high frequency and the choice of express or one that stops at some metro stations.

If it was a direct express $16 is a bargain. However It will probably be a hybrid system or a stop at all stations option. If it goes via Albion, it will probably stop somewhere near Keilor, then probably Sunshine, Footscray and North Melbourne and finally Southern Cross. There will probably a slow option to the airport, depending on how many new stations they add to the Albion option.
If they go via the Craigeburn line, they will only stop at the first station on the Craigeburn line, North Melbourne and then Southern Cross.
Considering the difficulty of timetabling an express option via either route, I can only see the slow option being an option at the moment. So if the slow option is the only option then $16 is a bit steep.
In MEL, all forms of public IIRC is subsidised by public coffers.
 
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Yes, well I left out a word. Fair enough.

It was serious question, however. How do you define airlines as a type of transport. I'd really like to know how they fit given your definition of public transport.

OK. Its evening here and I've been luxuriating in watching a replay of "Hockey Night in Canada" (Detroit Vs Chicago, Stanley Cup play-offs) and Don Cherry was talking about Bringing Back the Biff. Well played sir! But now onto the Memorial Cup and the Halifax Mooseheads Vs Swift Current Broncos. Time for another AFF lexiconic excursion. And sorry again, the question may be serious but I'm struggling to take the topic seriously. But to respect your interest, here goes (hoping you aren't quietly taking the pi** :) ).

Like I said, personally, when I think about "public transport" I think of government owned busses and trains, I guess where there would be a government obligation to provide a certain level of service. Melbourne type privately owned trams and trains? Yes, probably "public transport" but meh, don't care much if that's inconsistent or not.

Dunno why, just do. I might say something like "We can get a cab into the city or take public transport."

Planes to me are just planes; aerial transport; flying; even when Qantas & TAA were government owned, I never thought of them as "public transport". The fact that they are available to the public for transport doesn't come into it. For me. And I reckon if you said to some-one "I'm taking public transport from Melbourne to Singapore", you'd get a funny look.

The Defence rests m'lud with a very nice Russian River Zinfandel in hand.
 
OK. Its evening here and I've been luxuriating in watching a replay of "Hockey Night in Canada" (Detroit Vs Chicago, Stanley Cup play-offs) and Don Cherry was talking about Bringing Back the Biff. Well played sir! But now onto the Memorial Cup and the Halifax Mooseheads Vs Swift Current Broncos. Time for another AFF lexiconic excursion. And sorry again, the question may be serious but I'm struggling to take the topic seriously. But to respect your interest, here goes (hoping you aren't quietly taking the pi** :) ).

Like I said, personally, when I think about "public transport" I think of government owned busses and trains, I guess where there would be a government obligation to provide a certain level of service. Melbourne type privately owned trams and trains? Yes, probably "public transport" but meh, don't care much if that's inconsistent or not.

Dunno why, just do. I might say something like "We can get a cab into the city or take public transport."

Planes to me are just planes; aerial transport; flying; even when Qantas & TAA were government owned, I never thought of them as "public transport". The fact that they are available to the public for transport doesn't come into it. For me. And I reckon if you said to some-one "I'm taking public transport from Melbourne to Singapore", you'd get a funny look.

The Defence rests m'lud with a very nice Russian River Zinfandel in hand.

Not taking anything.

Right so a train and bus is public transport and a plane isn't. Ok then.

If I were to ask "and a tram?" - then I'd be taking something.
 
If it was a direct express $16 is a bargain. However It will probably be a hybrid system or a stop at all stations option. If it goes via Albion, it will probably stop somewhere near Keilor, then probably Sunshine, Footscray and North Melbourne and finally Southern Cross. There will probably a slow option to the airport, depending on how many new stations they add to the Albion option.
If they go via the Craigeburn line, they will only stop at the first station on the Craigeburn line, North Melbourne and then Southern Cross.
Considering the difficulty of timetabling an express option via either route, I can only see the slow option being an option at the moment. So if the slow option is the only option then $16 is a bit steep.
In MEL, all forms of public IIRC is subsidised by public coffers.

Here's the link to the Melbourne Airport Rail Link Study under which "an altered Albion East alignment is the recommended alignment for an Airport rail link":
Melbourne Airport Rail Link Study - Public Transport Victoria
 
OK. Its evening here and I've been luxuriating in watching a replay of "Hockey Night in Canada" (Detroit Vs Chicago, Stanley Cup play-offs) and Don Cherry was talking about Bringing Back the Biff. Well played sir! But now onto the Memorial Cup and the Halifax Mooseheads Vs Swift Current Broncos. Time for another AFF lexiconic excursion. And sorry again, the question may be serious but I'm struggling to take the topic seriously. But to respect your interest, here goes (hoping you aren't quietly taking the pi** :) ).
Don't write off the action back home - we even take out the linesmen! Stars @ Ice 19-5-13 - YouTube
 
At $16 for a one-way trip it is too expensive for the number of trips I would do in a year.

