State border closures illegal under the highest law in the country?

bigbadbyrnes

Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2011
Posts
273
Everything is arguable in law, doubly so in constitutional law. This is a matter for the high court.

But here's my opening argument;

Section 92 of the highest law in the country sets out "On the imposition of uniform duties of customs, trade, commerce, and intercourse among the States, whether by means of internal carriage or ocean navigation, shall be absolutely free. "

Per Cole vs Whitfield 1988 "The notions of absolutely free trade and commerce and absolutely free intercourse are quite distinct". Sec92 clearly sets out the law for interstate trade, but also 'intercourse'.

And on the matter of what intercourse means, per Gratwick v Johnson 1945 it's the ability "to pass to and fro among the States without burden, hindrance or restriction".

Border closures, (and arguably although less certainly isolation requirements), are therefore inconsistent with the highest law in the country and should be set aside.

No one is talking about it, any legal eagles here explain? There's no room on the news for this at the moment, but if people start to fed up with the restrictions, it's worth getting them tested in the high court.

edit:

I think this analysis will answer all your questions: States are shutting their borders to stop coronavirus. Is that actually allowed?

Short version: if there are good public health grounds (for example states of emergency), those laws are likely to be held valid.

Could be worth testing if an individual could be proven to be not a thread to public health, but that would be the exception. Thanks MEL_Traveller for sharing the article.

/thread
 
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Sorry to hear :( and I'm right there with you - we are gearing up to permanently fire 75 full timers in the next week, directly related to the QLD border issues which is weighing very heavily on me, plus not being able to see family. We already folded our WA branch months ago, its being operated now from Melbourne...

We are just holding out to see if we can save some of them if we get some more people into QLD from VIC and Sydney, without them plus no international visitors that division of our company has literally been on life support :( Local QLD tourists are not spending enough even when they do book and its only the peak peak times we are busy, shoulder periods that were normally solid are like tumbleweed....

From a family perspective, because of QLD making rules up on the run and continually refusing to meet more than monthly on borders, we have a plan that involves booking absolutely last minute ($$$$) from several states to try and reunite our family over Xmas :(
Most of us feel your pain.....Best bet is regional NSW.
 
Sorry to hear :( and I'm right there with you - we are gearing up to permanently fire 75 full timers in the next week, directly related to the QLD border issues which is weighing very heavily on me, plus not being able to see family. We already folded our WA branch months ago, its being operated now from Melbourne...

It's tough. But lots of indirect economic issues to be balanced as well... tens of thousands of hours with people having to line up to take tests, or be stuck for days in quarantine. With developments and power struggles in the Pacific, will universities and other tourism businesses heavily reliant on some single markets ever be the same again?
 
Most of us feel your pain.....Best bet is regional NSW.

I don't want to jinx our plans but we are planning for VIC actually :)

I'm just horrified we are about to let go so many people so close to Christmas because of our rather dubious / nonsensical and heavily politicised medical advice up here.

It is not vetted, its not explained and doesn't have any available evidence base provided for other medical experts to peer review or even just provide comment. On top of that it is incredibly poorly communicated with our two leaders being very poor presenters and communicators and refuse to answer even very basic questions about the whole mess. That is what is pouring salt onto the wound for us and many others up here in QLD....and we are really only a peripheral operator to the really affected industries! The horrific domino effect is really setting in now...

Anyway we are quite literally praying that it is good news next week on borders opening to VIC and Sydney as depending on dates we may be able to hang on to some of them.
 
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I guess Santa is going to need some strategic planning to cover Australia in one pass without quarantining and hence delaying Christmas by 2 weeks for each border crossing. Let's see, start in WA, then -> Qld -> NT -> Tas -> Vic -> NSW -> ACT -> SA. Would that sequence work? Now just need to ensure the jolly fellow arrives into Perth by 10th December to wait our his quarantine in a suitable WA tourist hospitality establishment.
 
I guess Santa is going to need some strategic planning to cover Australia in one pass without quarantining and hence delaying Christmas by 2 weeks for each border crossing. Let's see, start in WA, then -> Qld -> NT -> Tas -> Vic -> NSW -> ACT -> SA. Would that sequence work? Now just need to ensure the jolly fellow arrives into Perth by 10th December to wait our his quarantine in a suitable WA tourist hospitality establishment.
Yes, the 14 day rule is unfortunate, but starting at NT (which does allow some quarantine free arrivals lol) and transiting certain State / even white lying might keep Santa’s Christmas on schedule.

