Self-funded WPs

[turtlemichael]

From my experience, most of my colleagues/friends who could most easily afford F/J travel, will not pay for it, preferring to save it or spend it at the destination. The ones who travel J are often the ones who can least afford it. Simply an observation. cheers

My observation is that most people who travel in F/J, at least from around these parts, do so because that is what they enjoy or want. It's up to them to decide how they spend their money. To me, within reason, a bed is a bed. I'd rather pay for more leg room and comfort on a plane than a 6 star hotel. But then I don't want to stay in a one star hotel either.

 

[Keith009]

Rarely people pay for F (of course, this is reflective of the inventory available); we have seen some cases and the logic does add up (e.g. some people weighing up J vs. F for work travel, or AONE* tickets).

I wouldn't pay for F travel myself because the difference between J and F is much smaller and not as stark as the difference between J and whY/whY+ IMO. Hence it's paid J for me with F as an occassional treat using miles/EVIPs/op ups.

To me, within reason, a bed is a bed.

But not all beds are equal. :shock::mrgreen:

I see accomodation as part of the overall experience.

Personally I'd rather travel J and stay at a W, than travel F and bunk at a youth hostel (like a few people I know do :-|) or a HI. :shock: *ducks from flames*

 

[anat0l]

But not all beds are equal. :shock::mrgreen:

I see accomodation as part of the overall experience.

I'd trade up the comfort of a classy room if it meant an opportunity on long-haul J or especially F (neither has happened yet :|).

But otherwise, I'd have to agree in some part. In selecting hotels, I weigh up:

• Points opportunities. If there are many, I may hotel hop rather than stick to one. Arduous daily task, but....
• Objective of the stay. If I'm MR'ing/SC running I'll try to keep it to a minimum or use hotel points.
• How long I'll be there. Most of my hotel stays are quite short - sometimes 1 or 2 nights (typically the former). A stay of less than 12 (actual in-room/in-house) hours in a nice hotel is a ridiculous waste of money IMHO (unless someone is paying ). (And don't start with me - yes I've broken my own rules before...)

But when travelling we do need a decent sleep. The least I ask for at times is a clean room that doesn't smell funny and a fresh bed to get some sleep. But if I'm there to relax, then obviously I'm going to look for something much better, even if it comes at a premium (viz. my recent weekend getaway where I had stays at the SYD and MEL Apt Hiltons).

 

[Keith009]

I've done a stay run once during the SPG double stay promo in late '07. And unless I am really desperate to retain PLT status I'd never do it again. This year i requalify on nights by a comfortable margin. Personally when it comes to hotels I care more about the status recognition and benefits than the hotel points so I wouldn't go out of my way to stay run just for bonus points or free nights. It's like $1 million worth of effort for $100k in reward.

 

[anat0l]

I've done a stay run once during the SPG double stay promo in late '07. And unless I am really desperate to retain PLT status I'd never do it again. This year i'm lucky enough to requalify on nights by a comfortable margin. Personally when it comes to hotels I care more about the status recognition and benefits than the hotel points so I wouldn't go out of my way to stay run just for bonus points or free nights. It's like $1 million worth of effort for $100k in reward.

I guess I forgot to mention that unless the purpose is truly for relaxation, hotels end up being a sort of "dead cost" to me (that's a really bad choice of words but I'm about to head off for lunch so I'm stuck on what to write). That is, I'd rather spend the money elsewhere, but given that "I might as well try and get something for it" then hotel hopping is a better alternative.

My trip to NZ was that: I bed hopped every day. It really didn't matter since I went out every single day and spent not much time in my hotel room (unless it was a really nice hotel - Hilton Auckland and Rendezvous Auckland springs to mind).

I haven't even thought about trying for hotel status (I only got HHG due to a promo - probably wouldn't come close to trying for HHG without any promos). But I'm also - like you - mostly in the opinion of maximising for status (where it can be practically done) rather than points. (c.f. QF SC runs vs. MRs).

