Webjet = fail

[BAM1748]

Fail yes, this confirms they don't have the systems in place to communicate with customers.

Fail, I give using them a big miss.

 

[odysseus]

Sad to hear they've experienced the wonder of webjet.

Why on earth hasn't that person who was supposedly at lunch returned the call?

I also don't see that that agreement quoted limits their liability in this case.

It refers to them not being liable for suitability of the purchase. The purchase was suitable; that is not the issue.

It says it's subject to amendment at any time without notice. Again that is not the issue, as the thread indicates they would have worked around this amendment.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

The GDS's are supposed to refresh each other when changes are made ... but this does not always happen (as we can see).

CX used their own "Cupid" system and ISTR that AY employ Amadeus.

I have no doubt that Webjet's GDS pnr was updated when they acknowledged these changes however it seems that their GDS does not upload these changes to the front end portal of their website which is what the passengers looked at. I'd be interested to know what system they have in place to facilitate the transmisison of this data.

Whilst CX & AY were quick to handball the problems back to the travel agent, all airlines need to understand that it's in their best interests to rectify the problem as currently these airlines are allowing Webjet to drag their good name through the mud & is narrowminded to think otherwise.

I'd be ringing CX & AY asking them which of their account execs calls on Webjet & politely suggest they tell Webjet pull their head in and come up with a satisfactory resolution for your parents ie a full refund! :evil:

You could also tell the airlines that 20,000 members and thousands of others who read AFF will be eagerly awaiting the response - no pressure or anything.

Webjet's stance at the moment is akin to a lawyer taking your money to represent you in court but not showing up for the hearing.

Your parents entered into a contract with Webjet when they took their money to deliver a service they never received. I could understand maybe if Webjet updated the new date and times of flights on their site & your parents didn't check but this was not the case!

Were the airfares paid for by credit card? If so, I'd be contacting the credit card company and seeing if you have cause for the merchant to reverse the charge due to non delivery of a product or service.

It's also a good idea to keep a record of times and dates of all conversations with above parties and with whom you spoke etc. This is invaluable.

Best of luck, keep us posted - remember failure is not an option.

Cheers

Oz

 

[odysseus]

I'd be ringing CX & AY asking them which of their account execs calls on Webjet & politely suggest they tell Webjet pull their head in and come up with a satisfactory resolution for your parents ie a full refund! :evil:

Unless this was to include all other holiday expenses i.e. not just the flights, I wouldn't suggest that as reasonable. They are likely paying more for the replacement QF flights than the originally booked and contracted ones, so accepting just a refund of those flights will still leave them out of pocket.

I'd expect Webjet to compensate them to deliver what was paid for i.e. the new flights required by their negligence.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

Unless this was to include all other holiday expenses i.e. not just the flights, I wouldn't suggest that as reasonable. They are likely paying more for the replacement QF flights than the originally booked and contracted ones, so accepting just a refund of those flights will still leave them out of pocket.

I'd expect Webjet to compensate them to deliver what was paid for i.e. the new flights required by their negligence.

Good point. The insurance company clearly are not interested in paying nor should they have to carry the can for Webjet's mistake.

 

[oz_mark]

Were your folks using the checkmytrip.com website to review the itinerary or something else?

I booked through webjet last year and they flicked me on to this site, I think it's a Galileo portal...I would've thought the flight information would be live on it.

Galileo would be on viewtrip.com

 

[ArseneV]

Webjet, I'm waiting for a response.

Good luck Oneworldplus2 and keep pushing this matter while your parents are away! These matters conveniently disappear if not followed up.

 

[Mrmaxwell]

Make sure you submit this to the travel letters section on smh/theage.com.au

They always print stuff like this and sometimes get answers.


We welcome your travel-related opinions, experiences and letters. Letters may be edited for space, legal or other reasons. Email us at [email protected] including your name, address and phone number.

 

[JohnK]

Very sad to hear of these issues.

If you book with a travel agent, always double check the departure dates, etc on checkmytrip and/or the operating airlines before you fly.

Some people do not have access to the internet, nor do they have computer skills, so a travel agent is their contact point. If changes are made to itineraries by the airlines and communicated to the travel agent then why wasn't the client informed?

Who cares about Webjet's terms and conditions? They are not the ones that need protecting. They have failed very badly and should be made to pay with compensation on top.

 

[serfty]

... Who cares about Webjet's terms and conditions? ...

Webjet do and it's beholding upon their managers to avoid payout if it can be legally done without too much adverse publicity.

I'm not indicating it's right or fair; that's just the way it is.s

 

[JohnK]

Webjet do and it's beholding upon their managers to avoid payout if it can be legally done without too much adverse publicity.

Agreed. But it would not be the first time that a company's terms and conditions may been deemed to be contradictory to fair practice.

I do not like dealing with faceless, spineless corporations that like to hide behind their "so-called" terms and conditions. I wish Webjet gets all the (negative) publicity they deserve from these sort of stunts.

 

[futaris]

Some people do not have access to the internet, nor do they have computer skills, so a travel agent is their contact point. If changes are made to itineraries by the airlines and communicated to the travel agent then why wasn't the client informed?