Am I right in remembering, the WA Premier did give the Easter Bunny a pass no? Maybe he can work something for Santa
 
Yes, the 14 day rule is unfortunate, but starting at NT (which does allow some quarantine free arrivals lol) and transiting certain State / even white lying might keep Santa’s Christmas on schedule.

Am I right in remembering, the WA Premier did give the Easter Bunny a pass no? Maybe he can work something for Santa

The Santa issue has already been addressed !!
 
I just read

Vic announced 2 day border closure, then after that a permit system

And some changes as SA lockdown changes, so perhaps more easing on Day 7, then Day 15

Article at 3:24pm today, so not sure how much of it is a hot-take

 
I guess Santa is going to need some strategic planning to cover Australia in one pass without quarantining and hence delaying Christmas by 2 weeks for each border crossing. Let's see, start in WA, then -> Qld -> NT -> Tas -> Vic -> NSW -> ACT -> SA. Would that sequence work? Now just need to ensure the jolly fellow arrives into Perth by 10th December to wait our his quarantine in a suitable WA tourist hospitality establishment.
I'm pretty sure Airservices Australia and CASA will facilitate a suitable flight plan for the big fella!
 
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I'm pretty sure Airservices Australia and CASA will facilitate a suitable flight plan for the big fella!
I guess Santa is going to need some strategic planning to cover Australia in one pass without quarantining and hence delaying Christmas by 2 weeks for each border crossing. Let's see, start in WA, then -> Qld -> NT -> Tas -> Vic -> NSW -> ACT -> SA. Would that sequence work? Now just need to ensure the jolly fellow arrives into Perth by 10th December to wait our his quarantine in a suitable WA tourist hospitality establishment.
I'm pretty sure Airservices Australia and CASA will facilitate a suitable flight plan for the big fella!

Previously used flight path is here
:)
 
I just read

Vic announced 2 day border closure, then after that a permit system

And some changes as SA lockdown changes, so perhaps more easing on Day 7, then Day 15

Article at 3:24pm today, so not sure how much of it is a hot-take

My sister and I had both been planning to get home to SA and the rest of the family for Christmas/New Year. That obviously is now in doubt.

The back up plan is as soon as there is any lessening of the border restrictions we will just get in our respective cars and go. Just. Go.

I can worry about what I tell work later. :rolleyes:
 
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Disagreeing with his opinions is your prerogative but implying that his opinions are based on political pandering is not something that I believe is justified.

QLD CHO is a former ED Dr, 15 years in the role advising 4 premiers of the 2 major parties.

But in summary:

QLD / WA / NT / ACT CHO's - political pawns
NSW / SA / TAS CHO's - upstanding evidence based professionals
 
QLD CHO is a former ED Dr, 15 years in the role advising 4 premiers of the 2 major parties.

But in summary:

QLD / WA / NT / ACT CHO's - political pawns
NSW / SA / TAS CHO's - upstanding evidence based professionals
LOL. Of course nothing to do with the party in power. :D
 
The ED doctor on here is a trained ED Specialist.Dr. Young is not an ED specialist.She graduated in 1986 and spent her intern year at Westmead hospital.She worked there in ED for the next 5 years before moving into Medical Administration in 1992.So a limited experience dealing with actual patients.

Now I can crow here.During my Uni Days in the 1960s I really wanted to get a High Distinction in one subject.In my 5th year the perfect opportunity presented itself-Public Health.And I did get my one high distinction. :)
 
There was a really great article on ABC comparing and contrasting the backgrounds, training, experience of all the CHO’s who influence the state border decisions, it was a few months ago and Google has not been my friend today to share it.

Basically Prof Sutton was amongst the most qualified and experienced and yes unsurprisingly the QLD CHO ranked close to the bottom.

This is not to say they aren’t fit for the ‘business as usual’ CHO job, but certainly for managing during a pandemic, a different background and experience was deemed more helpful than others.

The article wasn’t damning, just pointed it out and was in the context of of all the massive scandals with life critical border exemptions being denied resulting in lives being lost because of the lack of medical systems and processes up here in QLD.
 
QLD CHO is a former ED Dr, 15 years in the role advising 4 premiers of the 2 major parties.

But in summary:

QLD / WA / NT / ACT CHO's - political pawns
NSW / SA / TAS CHO's - upstanding evidence based professionals

I wonder how about Vic?
 

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