General COVID-19 Vaccine Discussion

[JohnK]

I had a sniffle and a raised temp for 24 hours. Not even a bad cold. See? It affects people differently which is why one size fits all is not only ineffective but it is damaging. Individuals are best placed to decide what is best for them.

People do not have a clue of what's best for them. And Telegram is not the place to validate warped thoughts.

Everyone can criticise me and ridicule me all they like. Individuals should not be allowed to make choices that can affect the health of others. Just because we've been doing something for over 100 years does not make it right.

I've been back in Brisbane 8 days and I'm just stunned with the lack of mask usage. The looks I get make me feel like I'm the lepper for wearing a mask. They said this was not going to happen. Sheer stupidity.

Why have shopping centre taken down signs of no passing on travellators and escalators? No one needs to be that close to me. Good luck if you think you'll get past me.

 

[mviy]

Individuals should not be allowed to make choices that can affect the health of others.

One could use that point to say that seeing people wearing masks reminds one of lockdowns and all that happened then, which is triggering. It would be better for people's mental health to not allow masks to be worn anymore except in some especially high risk settings like hospitals and aged care.

We allow people to get drunk and to smoke. This affects others even if not directly. A lot of domestic violence, car accidents etc. is connected to excessive drinking. As a non-smoker I don't like standing next to someone smoking.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

One could use that point to say that seeing people wearing masks reminds one of lockdowns and all that happened then, which is triggering. It would be better for people's mental health to not allow masks to be worn anymore except in some especially high risk settings like hospitals and aged care.

We allow people to get drunk and to smoke. This affects others even if not directly. A lot of domestic violence, car accidents etc. is connected to excessive drinking. As a non-smoker I don't like standing next to someone smoking.

Those people ‘triggered’ has better not go to a hospital or anywhere in Asia!

unfortunately mask wearing has become politicised. Surgeons wear masks in the operating room so they don’t pass on infections to their patients. So we know masks can be effective. Perhaps a little less effective outside the operating room but even if one cancer-screening technician is stopped from catching covid by an infected person wearing a mask that will mean more early detections!

There seem quite a few people who don’t understand how masks can be effective, or they simply don’t care.

 

[sjk]

There seem quite a few people who don’t understand how masks can be effective, or they simply don’t care.

Also the odd person who doesn’t understand that beyond a certain point, allowing people to develop naturally conferred immunity may actually be better for the population as a whole.

Or they simply don’t care, selfish though that may be.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Also the odd person who doesn’t understand that beyond a certain point, allowing people to develop naturally conferred immunity may actually be better for the population as a whole.

Or they simply don’t care, selfish though that may be.

I’m not sure it is for the individual to decide that they want *another person* to get covid so that other person can develop immunity?

If a person doesn’t want to wear a mask because they’re happy to get covid, that’s fine. But a little understanding that by wearing a mask they might not pass it on to others would be better And a yearly vaccination or whatever so we can keep people out of hospital!

 

[drron]

I’m not sure it is for the individual to decide that they want *another person* to get covid so that other person can develop immunity?

If a person doesn’t want to wear a mask because they’re happy to get covid, that’s fine. But a little understanding that by wearing a mask they might not pass it on to others would be better And a yearly vaccination or whatever so we can keep people out of hospital!

So some people do not understand that wearing a surgical mask does not stop you from getting covid.

 

[N860CR]

Everyone can criticise me and ridicule me all they like. Individuals should not be allowed to make choices that can affect the health of others. Just because we've been doing something for over 100 years does not make it right.

So wearing masks (as we all did this time last year, and look how that went) and not passing you on the elevator fixes everything. Right

Those people ‘triggered’ has better not go to a hospital or anywhere in Asia!

They’re designed for single use in hospitals, and I’m unsure why we are all of a sudden holding Asia up as the be all and end all of logic.

And a yearly vaccination or whatever so we can keep people out of hospital!

So masks forever. And vaccinations every year. Last I checked, people are being kept out of hospital. That’s with nobody wearing masks. Yet you still think that’ll fix everything.

And the rest of us are the crazy ones

 

[mrsterryn]

I thought at some stage people in thirties and forties (even those vaccinated) were being the hardest hit , notwithstanding other people with health issues, when getting covid multiple times ?
Son just recently got covid for the second time. It hit him hard for a few days
Just a curiosity question

 

[mviy]

I thought at some stage people in thirties and forties (even those vaccinated) were being the hardest hit , notwithstanding other people with health issues, when getting covid multiple times ?
Son just recently got covid for the second time. It hit him hard for a few days
Just a curiosity question

Did he end up in hospital let alone in ICU? The vaccines are meant to stop serious illness and death, not catching COVID-19.

 

[stm1sydney]

People do not have a clue of what's best for them. And Telegram is not the place to validate warped thoughts.

Everyone can criticise me and ridicule me all they like. Individuals should not be allowed to make choices that can affect the health of others. Just because we've been doing something for over 100 years does not make it right.

