Circling above the fog - MELMEL

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rpmsol

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Today was my first experience of leaving Melbourne to circle above Syd for an hour before returning to MEL. (With pushback 2 minutes early I was mentally ready for an early arrival!!) Called it quits and exited the flight as I had missed my onsite meetings for the day.

At least I got SCs and a rescheduled flight for another day. (Will they take the SCs off me?)

How often does this happen?
 
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Commuter

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If they did take the SC off you, that would be a bit mean. I know it's not the airline's fault that Australian airports aren't decently equipped enough to handle the weather (don't get me started on poorly equipped airports...), it should still be recognised the inconvenience their passengers suffered.

P.S. My flight in the evening was delayed for 2 hours as a knock-on effect of the Sydney fog.
 

Dave Noble

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No reason for them to remove them; 10SCs are earned on flights of zero to 600 miles. MEL-MEL is zero miles so should get 10Scs

Dave
 

Kiwi Flyer

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Dave Noble said:
No reason for them to remove them; 10SCs are earned on flights of zero to 600 miles. MEL-MEL is zero miles so should get 10Scs

Dave

The OP was ticketed for MEL-SYD and didn't fly it (not due to reasons within airline control) so no miles and no SCs in theory.
 

rpmsol

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Actually, by the time I got into the QC and made the 90 minutes of calls I needed to make, I checked my activity online and saw the 20SCs there already, as I had boarded 5 hours earlier. (K class = 20SC)

Still keen to know if fog affects many flights in this way.

Regards,
Paul.
 

Dave Noble

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Kiwi Flyer said:
The OP was ticketed for MEL-SYD and didn't fly it (not due to reasons within airline control) so no miles and no SCs in theory.

but he did fly MEL-MEL on the same flight which was a normal commercial service of distance zero miles

Dave
 

NM

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Dave Noble said:
but he did fly MEL-MEL on the same flight which was a normal commercial service of distance zero miles

Dave
but it certainly was not a scheduled service! So can it really called a "normal commercial service"? I hope this is not normal :p.
 

Dave Noble

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NM said:
but it certainly was not a scheduled service! So can it really called a "normal commercial service"? I hope this is not normal

I don't think it was a charter flight

Dave
 

dajop

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On the arrivals info for SYD on Thu it would have said:

QF404Melbourne 07:50 09:35 Routed via Melbourne
QF408Melbourne 08:20 10:18 Routed via Melbourne
etc...
 

rpmsol

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dajop said:
QF404Melbourne 07:50 09:35 Routed via Melbourne
etc...

This means that I removed my self from the flight part way through the journey, i.e. started the flight but did not complete the flight. I didn't notice when my flight actually departed a second time, but around 12 noon, the boarding call was made for MEL-SYD 7am service - QF408.

I was asked to join a very long line at gate 5 to be 'checked off' the flight, which I was told would also remove me from the QF445 (that I had a boarding pass for) later that day.

btw: I got an SMS at 13:05 telling me that QF445 (15:30) was cancelled and a call from Qantas after that asking me if I would like to be put on the 16:30. I explained that I did not avtually make it to SYD.

My re-issued booking for a future date has 3 flights on it rather than 2, with the first being 23/6/06 QF404 MELSYD greyed out.

So the system seems to have considered that I really did the flight, even though I 'jumped of'.

I wonder if you get the SCs and points by putting your boarding pass through that little machine just before you get on the plane?
 

markis10

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rpmsol said:
Still keen to know if fog affects many flights in this way.

Regards,
Paul.

Just ask any airline passenger in Australia over the last few days if fog affects flights LOL! I came into Sydney on BA15 on Friday at 5.15 and could see the fog over the shipping terminal but none at the airport, that changed dramatically once the sun came up at 6 when a pea souper set in. I was on a 9PM flight home that night and when I got back to the terminal at 7 it was a mess, the QP was packed and some 2PM flights were being called for boarding! My flight finally took off at 11:15 PM ( I ended up being on the first plane in and last plane out for the day).

In Australia there are no airports capable of really low vis landing (autoland) and departing aicraft need a minimum of 500m RVR (runway visual range) to take off, the actual minima can be found here: http://www.comlaw.gov.au/ComLaw/Legislation/LegislativeInstrument1.nsf/0/0D31072B747D5612CA256FFC002A9A3F?OpenDocument .

Airlines based in Australia actually need an exemption from this law to operate overseas on reduced minima down to 150m for take off and 100m for landing using a Cat 3B ILS.

Fog was the main factor in the Teneriffe disaster, which was was the biggest disaster involving aircraft until Sept 11 in terms of lives, with some 569 souls lost.
 

Dave Noble

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markis10 said:
Fog was the main factor in the Teneriffe disaster, which was was the biggest disaster involving aircraft until Sept 11 in terms of lives, with some 569 souls lost.

I would suggest that the main factor was a KLM pilot deciding to take off without having clearance to do so.

Dave
 

serfty

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You should get the 1000 ff points thanks to the minimum Guarantee...
 

Commuter

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Dave Noble said:
I would suggest that the main factor was a KLM pilot deciding to take off without having clearance to do so.

Dave

I agree. Fog was a "latent" factor/failure in it.
 

oz_mark

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rpmsol said:
I wonder if you get the SCs and points by putting your boarding pass through that little machine just before you get on the plane?

I don't know how they actually determine the point at which you get credited the SC's (i.e. what triggers the SC's to be credited) but I know that it is not done at this point
 

markis10

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Commuter said:
I agree. Fog was a "latent" factor/failure in it.

Mind you, he would have seen the Pan AM flight if there was no fog, and the clipper would have been off the runway as well if it did not miss the taxiway it was told to take in the fog. As with many accidents there is never one factor to account for the failure! They also had to build a new airport due to the frequent fog there.
 

Dave Noble

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markis10 said:
Mind you, he would have seen the Pan AM flight if there was no fog, and the clipper would have been off the runway as well if it did not miss the taxiway it was told to take in the fog. As with many accidents there is never one factor to account for the failure! They also had to build a new airport due to the frequent fog there.

They did build another airport (TFS) but TFN still operates commercial flights. I thought the main reason for TFS was so that they'd have a nice spangly airport near the main resorts for the bucket n spade brigade

If there had been no fog he may have not taken it on himself to take off, however the same accident would/could have occurred if the same take off acctions were taken

Dave
 

bigjobs

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Dave Noble said:
They did build another airport (TFS) but TFN still operates commercial flights. I thought the main reason for TFS was so that they'd have a nice spangly airport near the main resorts for the bucket n spade brigade

If there had been no fog he may have not taken it on himself to take off, however the same accident would/could have occurred if the same take off acctions were taken

Dave

yep, the pilot made a series of choices, this is what drove the incident and loss of life, the choices the pilot made.
 
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