F Lounge access for WP flying QF codeshare on non-OW airlines

[medhead]

My take on the 'or' is that lounge access is permitted if any of the following are met:

• A Qantas operated and marketed flight
• An Emirates operated and marketed flight
• A Jetstar operated and marketed flight
• A OneWorld operated and marketed flight #

Now my interpretation is based on the grammar of the sentence, and without knowledge of what the # represents.

I earnestly hope that this is not what is actually intended.

That is my interpretation. But QF flight number on FJ allows lounge access? How would that fit? Maybe only the word flight belongs with the items in the list, one of which is Oneworld marketed and operated?

.

I thought I was wrong once, but I was mistaken.

I first noticed it when checking access for the LAX TBIT First Lounge late last week.

I must be having deja vu

 

[amaroo]

Things are starting to look grim!

Hmmm, QFF for the ATO point haul .... BAEC for flying.

 

[opusman]

If you're going based on the grammar then I think your guess is as good as anyone's

Must be travelling on any flight the same day that shows Qantas^, Emirates^, Jetstar Airlines+ or a oneworld operated or marketed flight.

What does this even mean? Whether it's "shows Qantas" or "shows Qantas operated or marketed flight", neither interpretation actually makes any sense.

 

[Anna]

If the change is intentional it looks like another good reason for ADL pax not to bother with QFi.

 

[serfty]

To me it reads that a Qantas Platinum member gets access if on a Qantas Flight number, a Jetstar Flight number, an Emirates Flight number, or a oneworld operated and marketed flight. I think that the 'operated and marketed' clause only belongs to the oneWorld access, not to the Qantas Flight access.

That was how it used to be - in fact I have prosecuted this for several years regarding the way that has read. See this from FT back in 2010:

Originally Posted by serfty
You WILL get First class lounge access due to flying on the QF codeshare.

As per the access rules:

Member and 1 guest can access the lounge when travelling on a Qantas, Jetstar or oneworld flight.# Guest must be travelling with member.

To break this down:

• Qantas,
• Jetstar or
• oneworld flight.#

A QF or JQ flight number suffices.

As for a "oneworld flight", see the #: "next onward flight that day must be on a oneworld Airline Members operated and marketed flight ..." (i.e. the # is specific to the reference to "oneworld flight")

Still have doubts about the applicability of the #?

Then consider this: There is no logical way the word Jetstar can be relevant to "a oneworld Airline Member's operated and marketed flight".

Given that the word "Qantas" is more textually remote from the # than "Jetstar" then it's definitive the # cannot apply to Qantas flight numbers.

Significantly, posted experiences agree with this.

Anyway, in the clear light of day, no access for that WP travelling on FJ metal with a QF flight number, while a WP1 does get access.

This is how I see the intended breakdown for WP:

• A Qantas or
• An Emirates or
• A Jetstar or
• A OneWorld
  • operated and marketed flight #

And for WP1:

• A Qantas or
• An Emirates or
• A Jetstar or
• A OneWorld
  • marketed flight #

So, QF*EK, EK*QF, QF*JQ, QF*BA gets access for a WP, but not for QF*FJ or QF*MU.

 

[RooFlyer]

QF LAX First Lounge page says WP1 get in on:

Next onward flight must be on a Qantas, Jetstar Airlines+ or oneworld flight number.#

WP get in on:

Next onward flight must be on a Qantas, Jetstar Airlines+ or oneworld operated and marketed flight.#

That seems straightforward: WP1 have better access rights than WP, ie if they are QF codeshare on Fiji Airways, WP1 get in, but WP don't. A WP enhancement, but clear.

The # footnote on the LAX F lounge eligibility page says:

# A oneworld marketed flight refers to a flight with a oneworld flight number, eg QF1 or AA222. A oneworld operated flight refers to the actual aircraft or 'metal' on which you fly, eg Finnair aircraft.

However, QF LAX Business Lounge web page has the same access for both WP and WP1:

Next onward flight must be on a Qantas, Jetstar Airlines+ or oneworld operated and marketed flight.#

So WP1 have less access entitlement to the Business Lounge compared to the First lounge???? "Oh, damn, we'll have to make do with the F lounge, as they bounced us from the J lounge" :mrgreen:

 

[defurax]

I'll report back Friday from the F and/or the J lounge...

I'm still not sure what QF is trying to achieve by doing this, not all codeshare agreements are the same. On some codeshare it is clear that each partner airlines is allocated a certain number of seats (e.g QF/LA and QF/SB) which becomes evident when looking at the seat map using each airline respective flight number.

