Banned from QF (for a few months)

[jb747]

None of us can know exactly how this went down, but my understanding is that it takes quite an effort to be banned.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Everyone has their own definition of intimidating behaviour. I might not consider my behaviour intimidating at all, only to find someone who takes exception to anyone who queries their actions, even politely. Cultural - we were on a tour in Malaysia and the female tour guide refused every handshake on farewell from a male. Maybe she might likewise be offended if a male was questioning her decision even if done politely.

We don’t know how bad the behaviour was here, but sometimes the simplest of comments or actions, not necessarily aggressive, can spiral downhill rapidly.

There is an objective element. But that works both ways. The person at the receiving end may have a particular disposition. But the perpetrator isn't always the appropriate judge of what constitutes acceptable behaviour.

 

[NZflygirl]

There's a saying in life - don't sweat the small stuff. Seats on planes are small stuff. Getting from A to B is the main point of travel.

Status is just a marketing tool by airlines for "hey we want your money!" Unfortunately it probably has conjured up a sense of entitlement in some travellers. They have bought into the advertising. Remember the bottom line - you really are NOT any more important than the next Joe blog.

Previously I called QF asking if I could match to Gold as I'd missed that status match offer. They offered me a status challenge which I didn't even know existed and made me strive for platinum when I only wanted gold. A year later I was thinking I actually quite enjoyed the benefits of this platinum deal, so I wrote them an email thanking them. Of course they had received money and there was possibly no need to write an email but I did. Funnily enough the next day there was bad weather in Sydney delaying my flight out of Brisbane. I think they consolidated flights and basically ended up having to upgrade some people and I was one of the fortunate few. It was likely coincidence. I'm not sure they get to reading their emails that fast but the upgrade was not necessary for such a short flight but it was certainly appreciated.

Earlier this year I aimed for the Dreamliner and got it, but my flight was downgraded. I was still seated in business class so there was that, but I really wanted the 789. So I made enquiries if I could transfer to the next 789 flight which the lounge agent made happen and was amazing about it. No fuss. They were under exactly NO obligation to make this happen. I was fully aware of that. The flight change didn't affect my overall travel plans as I would have been waiting at the next airport for the next flight anyway. I wanted to send another email to Qantas thanking them for making it happen, but there's a part of me that also doesn't want to get the lounge agent in trouble as there were a few other details that I won't go over that occurred. So I'm a little bit conflicted about how to say thanks and acknowledge when someone has done me a favour, but without getting them in trouble (I don't know that for sure but it's possible!)

I suppose I could have kicked up a stink and said my plane has been downgraded etc, but I've had that before and at the end of the day I wanted to arrive earlier at my destination so I could prepare for the following day. A downgrade in aircraft and therefore experience just wasn't worth flustering over.

If you've had a bad day and you're having an outburst and you catch yourself doing that (hopefully you do), then stop. Take a breath. Say you're sorry and that you've had a bad day, maybe with a few details. It helps the other person understand and empathise. I haven't had an outburst at the airport (but been very close!), but I have been in tears at the airport before and with a brief explanation I've had the agents on my side and even hollering across at the next airline to see if they could offer a cheaper deal to get me home or out of the country earlier. Frontline agents I think can have a hard time bearing the brunt of customer dissatisfaction, but get them on side and they'll move every rock for you. If you know some tricks that can help them they will even be open to trying them. And at the end of it, if someone has done something nice for me, I make sure I look them in the eye and tell them thank you. I really appreciate what you've done. It costs absolutely nothing, but means absolutely everything.

 

[drron]

Yes NZflygirl I am sure QF do know who the good guys and girls are.It is Karma.or Zen if you are called @juddles.
Do Qantas keep notes on their frequent flyers?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Karma and zen are all very good when people are discussing principles. But the practice is what speaks. Perhaps the zen should kick in before worrying if someone is wearing ugg boots in a lounge, or flip flops, or reclining their seats, or taking the shadow, or putting their feet on a bulkhead.

