Banned from QF (for a few months)

[drron]

Also remember there are at least 2 in any encounter.Some take offence very easily.Hopefully I recognise this so step back but I am sure not everyone picks up on the signs.

 

[RoMambai]

Not all of us are experts in how to deal with issues. Assertive is fine but if that gets you nowhere does one give up and walk away?

I generally get my way but don't push too much unless I know I will be uncomfortable which thankfully doesn't happen very often.

You don't have to be an expert. It's common sense really. If you've become impolite or rude irregardless of your noble plight than you've already crossed the line. If you've become hostile, intimidating or threatening you've broken the law.

No airline affront is worth getting shirty over, much less anything worse. There are ways to seek redress if you believe you have been hard done by. Use it. Don't take it out on poor staff who probably had no role in your predicament and probably no authority to resolve it.

 

[straitman]

I decided that he wasn't flying after the first post.

I'm glad you said I that jb747. As I read through the thread I was thinking I don't want/need this person on my aircraft. (At least until they calm down)

 

[RichardMEL]

Not all of us are experts in how to deal with issues. Assertive is fine but if that gets you nowhere does one give up and walk away?

I generally get my way but don't push too much unless I know I will be uncomfortable which thankfully doesn't happen very often.

General comment only not aimed at John personally.. but I find this an interesting perspective. We can all see our behaviour in different ways, and almost always we will be biased to ourselves eg: I wasn't THAT bad... I was just getting my point across. As pointed out just above there's 2 sides involved and 2 people (or possibly more if supervisors etc get involved). Even someone thinking they didn't "push too much" can be highly subjective. I'm not suggesting anyone in particular btw... just a general comment about human nature.

One person's "assertive dialogue" can be another's "aggressive and intimidating/threatening attitude" and in a situation such as an airport, stressful situation and frustrated pax things can get out of control quickly as frustration grows when the responses given don't meet the expectations. I reckon the OP probably fell into this type of situation.

 

[RichardMEL]

Also remember there are at least 2 in any encounter.Some take offence very easily.Hopefully I recognise this so step back but I am sure not everyone picks up on the signs.

Agree. One would presume/hope that most customer facing agents, such as lounge and check in staff, would have appropriate training in dealing with such things (as it's pretty common, sadly)...

of course some do not, and/or pushed to a limit themselves (we're all human), and sometimes a perfect storm can occur.....

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Agree. One would presume/hope that most customer facing agents, such as lounge and check in staff, would have appropriate training in dealing with such things (as it's pretty common, sadly)...

of course some do not, and/or pushed to a limit themselves (we're all human), and sometimes a perfect storm can occur.....

Ideally they shouldn't need training There should be very little tolerance in these situations.

 

[trippin_the_rift]

There is definitely a tactful way to handle these situations, however, sounding off at front-line staff is not the way to achieve things.

A common theme from AFF over the years is that when members hit LTG, or finally have enough of the QF attitude - members experience a sudden consciousness awakening and realise there is a much bigger world outside QF. Welcome to the club, hmmm.

 

[Robert K]

I wish there was a video of the 'displeasure'.
How much time have we all spent over a this magical seat that just had to be sat on?

What was so special about this seat? Has there been this amazing secret seat that I wasn't aware of?

 

[Toad]

This has been some very interesting reading/dialogue. From a personal view, "Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change. the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference"

 

[The man with no name]

Great thread. OP and others make some good points. Mod's should not shut down and those that call for such should just move on to another thread.

 

[GoldCanyon340]

Great thread. OP and others make some good points. Mod's should not shut down and those that call for such should just move on to another thread.

... up to a point. If a thread turns into a Flame War then it's unlikely to add anything to the community.

 

[GoldCanyon340]

What was so special about this seat? Has there been this amazing secret seat that I wasn't aware of?

It's the one with working IFE

 

[drron]

Well the OP said the new seat was a middle seat in the middle block of seats in Y.Even as a mere QP I really wouldn't want to be there on an overnight flight.

 

[pauly7]

Honestly I can't recall the last time I have had a seat allocation change for any reason with QF (or any other major airline really). Oh, I think the last time on QF was a 1A changed to 1K because 1A had a mechanical issue.. can't have an issue with that. Earlier this year SQ were polite enough to ask me if I would move from the seat I had selected so a couple could have the double bed suite (my evil plan to try and snag it for me did not work out lol). That's the way it should be handled, and SQ were lovely about it (as you'd hope for an F pax).

Maybe it's because I fly solo 99.9% of the time I just don't experience these things. I accept it happens obviously but I just can't say I'e experienced it much, if at all, myself.

I’m with you.

There seem to be some awfully unlucky people on here that it seems to happen to though....!

I’ve never had a seat change on QF, except when I have been upgraded which of course I accepted graciously oh and once actually on board on a dash 8 flight where the FA explained there was a terrified first time flyer who wanted to be closer to the front. Of course I said no problem to that, poor thing was shaking like a leaf, and later the FA loaded me up with some bottles of wine and biscuits too from memory to say thanks - which was completely unnecessary.

I’ve never had a seat changed on other airlines either.

I have to mediate and negotiate far bigger things in my job and life so thankfully I’m very well centred for dealing with hiccups that can occur while travelling. Reactions on the spot won’t achieve much at all. Revenge is a dish best served cold

 

[Pushka]

Ideally they shouldn't need training There should be very little tolerance in these situations.