How silly of me to think I could get into the F lounge as a WP with a $2,000 J ticket with a QF flight number when obviously QF wants me to enjoy the F lounge on a $55 JQ ticket:shock:

 

[opusman]

I'm still not sure what QF is trying to achieve by doing this

The gradual enhancement of WP leading to disappearance of the level altogether?

It would be nice if Red Roo would pop in to clarify; as always, silence speaks volumes.

 

[cmon0005]

It would be nice if Red Roo would pop in to clarify; as always, silence speaks volumes.

Red Roo are you able to clarify please?

 

[RichardMEL]

At the end of the day it probably comes down to the interpretation of whichever lounge attendant is working that day unless they have a much clearer "cheat sheat" on entry requirements.

I still say it's vague enough for both interpretations to be valid enough though the *intent* seems more clear. The wording for WP in F lounges is poor IMHO.

All I can add is the F lounge at MEL made calls for FJ flight to NAN when I was there... must have been a bunch of P1's on that flight in the lounge

 

[AusTraveller]

At the end of the day it probably comes down to the interpretation of whichever lounge attendant is working that day unless they have a much clearer "cheat sheat" on entry requirements.

I still say it's vague enough for both interpretations to be valid enough though the *intent* seems more clear. The wording for WP in F lounges is poor IMHO.

All I can add is the F lounge at MEL made calls for FJ flight to NAN when I was there... must have been a bunch of P1's on that flight in the lounge

I accessed the MEL F lounge on an FJ flight booked under the QF code recently. I was worried I might be sent to the J lounge but the lounge attendant just checked I was booked on the QF code. Apparently when scanning my WP card it automatically populated the information. They also kindly made a boarding announcement for me.

 

[medhead]

This is how I see the intended breakdown for WP:

• A Qantas or
• An Emirates or
• A Jetstar or
• A OneWorld
  • operated and marketed flight #

Notwithstanding my previous post that it was clear, in the cold light of day I can see this as also valid:

• A Qantas or
• An Emirates or
• A Jetstar or
• A OneWorld operated and marketed
  • flight #

Which would still give WP1 greater access for flights marketed by Oneworld but not operated.

 

[RooFlyer]

Red Roo are you able to clarify please?

Last time I asked for a clarification from red Roo, the response was this.

 

[Austman]

These drop down lounge access menus have often been wrong: Qantas Club Lounges | Qantas

Yet here: https://www.qantas.com.au/fflyer/dyn/flying/tier-benefits only WP access is covered in detail and for WP1 it doesn't expand on them - there's just the "All the benefits of Platinum apply".

So one says WP and WP1 access rules are different while the other implies they are the same. Bit of a mess.

 

[opusman]

Maybe that's why Red Roo hasn't provided any clarification, Qantas actually have NFI themselves?

 

[JohnK]

Yes, when flying QF codeshare on SB the BP clearly shows a prominent QF flight number. What made me questioned accessibility is the different requirement for WP1 and WP. The fact that for WP1 the word "operated" is missing. But I'm starting to think it's just another IT/website error, because according to the website WP1 have more restrictive access rules to enter BNE J lounge than BNE F lounge:

If you erode benefits gradually over time then it won't feel like an enhancement?

 

[Claudius]

So, it's not possible for a WP to gain access to F lounge when flying a Qantas marketed FJ operated flight?
My boss is flying this route in a couple of weeks, I'll ask him to test that.

 

[defurax]

So, it's not possible for a WP to gain access to F lounge when flying a Qantas marketed FJ operated flight?
My boss is flying this route in a couple of weeks, I'll ask him to test that.

It's not that simple... I sent a PM to Red Roo, but I did not get a reply.
I only have a PhD so I'm not really qualified to decipher and understand lounge access rules.
I will know Friday if I get access on a QF flight operated by SB.
I can only encourage people to post succesful lounge entry until we get a sample large enough to apply some probabilistic model of lounge entry events.

 

[Claudius]

Fom reading the info it would seem to imply the operator is also important, interesting if that is the case.

 

[RooFlyer]

Fom reading the info it would seem to imply the operator is also important, interesting if that is the case.

Yes, but you are ignoring the likely fact that its a stuff up on the web page (miswording). Witness the fact that according to the wording for LAX lounges, its harder for a WP1 to get into the J lounge, than the F lounge!!

This is one of the teeth-grinding realities of flying QF these days - you never know what the rules are!

Anyway, Merry Christmas, and may all readers journeys be in (or upgraded to) F