If you booked with Webjet, then you booked online. Regardless, in the olden days, people would ring and reconfirm flights manually over the telephone, 24-48hrs in advance. This was written on most tickets.

And you can still find the contact details for Cathay Pacific in the White or Yellow Pages.

Are you expecting someone who turns up 40 mins before a Tiger Airways flight to be able to fly? If you turn up late, then you can't fly, as you didn't meet the carrier's T&Cs.

Likewise, in the Cathay Pacific Conditions of Carriage:

6.9 CANCELLATION OF ONWARD RESERVATIONS
Please be advised that if you do not show up for any flight without advising us in advance, we may cancel your return or onward reservations. However, if you do advise us in advance, we will not cancel your subsequent flight reservations.

ARTICLE 10: SCHEDULES, CANCELLATION OF FLIGHTS
10.1 SCHEDULES
10.1.1 The flight times shown in timetables may change between the date of publication and the date you actually travel. We do not guarantee them to you and they do not form part of your contract with us.
10.1.2 Before we accept your booking, we will notify you of the scheduled flight time in effect as of that time, and it will be shown on your Ticket. It is possible we may need to change the scheduled flight time subsequent to issuance of your Ticket. If you provide us with contact information, we will endeavour to notify you of any such changes. If, after you purchase your Ticket, we make a significant change to the scheduled flight time, which is not acceptable to you, and we are unable to book you on an alternate flight which is acceptable to you, you will be entitled to a refund in accordance with Article 11.

Cathay Pacific endeavoured to contact the travellers, and the travellers didn't say they weren't happy with the change.

If you didn't give your contact details directly to the airline, then the onus lies with the traveller to check & double check.

 

[dajop]

If you didn't give your contact details directly to the airline, then the onus lies with the traveller to check & double check.

Hang on a minute ... the traveller booked through a Travel Agent, albeit online. The story seems to be:
1)Airline contacted travel agent with details of changes.
2)Travel agent has contact details of passenger
3)Travel agent failed to contact passenger of changes.

As far as the airline is concerned they did contact the traveller (ie via travel agent), therefore not liable. As far as traveller is concerned, they checked schedule with travel agent (via website) several times in advance of travel.

In my mind WEBJET has failed to implement a system that notifies the traveller of schedule changes by the airline, it is simply not good enough to hide behind terms and conditions around suitability of service. I just can't believe that Webjet can wash their hands of this so easily. If so at the very least, they should provide contact numbers for airline and advice to recheck airline schedule in advance of travel - in clear english in the booking process - not hidden in T&C or FAQs. I have had schedule changes to flights booked through online travel agencies and have received notification by email of such changes, as I would expect. Why is it so hard for Webjet to do this?

 

[medhead]

If you booked with Webjet, then you booked online. Regardless, in the olden days, people would ring and reconfirm flights manually over the telephone, 24-48hrs in advance. This was written on most tickets.

And you can still find the contact details for Cathay Pacific in the White or Yellow Pages.

Are you expecting someone who turns up 40 mins before a Tiger Airways flight to be able to fly? If you turn up late, then you can't fly, as you didn't meet the carrier's T&Cs.

Likewise, in the Cathay Pacific Conditions of Carriage:
Cathay Pacific endeavoured to contact the travellers, and the travellers didn't say they weren't happy with the change.

If you didn't give your contact details directly to the airline, then the onus lies with the traveller to check & double check.

The thing is the travellers did check and double check with the business that was acting as their agent to Cathy.

 

[futaris]

If Webjet is an authorised agent of Cathay Pacific, then they need to meet Cathay's T&Cs, to remain an authorised agent... If they didn't then you have something that you can take to the fair trading commission and AFTA, etc.

Be careful, as Webjet isn't a agent of Tiger Airways:

Tiger Airways
Please note, in the case of any bookings for Tiger Airways, Webjet is not acting as an agent of Tiger Airways.

 

[JohnK]

If you booked with Webjet, then you booked online. Regardless, in the olden days, people would ring and reconfirm flights manually over the telephone, 24-48hrs in advance. This was written on most tickets.

How about the situation where a friend asks me to make a booking for them with Webjet online? Is that person responsible to check flights with all carriers, individual hotels etc or is it my responsibility? I don't particularly care for "one-sided" terms and conditions and Webjet should just acccept the simple fact that they stuffed up big time and rectify the situation instead of playing hard ball.

And you can still find the contact details for Cathay Pacific in the White or Yellow Pages.

Yes and people such as my parents would be totally lost if they had to rely on this form of communication which is why they deal with travel agents in the first place. It was so easy when they could just go to the Greek travel agent book their flights and they would inform them of any changes. Unfortunately the internet killed off a lot of the smaller travel agents.

Now they have a son who knows a little bit about this garbage and helps them out. Others do not hav this luxury.

If you didn't give your contact details directly to the airline, then the onus lies with the traveller to check & double check.

Funny you mention Cathay Pacific and their terms and conditions. Whose responsibility it it that Cathay Pacific receives contact details? Is it Webjet (or travel agent) or the person on the booking?

