Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgrades'

[JohnK]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgr...

I would be interested to see how this works.

I don't like the Virgin Australia version as the minimum bid is way too high.

The Sri Lankan Airlines version is quite good. Realistic recommended minimum bid and you can go lower or higher as you wish.

 

[exceladdict]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgrades

Did you notice the [-]spin[/-] marketing from redroo? The bids are for people who don't have enough points to buy a higher class seat either by classic award or classic award upgrade. I'm not familiar with the business award costs on mel-per. But 4000 points and $575 seems expensive when I consider the ADL-SYD route. ADL-SYD is either 24000 points outright for a J classic award, 12000 (IIRC) from economy and 15000 for an upgrade from discount economy. So to bid someone has to have less than 12/15/24000 points. Lets say it is the discount economy upgrade level (not many points, don't fly much, only buy cheapest fare), so less than points 15000. What is the upgrade bid? Say 4000 points as per the example, does that then require biding more than $110? What about if I bid 15000 points, is there a $0 cash amount?

Personally the best approach to this is minimum bid. I'd say ZERO points and minimum cash level. But it looks like the two values are linked.

Edit: just checked my email. minimum of 3000 points. Does that mean a maximum co-pay of $120 on ADL-SYD? I doubt it. But if not that gives qantas an incentive to grant upgrade bids over classic points upgrades.

4000 points + $575 is untasteful to me. Last upgrade I had was 20,000 points. Classic award PER-MEL sits at around 36,000 + $40.

So the $575 equates to 16,000 points, or you're buying points at 3.59 cents each compared to classic award upgrade rates.

But, as mentioned above, it will give Mum and Dad EDR shoppers a chance to have 'enough points for business'. I fear for QFF these will be the people least likely to drop almost $600 on a 3.5 hour flight's upgrade. International will be the key if this is successful. I'd drop $575 and x,000 points on a MEL-LAX in a heartbeat, but if the co-pay is much higher than that it would be too steep for me.

RedRoo, can you confirm if there is any relationship between available seat class(es), at time of bid processing, and likelihood of a bid-upgrade being approved?

 

[cmon0005]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgr...

This looks very similar to the Malaysia Airlines MHUpgrade site even the little gauge looks the same..
Judging by how MH handle it, is how I think QF might handle it, if at a week in advance there are still enough discount business inventory available(I, Z class) then send an invitation to people in certain Y fare classes to bid.

If they just do a blanket invitation to all and sundry for most flights, then I think it will be a bad thing and will cheapen J class experience. My advice to QF is to keep it infrequent(people shouldn't expect this for every flight), to people only booked into non-sale fare classes in Y and don't give away seats for too cheap!

 

[medhead]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgr...

Red Roo are you willing and able to comment about the order of upgrade requests? Previously we were told that there are multiple rounds of checks for classic upgrade requests up until a few hours before the flight. It seems that will not longer be the case. Based on the following information classic award requests a few hours before the flight couldn't be processed before the bid now upgrade requests.

Are you able to clarify the situation with clearance of classic upgrade requests? Does the processing/checking of such requests now end at 24 hours before the flight? Or will checks still be made upto flight time?

From the Qantas website on bid now upgrades: Qantas Upgrades | Qantas

Bid Now Upgrade offers will be considered after requests for Classic Upgrade Rewards^ have been processed and confirmed. Between 24 and 12 hours prior to your scheduled flight departure, we’ll send you an email to let you know whether your upgrade offer has been accepted or not.

 

[opusman]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgrades

I suspect QF are missing the revenue they used to get from the mASA co-pays.

 

[medhead]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgrades

4000 points + $575 is untasteful to me. Last upgrade I had was 20,000 points. Classic award PER-MEL sits at around 36,000 + $40.

So the $575 equates to 16,000 points, or you're buying points at 3.59 cents each compared to classic award upgrade rates.

But, as mentioned above, it will give Mum and Dad EDR shoppers a chance to have 'enough points for business'. I fear for QFF these will be the people least likely to drop almost $600 on a 3.5 hour flight's upgrade. International will be the key if this is successful. I'd drop $575 and x,000 points on a MEL-LAX in a heartbeat, but if the co-pay is much higher than that it would be too steep for me.

