My Story with Singapore Airlines

[Al_]

Sorry not to sound sympathetic however this sounds very strange. These kind of arguments/altercations between travellers and airport staff happen every day, at every airport around the world. I travel, say, 20+ times a year all over the world and I either experience or witness similar incidents to your's multiple times each trip. You just have to watch one of those UK airline shows on TV to see people get into screaming matches with each other.

To want to cancel your trip and want to visit a GP because of this sounds nothing short of bizarre to me. You are either extremely mentally fragile or some key detail of this story is missing.

Screaming match! I am glad that I live in Perh. During my time in the UK never once I witnessed such a thing like a screaming match at the airport. The TV show about the airport is a TV show. It would have been boring if they show you the normal interactions. It is not the norm neither it should be to have screaming match at airports whether it is at Heathrow or Perth.

What one sees as bizarre, other might see as normal. I am not mentally fragile, and Singapore Airlines should respond to customers' complaints so that at least the other side of the story is known. But to put false statement on the computer system and say that I did not board voluntarily is bizarre.

 

[Al_]

Just to be clear.

You arrive at check in with overweight bags an hour before departure at 6.40 am?
Did you realise Singapore require you to check in with bags 2.5 hours before departure?

At about 6:40 AM I was already checked-in i.e. luggage taken, boarding passes and passport in hand.

Once checked in you sit down and wait for your wife to go back to the car park. (How long did this take?)

For about 10 minutes

At 7.00am (now 40 mins before departure and Singapore's closing time for flights) you go back to the desk and enquire about cancelling, is that right?

Why not?

Did you realise the flight would have been closed at this stage? Di they tell you the flight was closed?

No I didn't, and the flight was not closed at this stage; they closed the flight as I was discussing whether my ticker can be refunded or not

Now the bit I am not sure of ,you variously say "to my surprise", "whilst discussing my bags suddenly appeared" and " i heard my luggage on standby and located and brought to the counter in a minute or two" in relation to the bags, which was it exactly?

Whilst discussing I heard that my luggage was on stand-by; I didn't pay attention as I don't understand what this means anyway; then within the minute whilst I was still discussing with the lady, to my surprise, my luggage appeared.

At 7.03 am (37 mins before the flight) your tags were removed.

Yes; about then it might have been a few minutes earlier. I know that I went to inquire about the cancellation a minute orm two before 7:00 AM and very thing happened so quickly.

The timing you set out above suggests to me you were cutting things very fine but putting that to one side what I dont get is why did the bags appear suddenly if you hadn't indicated you didn't want to fly? Why were they located?

I have no idea; I was surprised to see my bag brought to the counter so quickly whilst I was still trying to get information regarding whether my ticket can be refunded and the process! When I heard that my bag was on stand-by, I thought stand-by to be loaded. I still don't understand the term.

Also you said the supervisor planned the situation, how could he anticipate your decision to enquire about cancellation? Once tagged and you had your BP what could he have done to anticipate your decision?

I believe that he planned the situation after I went to the counter to make my enquiry (not before hand) as he closed the flight immediately after he ripped off the tag from the handle of my bag.

I find this very confusing.

Indeed; me too!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Something not adding up here. One hour before departure and the passenger has only just completed check-in. There is also a dispute about weight.

40 minutes prior to departure, the passenger is STILL in the departures hall and has not completed immigration and security.

The flight would have been boarding in 10 minutes.

Perhaps the bags were on stand-by because the check-in staff were waiting for the passenger to make up their mind about what they were doing? Or because there were fees outstanding for excess weight?

Very odd that for 10 kioos additional weight, the passenger would have been willing to upgrade to a business class fare, the difference of some $2000-$4000 I'm guessing, per passenger? For an extra 10 kilos? Doesn't sound right.

The whole timing thing has me concerned, and i think the bags were held back for that reason. Even if the passenger was waiting for his family to come from the car park, just 40 minutes prior to departure, it would be right and correct for the airline to hold the bags - no point sending them down and then having to off load them as a no show.

I think the OP may have been asked to go away and consider whether they wanted to fly or not, and that is why bags remained. by 40 minutes it was all too late to enquire about the cancellation of the ticket so the passenger was simply off loaded.

(sorry if this has already been covered but the thread is growing faster than I can read it!!)

edited - true to form i just see walter82 has covered a lot of these issues!!