So define what is acceptable/tolerable to you versus what is acceptable to someone else. Add in cultural mix and it’s impossible.

Is getting generally upset but not abusive to the operator ok? If I burst into tears but not get angry is that ok? If I question someone’s actions is that ok? What isn’t ok is yelling or threatening someone but there is a myriad of emotions/actions before that which some would say is tolerable and others not.

As far as seat changes go, yes, it’s happened to me frequently and we continue to be asked about seat allocation if we aren’t seated together on long flights. Happened last month but at least they asked first. They split my elderly blind mother and I on a flight in J back to Sydney. Why? Same PNR and I’d pre selected those seats months ago. Just because it hasn’t happened to you doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen. And I wouldn’t accept a middle row seat on long haul either if travelling on my own.

 

[RoMambai]

So define what is acceptable/tolerable to you versus what is acceptable to someone else. Add in cultural mix and it’s impossible.

Is getting generally upset but not abusive to the operator ok? If I burst into tears but not get angry is that ok? If I question someone’s actions is that ok? What isn’t ok is yelling or threatening someone but there is a myriad of emotions/actions before that which some would say is tolerable and others .

It's impossible to answer this question concisely. It would come down to discretion. Some people are more easily irritated than others but for someone to burst into tears over what is a fairly trivial matter in the grand scheme of things would, in my view, be OTT. It would indicate something broader than the issue at hand and therefore something for that person to deal with. It's not the poor lounge staff's fault that you've had a long day or that you're tired. I bet you they are too.

In these situations - and they've happened to me many times - I take it ok the chin and seek redress through appropriate channels. Life is full of overs and unders. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. Deal with it.

At the end of the day many of us in this forum lead privileged lives in the best country in the world where we travel the world in comfort. Take a chill pill and don't be the ugly Australian.

 

[Pushka]

Ideally they shouldn't need training There should be very little tolerance in these situations.

It's impossible to answer this question concisely. It would come down to discretion. Some people are more easily irritated than others but for someone to burst into tears over what is a fairly trivial matter in the grand scheme of things would, in my view, be OTT. It would indicate something broader than the issue at hand and therefore something for that person to deal with. It's not the poor lounge staff's fault that you've had a long day or that you're tired. I bet you they are too.

In these situations - and they've happened to me many times - I take it ok the chin and seek redress through appropriate channels. Life is full of overs and unders. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. Deal with it.

At the end of the day many of us in this forum lead privileged lives in the best country in the world where we travel the world in comfort. Take a chill pill and don't be the ugly Australian.

Exactly. It’s impossible to answer which is why people need training to try to read the invidiual situation and make the appropriate call on how to manage it.

As others have mentioned, sometimes it’s just the straw that breaks the camels back. In our case, I could see how we could have melted down a bit. Our month long trip to Europe a few weeks ago was halted at the beginning when our flight from Adelaide to Venice was cancelled at 10.30pm as we were waiting to board. We had handed our house over to the builders and couldn’t go home. We knew we’d just blown $400 on our Venice accommodation. We could manage all that and awaited next day for what Qatar would do to get us there. We had to wait another 24 hours to leave; those of us who were on the cancelled flight were sent on the A380 out of Melbourne; we (and I’m talking 8 of us in J ) were stopped at the boarding gate on our way to Doha and asked to go to the service desk. One lady older than me just burst into tears and said she couldn’t bear it any more and would never fly Qatar again. Now, we still don’t know why we were all called over, but after 24 hours delay it was not what any of us needed.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

So define what is acceptable/tolerable to you versus what is acceptable to someone else. Add in cultural mix and it’s impossible.

The outcome is important. If someone's behaviour comes across as aggressive, or intimidating, that is where the zero tolerance comes in.

If a person can't recognise when they are coming across as aggressive or intimidating, they are the ones at fault. They cannot blame cultural differences, or argue this is the behaviour they engage in at home so 'it's ok' in public. It's not.

I appreciate there is a problem. That's why companies and workplaces run compulsory courses so staff can learn the impacts of their behaviour and what is acceptable. It's great they run the courses, but sad that there is a need to.

 

[Toad]

I just think of Forrest Gump's reply when he steps in it.

 

[Pushka]

The outcome is important. If someone's behaviour comes across as aggressive, or intimidating, that is where the zero tolerance comes in.

If a person can't recognise when they are coming across as aggressive or intimidating, they are the ones at fault. They cannot blame cultural differences, or argue this is the behaviour they engage in at home so 'it's ok' in public. It's not.

I appreciate there is a problem. That's why companies and workplaces run compulsory courses so staff can learn the impacts of their behaviour and what is acceptable. It's great they run the courses, but sad that there is a need to.

Everyone has their own definition of intimidating behaviour. I might not consider my behaviour intimidating at all, only to find someone who takes exception to anyone who queries their actions, even politely. Cultural - we were on a tour in Malaysia and the female tour guide refused every handshake on farewell from a male. Maybe she might likewise be offended if a male was questioning her decision even if done politely.

We don’t know how bad the behaviour was here, but sometimes the simplest of comments or actions, not necessarily aggressive, can spiral downhill rapidly.