For what it is worth I have just received an email from Cathay Pacific cancelling my CX flight HKG-BKK and putting me on a later flight. I now have an 8 hour transit in HKG (which is a waste of time). I have asked to be waitlisted on the earlier flight A340-300 and this appears to be useless as business class is full and economy is wide open and it will be hard to find any I class availability in the next 10 days.

My other option would be to put back the flight out of SIN that morning so I get into HKG later in line with the new flight. The person on the phone said this could not be done but lucklily I have read the terms and conditions of my tickets. Again some people do not have that luxury or the experience.

 

[futaris]

Funny you mention Cathay Pacific and their terms and conditions. Whose responsibility it it that Cathay Pacific receives contact details? Is it Webjet (or travel agent) or the person on the booking?

As per the T&Cs:

As these Conditions are read, please remember that:
“We”, “our” and “us” means Cathay Pacific Airways Limited (“Cathay Pacific”).
“You”, “your” and “yourself” mean any person, except members of the crew, carried or to be carried in an aircraft with our consent (See also definition for “Passenger”).

“PASSENGER” means any person, except members of the crew, carried or to be carried in an aircraft pursuant to a Ticket. (See also definition of “you”, “your” and “yourself”)

You will find similar T&Cs for QANTAS, etc.

If you act as a travel agent for someone, then you need to be a licensed travel agent, or be liable.

 

[medhead]

If Webjet is an authorised agent of Cathay Pacific, then they need to meet Cathay's T&Cs, to remain an authorised agent... If they didn't then you have something that you can take to the fair trading commission and AFTA, etc.

I didn't say that webjet was acting as an agent of cathy pacific, I said they were acting as the agent for the travellers to cathy. That is webjet was acting on behalf of the travellers in arranging the travel.

 

[JohnK]

If you act as a travel agent for someone, then you need to be a licensed travel agent, or be liable.

I am not sure if we are arguing the same point.

In the situation mentioned in this thread who's fault was it that CX and AY did not have the passengers contact details and then contacted Webjet who did not bother to contact their clients?

 

[futaris]

JohnK, My last sentence above was in relation to:

How about the situation where a friend asks me to make a booking for them with Webjet online? Is that person responsible to check flights with all carriers, individual hotels etc or is it my responsibility? I don't particularly care for "one-sided" terms and conditions and Webjet should just acccept the simple fact that they stuffed up big time and rectify the situation instead of playing hard ball.

The ticket and corresponding contract is between the passenger and the airline. If the travel agent didn't supply the contact details, then either they or their employees were negligent.

The problem here is determining that
a) Cathay Pacific aren't at fault, since Cathay Pacific didn't have the traveller's contact details
b) Webjet are liable, due to their negligence (for failing to provide the traveller's contact details and/or update their itinerary)

If you can't prove one of the above, who else is going to refund the money?

“We”, “our” and “us” means Cathay Pacific Airways Limited (“Cathay Pacific”).
“You”, “your” and “yourself” mean any person, except members of the crew, carried or to be carried in an aircraft with our consent (See also definition for “Passenger”).

“PASSENGER” means any person, except members of the crew, carried or to be carried in an aircraft pursuant to a Ticket. (See also definition of “you”, “your” and “yourself”)

10.1.1 The flight times shown in timetables may change between the date of publication and the date you actually travel. We do not guarantee them to you and they do not form part of your contract with us.
10.1.2 Before we accept your booking, we will notify you of the scheduled flight time in effect as of that time, and it will be shown on your Ticket. It is possible we may need to change the scheduled flight time subsequent to issuance of your Ticket. If you provide us with contact information, we will endeavour to notify you of any such changes. If, after you purchase your Ticket, we make a significant change to the scheduled flight time, which is not acceptable to you, and we are unable to book you on an alternate flight which is acceptable to you, you will be entitled to a refund in accordance with Article 11.

My understanding of Cathay T&Cs is that the traveller needs to give the contact details to the airline directly.

NB, if you were using planitonearth, then this applies:

Disclaimer for PlanitonearthTM
Services by PlanitonearthTM are provided at no charge and on an 'as is' basis. Neither Webjet Ltd nor Webjet Marketing Pty Ltd (together 'Webjet') make any representations or warranties about the availability, functionality or performance of PlanitonearthTM or the accuracy, completeness, currency or reliability of any of the content or data accessible via PlanitonearthTM. Webjet excludes all implied conditions and warranties in relation to PlanitonearthTM, including all implied conditions and warranties of merchantability, satisfactory quality, fitness for a general or particular purpose and non-infringement of proprietary rights, except for any condition or warranty implied by law, the exclusion of which would contravene any statute or cause any part of this clause to be void (non-excludable condition).

Webjet's liability for breach of any non excludable condition is limited, at Webjet's option, to refunding the price of the goods or services in respect of which the breach occurred or to providing, replacing or repairing those goods or providing those services again. To the maximum extent permitted by law, Webjet excludes all liability, whether in contract, tort (including negligence) or under statute arising from the operation or use of PlanitonearthTM.