 

[juddles]

Yes NZflygirl I am sure QF do know who the good guys and girls are.It is Karma.or Zen if you are called juddles.
Do Qantas keep notes on their frequent flyers?

drron, I am also sure that QF, like any big business, keep some sort of notes on their customers. But I also suspect many of those notes are not read much (time pressure, care factor, etc)

I recall when I first made P1 and had some interaction with the P1 team, they asked if I had any special requests. I said I only had one - please have staff call me "Judd" and not "Mr XYZ". They agreed that this is fine and the lady understood my feeling that in my case I find first names much more personal.

Anyway, after about 127 flights after that for the first time a CSM actually greeted me as Judd and not Mr XYZ. (BTW he was a very good CSM). This supports my view that the info IS recorded somewhere, but almost noone reads it. Probably they would if it was a big naughty flag, but otherwise, hmmmmm, no.

As for getting banned, I suspect, as JB said, that that takes quite an effort. Again, I "suspect", that to get such a penalty from Qantas usually involves alcohol. I know some people can get stretched past the breaking point by other factors (fatigue, run of bad luck, personal issues, etc), but it seems very rare that someone crosses the line of really bad behaviour without having had a few pre-flight drinks.

The only real run-in with flight staff I have ever had (as of my now 998 flights ), is when I boarded a flight intoxicated. (this is actually the norm)

I had a six hour stopover in the flounge in LAX before continuing on to BNE, and I did what I did back then - drank a bottle of the Jack Daniels Single Select, pre-flight. I am not difficult or anything whilst suitably charged. Got on the plane, napped a couple of hours, woke up thirsty, and asked the hostess for a litre of water. Maybe I had been snoring, maybe a tad of scent of bourbon, but the hostess was not nice. She returned grumpily with a tiny thimble-size glass of water. I said I would need more, but she (angrily as I recall) said that was the size they serve, that they could not give me a litre bottle. (this was in J - for the record). I asked her (no swearing, but equally grumpily), that if that is the only size water they have, could she please cover my entire tray with said thimbles.

No swearwords, no yelling, no intimidation nor bullying nor DYKWIA stuff. She suddenly appeared with a litre bottle of water, still hostile, but the matter ended there.

Why do I recount this? It is because even though I know I am a good pax, that I treat staff and others well, I feel remorse for that flight. I wasn't being difficult, but at the same time I understand that the hostess didn't deserve to be dealing with a grumpy person that is parched due to over-indulgement in the pre-flight lounge phase. I know that our interaction did not make her feel good. And I know that is not me. I think it would be amazing, not just for the staff and the rest of the world, but to the pax themselves, if they had the ability to afterwards ponder how their flight went to sh..., and to truly recognize their contribution to that outcome.

You could, I suppose, be really REALLY unlucky, and suffer a ban for a situation in which you were truly innocent. But then you equally probably could get struck by lightning, twice, as you walked to the newsagent to claim the super lotto main prize you won, which you bought whilst sleepwalking.

 

[drron]

Of course juddles there was the man struck by lightning 7 times and survived.But seeing he was a National Parks ranger he probably was no where near a lottery outlet when sleepwalking.
Roy Sullivan - Wikipedia

 

[Austman]

The only real run-in with flight staff I have ever had (as of my now 998 flights ), is when I boarded a flight intoxicated

I've done more than double that. Mostly in J but now it's about 50/50 J and Y. Sadly, I find I am having more "run-ins" with staff now than ever! They are usually not huge issues but are all unpleasant.

Many have been at check-in, when things have gone wrong, way before any alcohol could have been involved. A calm approach to the issue usually works out. But sometimes in ridiculous situations it's hard to stay totally calm. But I agree, once alcohol is involved it's not a good look for the complainer!

On a recent international flight I was in J and a companion was in Y. We were tired and on the second international long haul of the day(s). A service issue happened to my companion in Y and I was actually asked by the CSM to help sort it out. It was all a bit of a non-issue, easily resolved. But my companion's eyes were a bit red and breath was really stinky. I really felt for the crew dealing with the matter. And thought - that's probably me at times! Eeek! It can't be easy for the crew in such situations.