RedRoo, can you confirm if there is any relationship between available seat class(es), at time of bid processing, and likelihood of a bid-upgrade being approved?

But for international you'll be looking at, say, 60000* classic upgrade price. So something like $575 + 44000 points. Assuming it works like points plus pay.

* just a number I've made up for illustration purposes.

 

[Rebekkap]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgrades

There's actually been a version of paid upgrades on international flights going on for some time. On several occasions I've received a phone call from Qantas asking if I'd like to upgrade an existing international economy version for a price. In all cases, the price has been higher than I've been willing to pay, but it was definitely happening - I'm assuming at times when Y was full and they were trying to move people for a profit before having to op up.

 

[Supersonic Swinger]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgrades

4000 points + $575 is untasteful to me. Last upgrade I had was 20,000 points. Classic award PER-MEL sits at around 36,000 + $40.

So the $575 equates to 16,000 points, or you're buying points at 3.59 cents each compared to classic award upgrade rates.

But, as mentioned above, it will give Mum and Dad EDR shoppers a chance to have 'enough points for business'.

No doubt there will be pockets of value in the system. But I'm cynical enough about QFF to expect that they have introduced this option to add marginal revenue by weeding out the Mums and Dads who'll occasionally just pay those astronomical rates because they think they're getting a good value upgrade. Marginal revenue = more profit for QF 'Loyalty'.

 

[Quickstatus]

Bid Now upgrades

This will sit below classic points upgrade. I fear it will reduce chances of op up. Not that there are significant opups for anyway.

 

[Quickstatus]

Bid Now upgrades

This will sit below points upgrade but I will assume above operational upgrades

Will be interesting to see the $$$ offered

 

[dmitri]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgrades

Do you still get the points/credits that are relative to the initial ticket purchased or more due to the "plus pay" function?

 

[ReLoad]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgrades

Op Ups were a dying breed as they were anyway, this kills them off even further!

sheesh.

 

[NM]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgrades

I have an abundance of point, but do not have an abundance of $$$. So I only use QFF point for upgrades. If this means reduced access to upgrades or a necessary $$$ co-payment, then my QFF points become of greatly reduced value to me.

So what happens if someone has waitlisted for an international upgrade as a Classic Upgrade Award. Say the cost of 25,000 QFF point for the Classic Upgrade Award. 7 days out from flight and well before the Classic Upgrades have been processed the passenger received an email invitation to bid for an upgrade for the same flight. Hmm, what to bid? If they bid 25,000 point will they also have to include a cash co-payment? So now the QF system knows the same passenger who has requested a Classic award for 25,000 point is also willing to pay 25,000 point plus some $$$, so which one will be the likely successful upgrade path?

Or, before the Classic Awards are actually processed, they may know that they now have a number of other passengers willing to buy their upgrade for say 30,000 points plus a few hundred dollars. How do we know that this "information" is not going to be fed into the systems that determine the availability of Classic Upgrade awards before the upgrade auction awards are determined?

I fear this allows QFF to offer the upgrades to the highest bidder regardless of whether that is a Classic Upgrade Award or an Auction Award. If auction bids are less than Classic Award rate then they go to waitlisted Classic Award, and if auction bids are higher then there may not be any Classic Awards available (waitlists unsuccessful) but some Auction Awards granted at the 24-12 hour mark.

I guess only time and real experiences will confirm the actual operation and any changes to availability of the different types of upgrades provided.

 

[Red Roo]

Re: QF Introduces Upgrade Bidding

There seems to be a few recurring questions around the impact of Bid Now Upgrades on Classic Upgrade Rewards (note the new name . Bid Now Upgrade requests will be processed and confirmed after requests for classic upgrades and classic upgrades are still your best value option with the highest priority. We'll continue to check for classic upgrade requests within 24 hours of departure. There will be no change to the the On Departure Upgrade product and it will still be subject to availabilityThe Bid Now Upgrade FAQs should help you to understand our new upgrade option.