 

[walter82]

Something not adding up here. One hour before departure and the passenger has only just completed check-in. There is also a dispute about weight.

40 minutes prior to departure, the passenger is STILL in the departures hall and has not completed immigration and security.

The flight would have been boarding in 10 minutes.

Perhaps the bags were on stand-by because the check-in staff were waiting for the passenger to make up their mind about what they were doing? Or because there were fees outstanding for excess weight?

Very odd that for 10 kioos additional weight, the passenger would have been willing to upgrade to a business class fare, the difference of some $2000-$4000 I'm guessing, per passenger? For an extra 10 kilos? Doesn't sound right.

The whole timing thing has me concerned, and i think the bags were held back for that reason. Even if the passenger was waiting for his family to come from the car park, just 40 minutes prior to departure, it would be right and correct for the airline to hold the bags - no point sending them down and then having to off load them as a no show.

I think the OP may have been asked to go away and consider whether they wanted to fly or not, and that is why bags remained. by 40 minutes it was all too late to enquire about the cancellation of the ticket so the passenger was simply off loaded.

(sorry if this has already been covered but the thread is growing faster than I can read it!!)

I think its very straightforward from his account and without entering the rights or wrongs of the debate he was having:

By the time he got back to the counter the flight had just closed.
The flight is a 7.40 departure which would be about 7.10 boarding call.

Discussion was going on (even if that lasted a few minutues) so they decided he would not make the flight without it being held up. Thus he was denied boarding.

 

[Al_]

I think its very straightforward from his account and without entering the rights or wrongs of the debate he was having:

By the time he got back to the counter the flight had just closed.
The flight is a 7.40 departure which would be about 7.10 boarding call.

Discussion was going on (even if that lasted a few minutues) so they decided he would not make the flight without it being held up. Thus he was denied boarding.

By the time I went back to the counter the flight was not closed.

I was already checked-in.

A result of my inquiry I was denied boarding.

There was at least 40 minutes left; so the flight would not have been held up. The flight was not closed.

Has the Supervisor been capable enough to deal with this matter professionally, and with due customer care, then there would not have been an issue.

 

[munitalP]

Hi Al

good debate for your first posts.

a question - what was your aggression level like when after stewing on your percieved treatment you went back to the SQ desk clearly with conflict in mind?

was the reason you didn't board because you perhaps seemed to agressive, angry, threatening to be "allowed" to board?

from reading between the lines, I cannot understand how this situation could have eventuated. As stated by others, there are always 2 sides to a story, and I wonder if the other side would clarify a number of points that don't gel such as:

Timing
Bags
and from me - why you didn't distribute the excess in your familys cases...

thanks for the entertaining thread - a touch of extrapolation existing methinks


munitalP

 

[RB]

I am wondering if the Op can please explain why there is a need to use the terms "prejudice" and "despotic"?-perhaps that would help me understand things better

 

[albatross710]

Has the Supervisor been capable enough to deal with this matter professionally, and with due customer care, then there would not have been an issue.

Which airline are you flying out with today?

 

[mannej]

MunitalP, I think that he was traveling alone.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

By the time I went back to the counter the flight was not closed.

I was already checked-in.

A result of my inquiry I was denied boarding.

There was at least 40 minutes left; so the flight would not have been held up. The flight was not closed.

Has the Supervisor been capable enough to deal with this matter professionally, and with due customer care, then there would not have been an issue.

'Flight closed' does not mean that the flight has left, or that the doors have closed. It means that the flight has closed for passenger check-in. This is because essential paperwork, weight and balance and fuel need to be added.

Flights can be 'opened' but not usually without good reason (and you trying to decide if you wanted to cancel is not good reason).

I think latest check-in time for SQ international would be 60 mins for all classes. There is some discretion with that, and that is held by the airport manager.

If you have not proceeded through passport control and security, and were still waiting for your family to come from the car park just 40 mins prior I would agree you were out of time.

It is not easy for check-in staff, or indeed any other staff (including reservations) to be able to determine the conditions on your ticket in just a few seconds. They would have to look up the fare rules and that could take several minutes, even for highly professional call centre staff.

There MUST have been some reason why your bags were still marked stand-by, perhaps you said you were waiting for your wife to come from the car park?

 

[walter82]

By the time I went back to the counter the flight was not closed.

I was already checked-in.

A result of my inquiry I was denied boarding.