I would be pretty upset if I was flying overnight (or longer) in Y and my pre-assigned aisle seat was swapped to a centre one. I don't think I would refuse to board. But I would try to see if something better was available, even once on board.

 

[jb747]

Bringing any attention to yourself whilst intoxicated isn’t a good idea. The intoxication itself is enough for them to deny boarding.

 

[JohnK]

Ideally they shouldn't need training There should be very little tolerance in these situations.

I agree. I don't tolerate any seating changes to my booking without my consent unless of course it's an opup to business or First class.

As mentioned I usually get my way so must be doing something right. I am stubborn. I don't fight all changes but fight the ones I feel are important.

 

[rikkitikkitavi]

The only real run-in with flight staff I have ever had (as of my now 998 flights ), is when I boarded a flight intoxicated.

I can't help but think of the Wolf of Wall Street movie where Leo imagines he drove his Lambo home perfectly safely while high as a kite (spoiler the Lambo is actually not fine)

The Heathrow BA F loungue with the free pour Dom, XO, Blue Label, nice French wines etc is my Achilles heel...

 

[Daver6]

I had an unfortunate experience with seating change. I'm flying QF12 JFK to SYD in Y in a couple of weeks. Due to the aircraft change in LAX, one cannot select seats for the LAX to SYD sector. You can see (and select the seat for the first sector).

I called QF to get it sorted out and managed to snag 71D for the second sector. The lady spoke to confirmed my seat allocation and life was good...until about a month later I was checking something and noticed no seat allocated for the first sector. Straight on to the phone with Qantas and they confirm I have no seats selected. Even worse "my" seat, 71D is now no longer available. They tell me there is no record of that seat ever being mine. I suggested they go have a listen to the phone conversation I had previously. They do that and eventually agree I should have that seat and can't explain why it didn't save. As a gesture of good will they let me select a paid exit row seat free of charge. While I still would have preferred 71D and most the good exit row seats were taken, there was no point in my carrying on like a galah. Excrement happens.

 

[vandy]

Yes NZflygirl I am sure QF do know who the good guys and girls are.It is Karma.or Zen if you are called @juddles.
Do Qantas keep notes on their frequent flyers?

Years ago I found myself in a broken seat that wouldn't recline on a Perth to Sydney flight. I asked the cabin crew if I could be moved to another seat, but was told sorry all economy seats are taken. I didn't get angry or argue any further, just accepted my fate, not wanting to make a scene or attract attention. I can't help but wonder if I was more assertive at the time maybe they would have moved me to J to shut me up, or at least given me a few thousand points as a 'goodwill gesture'.

I can only hope I'm on the QFF "nice" list, and will get some good karma back one day. I certainly do not feel like I've been given any special treatment since.

 

[jb747]

I can't help but wonder if I was more assertive at the time maybe they would have moved me to J to shut me up, or at least given me a few thousand points as a 'goodwill gesture'.

The normal solution to that is to find the highest graded FF and to move them....and that frees up an economy seat for you. Of course that only works if there is a J seat to move them to.

There is a small subset of people who intentionally damage seats in an attempt to get an upgrade, so basically you always find someone else to move.

 

[nlagalle]

When is the right to fight?

When I choose 2 aisles on 2 separate bookings for myself and wife and daughter and some helpful person thinks we really need to sit next to each other. Lounge reception looks at me and shrugs shoulders.

"Who did it?". "Don't know".
"Why would they do it without asking my permission?". "Don't know".
"Can you please put us back in the 2 aisles?". "Can't do that as someone has been allocated that seat".
"What just like it I allocated that seat weeks ago? Thanks for nothing".

No point sending email to get standard response "Sorry we didn't meet your expectations this time".

Or what about the time check-in moved me from 4D to 28-something when j had daughter with me. That's the best seat you can give me? Lounge managed to improve back up front somewhere but the damage was already done.

When should I fight?

Was the 4D on a 737? I was shifted once with my kids because of the airbags, but I was only moved back to row 6...

 

[harvyk]

Bringing any attention to yourself whilst intoxicated isn’t a good idea. The intoxication itself is enough for them to deny boarding.