 

[sr81]

I travel one long haul per year with numerous DOM Y trips. Always RTW and always a DONE from cheap location easily reachable from MEL. I look at the cost of a flexible RTW fare from MEL then look to see if I can't get a J fare for less than 3 times the cost. EG: this year I went to DPS to commence my DONE as a DONE3 from that location was the best value and USD6521.90 (at 90 AUcents). A LONE4 was about AUD3000.

I live very frugally, spend nothing on my car and cycle everywhere. I live it up once a year and I consider this money well spent.

DTM1 - I get your point and it can be realised across many different applications. Eg. a 19 year old freind of mine purchasing a $65,000 BMW on his $40,000 p.a. job.

But here's the kicker - It's how I spend my money and I feel I get value from it. I have no desire to get a mortgage and I have significant investments in the share market. Yes, I may be wasting money but this is a hobby and I make sure that I get MAXIMUM value. 16 segments this trip with the shortest leg being RDU-MIA then LHR -HEL and the longest HKG-JFK.

The cost per leg is USD408. That is good value considering the length and comparitive comfort of the travel.

 

[JohnK]

One thing I'd never compromise on though is accomodation which I often spend more on than air tickets.

This is one I will never understand. A room is a room and to me a $50 room achieves exactly the same as a $300 room unless I was trying to impress someone very special which is not the case. I would rather save the money on accommodation so that I have more to spend during the trip or save the money on accommodation to be able to plan additional trips.

And yes I have spent time in some nice rooms and it is always the same story. Lay on the bed and watch some TV, fall asleep, wake up in the morning, have a shower and either go out for the day, if staying more than 1 night, or check out.

We are not all the same. For me it is all about maximising the number of trips I can have in 1 year while keeping the costs down to a minimum. Before the collapse of the A$ I could have a 2 week trip in Thailand for ~$A5,000 so 3 trips a year would cost $A15,000. The 2 easiest areas to keep the costs down is airfares and accommodation. YMMV....

 

[Keith009]

A room is a room and to me a $50 room achieves exactly the same as a $300 room unless I was trying to impress someone very special which is not the case.

The hotel does form an integral part of the experience for me. When I stay at a good hotel, the hotel enhances the experience rather than just being a place to sleep. A great hotel makes the trip even more memorable. And after a hard day of shopping or clubbing, it is nice to rejuvenate in style. Some hotels are an experience in themselves even. Apart from catching up with mates the main reason for my stop in Hong Kong back in Sept was to stay at the W Hong Kong. I'm traveling to Istanbul in January for no reason other than to check out the new W Istanbul, though of course it helps that I've never been to Istanbul and it is also apparently a nice place to visit.

Cost wise i'd rank my costs as follows:
1) Shopping
2) Accomodation
3) Entertainment (food, drinks, the touristy malarkey if any)
4) Air fare

 

[serfty]

The hotel does form an integral part of the experience for me. ...

As per the thread title; one doesn't get WP from sleeping in Hotels.

Cutting costs within reason is ok. I've tried backpacker type accommodation (not dorm), but not for me- then again I would not ante up the $$ for premium accommodation unless there was a good 3rd party reason.

When travelling with SWMBO, a greater proportion of our unit expenditure is for accommodation than just myself travelling - she like to be "comfortable". It's not worth my while booking an Ibis for her, whereas I have no issue as long as it's not expensive.

I try to maintain status with Hilton as I like the comp breakfast and occasional lounge access - so I sometimes spend a bit more than I otherwise would. I would not pay for an exec room if it was just me travelling.

 

[JohnK]

Cutting costs within reason is ok. I've tried backpacker type accommodation (not dorm), but not for me- then again I would not ante up the $$ for premium accommodation unless there was a good 3rd party reason.

I have so far being able to avoid backpacker type of accommodation and for me it would never be an option. I think most 2-3 star hotels are actually quite reasonable and become more important if I am staying for 10-12 nights.