There was at least 40 minutes left; so the flight would not have been held up. The flight was not closed.

Has the Supervisor been capable enough to deal with this matter professionally, and with due customer care, then there would not have been an issue.

All i am saying is at 40 mins or less the flight is normally closed. My documentation from Singapore states check in closes 40 mins before depature.

Above you said: 'I remember the time well because I looked up my watch and it was 7:00 AM when I decided to go back to the check-in counter.'
So there was clearly less than 40 mins left by the time you got to the counter and made your enquiry.

My point is ignoring whatever debate or decision making was going on time is likely to have been an important factor in the denied boarding.
People are often denied boarding when they are checked in and have a Boarding pass for example if they arrrive at the gate too late.

Clearly you are upset and have a perception about the supervisor but time was against you as you still had to clear immigration and security.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

MunitalP, I think that he was traveling alone.

I thought the son was travelling - but this happened at check-in - the son happened to be there.

Note also that Al says he was 1.5 kilos over the maximum allowable weight (bolding mine) which to me means he was at 33.5 kilos (the max allowed weight for any bag being 32kgs in Oz). This would mean a reduction of some 10 kilos in weight for the bag (not impossible with heavy gifts). (SQ would not charge for 1.5 kilos of baggage on its own...)

Again, i think there must have been some reason to place the bags on standby, because why would the family go to the car park when your flight was due to leave in an hour, and you would have to go through passport control almost immediately???? I think the OP might have said they were going to consider their options and the bag was held accordingly until the OP advised.

 

[Al_]

Hi Al

good debate for your first posts.

a question - what was your aggression level like when after stewing on your percieved treatment you went back to the SQ desk clearly with conflict in mind?

Very upset but not rude.

was the reason you didn't board because you perhaps seemed to agressive, angry, threatening to be "allowed" to board?

Not at all; the reason communicated to the TA: boarding was self voluntary as the customer had refused to pay excess baggage at initial check in, which is totally untrue as I was already checked in.

from reading between the lines, I cannot understand how this situation could have eventuated. As stated by others, there are always 2 sides to a story, and I wonder if the other side would clarify a number of points that don't gel such as:

Timing
Bags
and from me - why you didn't distribute the excess in your familys cases...

I am still waiting on response from the SQ regarding my complaint so that we may hear the other side of the story. However, I fear that with the seemingly total absence of consumer protection, the airliner may simply treat my complaint and request with total disregard, as they treated me at the airport.

It was only me travelling.

thanks for the entertaining thread - a touch of extrapolation existing methinks
munitalP

Glad you are enjoying it - Yesterday it was me, tomorrow it could be anyone else

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Not at all; the reason communicated to the TA: boarding was self voluntary as the customer had refused to pay excess baggage at initial check in, which is totally untrue as I was already checked in.


Glad you are enjoying it - Yesterday it was me, tomorrow it could be anyone else

There you have the answer as to why the bags were on stand-by.

Your check-in was conditional upon the payment of excess baggage.

If you had gone through to gate without paying the charge your boardinng pass would have been rejected.

It is not uncommon for airlines to issue boarding passes before you have paid excess. Last time this happened to me the agent printed the card BUT said I could not get them till I had paid the fee at the ticket desk (which was all of $12 for 5 kilos so no worries)

 

[Alanslegal]

I enquired about cancellation because I was mistreated by the Supervisor, and should my ticket be refundable, I would rather pay more to another airliner, and not be treated with disrespect.

im only going to read upto here but the supervisor treated you poorly and you wanted to not fly??? omg!

should have just flown, get over the 5 minutes of alleged mistrearment, and if you still felt the need to complain or even attempt an monetary compensation .... just complete a credit card chargeback and see if its successful.

 

[Jobu]

AL, I am not surprised at all by your experience, which is nothing short of disgusting. I have experienced very similar treatment from Singapore Airlines a number of years ago, and have never flown them again. They gave me one of the worst customer service experiences I have ever had, and if i were you, I would not waste time with the state manager in WA, if it is still the same guy he is just as useless as the supervisor you described.Good luck with the refund.

 

[Al_]

I thought the son was travelling - but this happened at check-in - the son happened to be there.