I've often wondered what the threshold is, I've certainly been known to knock back a bevvie or two in the lounge, and there is certainly a few times when I start to wonder if I've over done it, but never been denied boarding.

(Then again I'm a well behaved drunk, so that probably works in my favour)

 

[nlagalle]

Well this has been most engrossing read whilst walking the dog, in fact so engrossing I’ve nearly lost her 3 times, but I digress..

Like many here I’ve lost seating before, while annoyed yes did I rant no. One occasion myself a WP and a silver were moved from 25D to Row 100 odd (ok maybe not 100 but it was at the back of a 767). Our bronze traveller was still in her seat. I can only suspect the seating change was due to constant equipment changes because if the weather. The CSM was brilliant though, she said there were no seats left (inc J) so promised us wine as soon As the seatbelt sign was off.

True to her word we were force fed wine for the trip and given a bottle before landing.

The other time was my seat was the same but the aircraft downsized from a 768 to a 738. So while I still had 24B I was now down near the back. Luckily they were able to move me closer to the front.. IIRC Altea doesnt take status etc into account when re shuffling seats onto a smaller craft (and your original seat exists in the new plane).

I’m guessing OP you probably had a big dummy spit hence being denied boarding.. totally agree with them if that was the case..

Must go now, lost the dog again..

 

[Pushka]

Well this has been most engrossing read whilst walking the dog, in fact so engrossing I’ve nearly lost her 3 times, but I digress..

Like many here I’ve lost seating before, while annoyed yes did I rant no. One occasion myself a WP and a silver were moved from 25D to Row 100 odd (ok maybe not 100 but it was at the back of a 767). Our bronze traveller was still in her seat. I can only suspect the seating change was due to constant equipment changes because if the weather. The CSM was brilliant though, she said there were no seats left (inc J) so promised us wine as soon As the seatbelt sign was off.

True to her word we were force fed wine for the trip and given a bottle before landing.

The other time was my seat was the same but the aircraft downsized from a 768 to a 738. So while I still had 24B I was now down near the back. Luckily they were able to move me closer to the front.. IIRC Altea doesnt take status etc into account when re shuffling seats onto a smaller craft (and your original seat exists in the new plane).

I’m guessing OP you probably had a big dummy spit hence being denied boarding.. totally agree with them if that was the case..

Must go now, lost the dog again..

Laugh of the day. Hope you found the dog.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

When is the right to fight?

When I choose 2 aisles on 2 separate bookings for myself and wife and daughter and some helpful person thinks we really need to sit next to each other. Lounge reception looks at me and shrugs shoulders.

"Who did it?". "Don't know".
"Why would they do it without asking my permission?". "Don't know".
"Can you please put us back in the 2 aisles?". "Can't do that as someone has been allocated that seat".
"What just like it I allocated that seat weeks ago? Thanks for nothing".

No point sending email to get standard response "Sorry we didn't meet your expectations this time".

Or what about the time check-in moved me from 4D to 28-something when j had daughter with me. That's the best seat you can give me? Lounge managed to improve back up front somewhere but the damage was already done.

When should I fight?

Seat changes for operational (which really only should mean ‘safety) reasons should not require consent. The issue is bigger than the needs of the individual passenger.

Changes for commercial reasons (to keep a status member happy) are bad form in my books. But it’s equally bad form for the status member to accept a seat change in those circumstances.

Qantas has a record of moving members in one travel party around, and in some cases i get it. Couples choosing A and C seats, hoping to score a free seat in the middle are trying to maximise the system. There is no such thing as a free seat on a plane. Likewise i guess maybe QF considers two aisles similarly? lots of people want aisle seats.

 

[PJF]

How is this for a seat change about a month ago on QFlink at Brisbane QF lounge desk. Was in Row 2 changed to row 7.
Handed them WP card and asked why in a calm manner?
Answer: "We have to use the front row seats for freight". So I had to ask the obvious question. Are you sure freight on seats inside the cabin on a commercial flight?
No answer just handed the new boarding pass with a blank look.
Got on the plane no freight just other passengers. Seriously who thinks this stuff up. Do QF think that we are idiots.