So we get off topic occasionally.

 

[QF WP]

I have also enjoyed reading everybody else's experience.

After joining QFF in Feb 1989 (with my first trip paid for with employment income - a self funded trip to USA), I was a 100% SF until 2002. Was "old" Silver (later to be Gold) from about 1994 to 2001 - all self funded.

In 2001, I had a health scare (cancer) and an epiphany - better to enjoy what I have earned than be the richest in the graveyard. For my 35th birthday, I bought a RTW in F (later I learn from here and FT that it turns out to be known as an AONE4), with a Concorde supplement. Best trip I have ever taken and totally spolied me for whY travel in the future. Got WP in time for my birthday...and 2,365 SC's that year (still my highest)

At that point, upgraded my future International travel to SIN/BKK/LHR to BA's Premium Economy (WT+/PE) [whatever we each call it] and gave QF whY the flick on those sectors. Even used BA's J one way, WT+ - ah, those were the days when deals were $1,200 WT+ BNE/SYD/SIN/SYD/BNE and $1,600 to BKK. Being single, would think nothing of flying to SIN and BKK for a weekend (at that point, my best friend lived in SIN and was a *G Elite).

Then my flying changed in July 2002, when my company landed a corporate deal that involved regular travel to our clients' offices (CNS/TSV/SYD/CBR/MEL/ADL/PER), so flexibility was required and my K (or higher) class for domestic (work) travel was born. I now had friends & clients around the world, so an annual DONE4 was also born. At the same time, met the future Mrs LW and thankfully, she still wanted to do some travel before we really settled down.

However, due to changes in my company (bought out part of four amily business with brother and another business partner), I now pay for my own expenses - but K class is still an imperative. Then Mrs LW settled into having children (one down, working on number 2) and my travels have lessened further due to changes in my client base so I resigned myself to dropping to QF Gold this year (1 March). Leisure travel is now annual trips to NAN and AKL - thankfully there is LAN's J to AKL), Am comfortably about to re-qual Gold (next week's trip to ADL will get me remaining SC's) but won't make Plat, as I'll be transferring my crediting to AAdvantage.

 

[serfty]

... So we get off topic occasionally.

For me priority is:

• Air Travel - destination
• Air Travel - Cost/SC
• Air Travel - Cost
• Destination - Local activity
• Accommodation - Cost
• Accommodation - cost/benefit

Hey, I like staying at the millennium Hilton in BKK, but that's because the most I have paid has been about USD120 for a night and it's location (see Accommodation - Cost/Benefit)

 

[Starship]

When travelling with SWMBO, a greater proportion of our unit expenditure is for accommodation than just myself travelling - she like to be "comfortable". It's not worth my while booking an Ibis for her, whereas I have no issue as long as it's not expensive.

I agree. Other than the great accomodation deal i get at SPG [nothing to do with points] i normally stay in 2 / 3 star hotels or at a club*.

* - possibly the point for another thread, [not sure how to set up a thread here] but an overseas membership of the Royal Scots Club, Edinburgh is v cheap and gives reciprocal rights to great clubs in fantastic locations i could not access otherwise. eg NY Athletics club, next to the World Plaza. A diff atmosphere to the hotel's depending upon what you are looking for.

Arrived home from EK flight Mel - DXB - JED [jeddah] - RUH [Riyadh] -DXB - MEL in May this year and in the time between departing DXB - MEL, SWMBO +2 kids had decided they were accompanying me on EK to Paris / Marseille the next day for a 10day get out of school on a junket trip!. [my plan only allowed for 5 days in marseille and an overnight in Paris before return, but had conviced my PA to reschedule meetings] SWMBO had flights, TGV and hotels booked - all 5 star. In fact Marseille was 2 penthouse hotel suites [one for the kids] for 5 days which was more than the flights $ for the 4 - and then a little ritzy [$$$$] place in St Germain. Hmmm.....