I think there are alternate means of travel to/from MEL airport that are cheaper but take a little more time.

In BNE I can get to airport from Central in ~25 minutes and then walk ~500 metres to terminal or I can go to DFO by train and bus and then T-bus outside the terminal and it takes ~60 minutes and costs me nothing.

Nice to have those options available.
 
I use the Skybus in Melb. I can't be bothered queuing for in the taxi line, I think the Skybus is quicker. Well, if you are heading to Spencer St, clearly. But I am, generally. Skybus rocks. In Bris I use the Airtrain, pretty convenient. Taxis aren't too bad there either, really. But I'm over stinky cab drivers. I don't want to put up with their B.O. and their Alan Jones addictions (sorry drivers, I know you have it hard, no insult meant). Oh yeah, I also prefer the train to Syd airport. Well, I drove this morning but seriously it was 5:45 am - I wouldn't bother driving later than 6 due to gridlock. Ahh, the joys.
 
At $16 for a one-way trip it is too expensive for the number of trips I would do in a year.
...
It's actually $17 one-way, $28 two-way and $130 ten-way. (I go through about 2 x ten-ways a year, used to be 5 or 6)

I'll take the PTV Bus / Trains when and when I can (no additional cost on my Zones1&2 myki), but like when I arrived 8:45pm Sunday, really the only option was the Skybus - even then it was 10:30pm before I arrived home (no I won't take a taxi if solo).
 
I use the Skybus in Melb. I can't be bothered queuing for in the taxi line, I think the Skybus is quicker. Well, if you are heading to Spencer St, clearly. But I am, generally. Skybus rocks. In Bris I use the Airtrain, pretty convenient. Taxis aren't too bad there either, really. But I'm over stinky cab drivers. I don't want to put up with their B.O. and their Alan Jones addictions (sorry drivers, I know you have it hard, no insult meant). Oh yeah, I also prefer the train to Syd airport. Well, I drove this morning but seriously it was 5:45 am - I wouldn't bother driving later than 6 due to gridlock. Ahh, the joys.

Skybus in MEL is great - high frequency, clean & quick.
Some of the taxis that I have travelled in MEL are an absolute disgrace.
 
An express train to the airport is a fantasy. Even a spur line is hard to imagine, as the government is giving priority to the east-west freeway link, which it doesn't have money for anyway. The taxi industry would also suffer greatly, which shouldn't be an issue at all, but if you have a look at the blockades over a simple change to the short fare fare system, you would understand why the government would not fancy a city-wide blockade.
 
I'll take the PTV Bus / Trains when and when I can (no additional cost on my Zones1&2 myki), but like when I arrived 8:45pm Sunday, really the only option was the Skybus - even then it was 10:30pm before I arrived home (no I won't take a taxi if solo).
Money saved is more important than time spent for me. Most of my future trips have me arriving in BNE before 6:00pm so I can get the last T-bus of the night to the DFO.

If I arrive late then the preference is Airtrain, ConXion ($20 is expensive), hire car and then taxi. I try to avoid taxis where possible. If I had to spend that much I would make sure I did not have a drink and hire a car and at least get some VS points on the rental.
 
Not taking anything.

Right so a train and bus is public transport and a plane isn't. Ok then.

If I were to ask "and a tram?" - then I'd be taking something.

That would be covered here:

<snip> Melbourne type privately owned trams and trains? Yes, probably "public transport" but meh, don't care much if that's inconsistent or not.
<snip>.

And before you ask:

Tuk tuks - not public transport under the RooFlyer Urban Dictionary
Jeepneys - no, but I'm open to offers
Grandes Taxis (a la north Africa) - awwww, tricky, probably yes
Various metros - yes
Private school busses - no
Calgary cTrain - yes
Those horse-drawn buggies you find in various tourist traps - no
Bass Strait Ferries - yes
Sydney ferries - yes

LA Kings V San Jose Sharks in the hockey tonight. Who's got money on the Sharks?
 
Would be lovely if it happened but I don't think I'll be alive to see it.

Anybody else notice the typo in the diagram above?
 
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Would be lovely if it happened but I don't think I'll be alive to see it.

Anybody else notice the typo in the diagram above?

Doesn't include Footscray (listed as South Yarra) or that Tullamarine airport is actually called Melbourne Airport?
 

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