I've been back in Brisbane 8 days and I'm just stunned with the lack of mask usage. The looks I get make me feel like I'm the lepper for wearing a mask. They said this was not going to happen. Sheer stupidity.

Why have shopping centre taken down signs of no passing on travellators and escalators? No one needs to be that close to me. Good luck if you think you'll get past me.

Maybe that's the difference between you and me. I generally have a high opinion of people.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

So some people do not understand that wearing a surgical mask does not stop you from getting covid.

That’s right. Wearing a surgical mask is most effective to stop an infected person passing covid on.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

They’re designed for single use in hospitals, and I’m unsure why we are all of a sudden holding Asia up as the be all and end all of logic.

I think the comment that people seeing other wearing masks might trigger memories of lockdown and be detrimental to their mental health. If seeing someone in a mask is triggering, those people are going to have a hard time going to a hospital, a medical practice, or travelling to parts of Asia.

 

[mrsterryn]

Did he end up in hospital let alone in ICU? The vaccines are meant to stop serious illness and death, not catching COVID-19.

Oh no I realise the vaccination to reduce not eradicate it
I was actually just wondering if there was an correlation between age and impact

Nope didn't end up in hospital , thank goodness

 

[JohnM]

I was actually just wondering if there was an correlation between age and impact

Correlation, yes - but then age is highly confounded with comorbitities.

 

[mrsterryn]

Correlation, yes - but then age is highly confounded with comorbitities.

Unlike his mother he is fairly healthy
Anyhoo was just curious
He is finally negative as of today on both RAT and PCR

 

[drron]

That’s right. Wearing a surgical mask is most effective to stop an infected person passing covid on.

And just how is that going in China?
Masks,isolation and lockdowns and still not under control after 3 years.

China's COVID infections hit record as economic outlook darkens

China reported record high COVID-19 infections on Thursday, with cities nationwide imposing localised lockdowns, mass testing and other curbs that are fuelling frustration and darkening the outlook for the world's second largest economy.

www.reuters.com

Japan along with Taiwan are the most compliant in wearing masks. Taiwan as they were hit with the original SARS. Japan because it is what they do.
Japan. well they haven't done so well this year.


Neither has Taiwan.


And in comparison Australia doesn't look that bad without masks.


What you say was fine back at the beginning of the pandemic. Omicron has changed the game dramatically.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

And just how is that going in China?
Masks,isolation and lockdowns and still not under control after 3 years.

China's COVID infections hit record as economic outlook darkens

China reported record high COVID-19 infections on Thursday, with cities nationwide imposing localised lockdowns, mass testing and other curbs that are fuelling frustration and darkening the outlook for the world's second largest economy.

www.reuters.com

Japan along with Taiwan are the most compliant in wearing masks. Taiwan as they were hit with the original SARS. Japan because it is what they do.
Japan. well they haven't done so well this year.
View attachment 308569

Neither has Taiwan.
View attachment 308570

And in comparison Australia doesn't look that bad without masks.
View attachment 308571

What you say was fine back at the beginning of the pandemic. Omicron has changed the game dramatically.

Wearing masks isn’t 100% effective, nor has anyone claimed it to be. But either is wearing a seat belt in a car.

I know you want a 100% guarantee that wearing a mask will prevent you giving covid to someone else, but I don’t think that’s realistic.

 

[drron]

Wearing masks isn’t 100% effective, nor has anyone claimed it to be. But either is wearing a seat belt in a car.

I know you want a 100% guarantee that wearing a mask will prevent you giving covid to someone else, but I don’t think that’s realistic.

The point of my post isn't that is not 100% effective but that it is totally ineffective in those populations.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

The point of my post isn't that is not 100% effective but that it is totally ineffective in those populations.

I’m not seeing the evidence to show they are 100% ineffective. You’d need one part of the population to be wearing masks and the other not to, in order to do a comparison.

 

[drron]

And the Danish study did just that with people in a house with a positive covid patient. I have posted that a few times already.
conclusion at very most a 1-2% reduction but at worst a 2-5% increase in positive cases in the mask wearers.

Also look at the figures I posted. Australia's case load was highest in the beginning of 2022 when mask wearing was still a thing. As the numbers wearing masks has dropped the incidence of cases has also dropped.
Then look at the Japan and Taiwan figures. An increase in cases in the last few months despite way higher mask wearing rates than australia.

What was science with alpha and beta variants is no longer relevant in the Omicron era.
Now variants XBB and BQ.1 are taking over from B4 and B5. Which means that it is very probable that they are better at evading the bodies immune system than previous variants. this includes immunity from vaccines or previous infection.
The WHO is concerned.

We note these two sublineages remain part of Omicron, which is a variant of concern with very high reinfection and vaccination breakthrough potential, and surges in new infections should be handled accordingly.

TAG-VE statement on Omicron sublineages BQ.1 and XBB

As part of its ongoing work to track variants, WHO's Technical Advisory Group on SARS-CoV-2 Virus Evolution (TAG-VE) met on the 24 October 2022 to discuss the latest evidence on the Omicron variant of concern, and how its evolution is currently unfolding, in light of high levels of population...

www.who.int