Note also that Al says he was 1.5 kilos over the maximum allowable weight (bolding mine) which to me means he was at 33.5 kilos (the max allowed weight for any bag being 32kgs in Oz). This would mean a reduction of some 10 kilos in weight for the bag (not impossible with heavy gifts). (SQ would not charge for 1.5 kilos of baggage on its own...)

No mate, my baggage was 28.5 kg. I had to bring it down to 27 kg.

Again, i think there must have been some reason to place the bags on standby, because why would the family go to the car park when your flight was due to leave in an hour, and you would have to go through passport control almost immediately???? I think the OP might have said they were going to consider their options and the bag was held accordingly until the OP advised.

Mate, I don't even know what it means to place a baggage on stand-by. My family was not travelling with me. They went to the car park to put the stuff that I could not take with me in the car, as I didn't want to pay $40/kg for excess luggage.

I think my bag might not have made it to its final destination on that day!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

No mate, my baggage was 28.5 kg. I had to bring it down to 27 kg.



Mate, I don't even know what it means to place a baggage on stand-by. My family was not travelling with me. They went to the car park to put the stuff that I could not take with me in the car, as I didn't want to pay $40/kg for excess luggage.

I think my bag might not have made it to its final destination on that day!

Ok still at 27 kilos I am guessing, most likely, there would have been some charge?

Bag on stand-by means the bag is 'standing-by' (waiting) until such time as it is processed.

They might not have used those exact words to you, but the outcome is the same. If they had said to you, 'you cannot fly until you have paid $xx' then the bags would have been placed just behind the check-in counters and not sent down to the baggage area underneath check-in. This is how they were able to retrieve them so quickly, because they would have been right there.

If this happened 1 hour before departure, you would have been expected to proceed through passport control immediately to make your flight in time for boarding. This is why it doesn't make sense, at the moment, that your family left you to go to the car to return the overweight items, unless they were planning to leave?

If you were expected to go through to passport control immedately, the normal course of action would be for you to say good bye to your family there and then, and then they leave with the goods to the car.

 

[Al_]

AL, I am not surprised at all by your experience, which is nothing short of disgusting. I have experienced very similar treatment from Singapore Airlines a number of years ago, and have never flown them again. They gave me one of the worst customer service experiences I have ever had, and if i were you, I would not waste time with the state manager in WA, if it is still the same guy he is just as useless as the supervisor you described.Good luck with the refund.

I am sorry to hear about your experience with Singapore Airlines. Basically, customer service is not legislated or regulated in WA. Consumers cannot get any assistance with complaints regarding poor customer service or bad manners. Also what sounds like black comedy, the trader and airline are under no obligation to bring conditions on the ticket to your notice. Basically, the airliner may simply do whatever they want with impunity. The customer is always right is shred of the past. As you might have noticed from this thread, the matter is not as simple to prove in a court of law, and I could end up losing the case because of claimed 2 minutes delay! SQ Supervisor already put a false statement on their system. Do they have time stamps; will they use it for my benefit, or do whatever it takes to cover themselves!

As the clock is ticking and I have to travel, I paid $150 penalty for changing the travel date. This will be claimed when I get back, and if not refunded, I will take it further.

In closing, I will never fly Singapore Airlines again.

 

[Al_]

Ok still at 27 kilos I am guessing, most likely, there would have been some charge?

There was no charge required - This is the max allowable without having to pay; the gentleman who checked me in was kind enough to facilitate it.

Bag on stand-by means the bag is 'standing-by' (waiting) until such time as it is processed.

Now I understand, and this firm my belief that my baggage might have not made it to its final destination i.e. a possible cunning plan.

They might not have used those exact words to you, but the outcome is the same. If they had said to you, 'you cannot fly until you have paid $xx' then the bags would have been placed just behind the check-in counters and not sent down to the baggage area underneath check-in. This is how they were able to retrieve them so quickly, because they would have been right there.

That was not the case and I was not told any of this; check in was complete and I had the passport and boarding cards. I was asked to proceed to passport control and so forth.

If this happened 1 hour before departure, you would have been expected to proceed through passport control immediately to make your flight in time for boarding. This is why it doesn't make sense, at the moment, that your family left you to go to the car to return the overweight items, unless they were planning to leave?

If you were expected to go through to passport control immedately, the normal course of action would be for you to say good bye to your family there and then, and then they leave with the goods to the car.

There was time left; and the 1st call to go to the gate was called when I was heading to the check-in desk for my inquiry. There was plenty of time left.