 

[kevrosmith]

Re: QF Introduces Upgrade Bidding

There seems to be a few recurring questions around the impact of Bid Now Upgrades on Classic Upgrade Rewards (note the new name . Bid Now Upgrade requests will be processed and confirmed after requests for classic upgrades and classic upgrades are still your best value option with the highest priority. We'll continue to check for classic upgrade requests within 24 hours of departure. There will be no change to the the On Departure Upgrade product and it will still be subject to availabilityThe Bid Now Upgrade FAQs should help you to understand our new upgrade option.

That sounds somewhat promising to allay some concerns... Sorry though... for some reason I can't quite bring myself to "liking" the statement just yet...

 

[Red Roo]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgrades

We consider a number of factors when evaulating Bid Now Upgrade offers including the points and cash offered.

 

[moa999]

Re: QF Introduces Upgrade Bidding

Will wait and see I guess. I perused the FAQ to see if I could see anything on minimums or examples...

Just this useful Q&A

Question
Is there a minimum amount of money and (if appropriate) Qantas Points required for an upgrade offer?

Answer
Yes. There is a minimum and a maximum amount for each flight segment. Any upgrade offer must be within this range.

 

[BAM1748]

Re: Qantas launches online auction for business class upgrades with 'Bid Now Upgr...

Bidding for upgrades is for schmucks. You will notice the thresholds (reserve) are quite high with most airlines who do this. Perhaps you will be able to bid for an upgrade LAX to Australia whilst on the same flight QF bumps someone else down!

And collects on both. :shock:

 

[Mr_Orange]

Re: QF Introduces Upgrade Bidding

To be frank, the very second QF are asking me for more $$$ on top of points for an upgrade, then I had better earn points and SCs at J levels too.

For a points only upgrade, I am more than happy to accept that I get the J experience but Y 'rewards' but it is a different story when cold, hard cash is involved.

I'll be sticking with traditional points upgrades.

 

[CaptJCool]

Re: QF Introduces Upgrade Bidding

I'm sure there will be some ODU because of No Shows, people missing flights, and late cancellation / changes by business people the day before or upto the flight time (remembering many of these bookings are "full" fare and enable 'free' cancellation) And of course, there will be over-bookings of lower cabins facilitating some movement, and in the Altea system automated upgrades for service recovery too, plus when no-one is willing to exchange points for upgrades, the overall customer value profile is used to assess who gets granted the 'freebie'.

As a point of note; the at the gate upgrades for points appears to have been introduced because of concerns about people including on these discussion boards saying "why are there empty seats in the cabin for which I had made a points upgrade request which was not granted?" So the airline was responsive to this circumstance.

Price is what you pay, value is what you get
So from what I can tell, Bid Now is an endeavour to use a classic marketing ploy - it's like foxtel, (having paid the base subscription, they offer you some extra channels for an additional price) After all, the point of the offer is to price optimise and fill an empty seat for a fee rather than have it sit empty or give it away for free, and there's a set of people who having paid the base price, would pay more ("milk more money from them" "oh, look, now you've paid that much, its only a bit more and look at all the extra value you will get" - and if the base is paid by a 3rd party eg your employer, is it really going to break your bank to pay for the extra benefits (not including Chaffeur Drive nor no guarantee of a meal) for a 'relatively' small additional price?

The point of the process, is to get us to self-service price set based on our perception of the value offering rather than the points values QF have placed on Classic Award upgrades

The comment about the wheel, - I suspect if Malaysian and Qantas sit within the Amadeus Altea 'camp' that its actually a feature of that product, something i commented upon in a posting the Operational Upgrade thread..

What i would suggest is a new thread here that talks about successful or not bids - QF have set the minimum floor limits so it would be beneficial to know what ceiling limits $/points members ought be bidding for the privilege based on rational behaviour - eg, if you paid 'x' to start with, then you would not pay more than 'y' to obtain an upgrade (ie somewhat less than the current classic awards points because otherwise "you may as well just ask for the classic") recognising no-one wants to irrationally pay more than they need but we all know how out of control auctions can get in the bidding process...