So whether work related or leisure, all my travel for the last 15 years has effectively been self funded (my own cash from my business).

After 3 years of commuting MEL - ATL [Atlanta] and making friends with the Coke execs who weekly commuted direct from LAX using Delta, rather than hubbing in Chicago, Denver, or DFW - ended up configuring 3 weeks here / 3 weeks there. [Except for the Y trip on Boxing day MEL - LAX - ORD - ATL - 4 hours on the ground at the airport for a meeting - and then back home the same way]

Post that, had weekly MEL - SYD commute for 2 years going up Monday, back Wednesday.

Regular Long haul trips - 11 RTW's in Y, during 2006 gave me lots of status in various programs, used BA prem economy between LHR - IAD, but took it out of me so i slowed down the bookings, but now firing up again. You may have realised most of my travel is 'work' as family refuse to come on a 14 day trip with few nights in accomodation - or two legs in one day.

Now, 'appealing to the Gen X' types who work for me - offer them the choice of J if they go straight into a meeting from the time they land and out, or Y where they can have funded days off at their destination.

Have not had 1 elect the J option, after the first one came back from a weeks work in Geneva and 4 days skiing in the alps [which was cheaper than J, and the kudos we got was great].

I think i need to slot in a few more leisure trips (with time on a beach)!

 

[Alanslegal]

Now, 'appealing to the Gen X' types who work for me - offer them the choice of J if they go straight into a meeting from the time they land and out, or Y where they can have funded days off at their destination.

Have not had 1 elect the J option, after the first one came back from a weeks work in Geneva and 4 days skiing in the alps [which was cheaper than J, and the kudos we got was great].

wow, interesting choice

I too would choose the Y fare!!

 

[Keith009]

Though the purpose of flying employees around in J, as I understand, is to improve productivity as the idea is that you land refreshed and ready to go to work the moment you land.

I'd go for the J option myself since flying is half the fun anyway and you could always squeeze out some after hours leisure time at the destination.

I guess I might change my mind when I actually commence working full time, hopefully in a job that involves travel.

 

[drron]

Well I am another self funded traveller.I started back in 1969 when still a student.I had a spare $100,turned it into $400 on the stockmarket then spent it all on a trip to the Solomon Islands.Flew F on TAA SYD-POM as it was just $10 extra for that segment and I figured I could drink more than $10 of beer-well I do share a birthday with david Boon.Then on a DC3 to Lae,Rabaul,New Britain and on to Honiara.Spent 4 weeks on a medical boat going round the islands as well as a couple of weeks travel privately.spent time in Moresby and Rabaul as well.Flew home via Air fiji to POM then TAA back to SYD.Have loved travel ever since.
Fortunately my wife also loves travel but is much more particular where she stays-sure I will go camping as long as there are 5 stars overhead and I know some good motels-they go by the name of Sheraton or Hilton.
After finding AFF and FT I have joined the status quest.We had anyway decided to fly J as I find Y very uncomfortable-182cm with a bad knee that is most comfortable being straight doesnt go with Y.
Unfortunately with the current crisis I will be cutting back on travel-basically to work casually a little more so as to have more of the readies when finally there is an upturn.
I will retain AA EXP,HH diamond and SPG platinum until the beginning of 2010.After that I will retain AA plat,HH gold but hopefully continue SPG platinum.
To me the enjoyment is both the travel and the destination.I admit to enjoying the benefits of status such as upgrades and lounge access.Although in the past we have had great stays at 2-3 star hotels there were also some shockers.Even the worst 5 star experience will still be comfortable-at least so far.The complaints are usually about slipping standards and poor value.

 

[Commuter]

1) Shopping
2) Accomodation
3) Entertainment (food, drinks, the touristy malarkey if any)
4) Air fare

Haha, mine is:

1) Shopping (by far)
2) Air fare
3) Food
4) Accommodation (usually I barely spend time in the accommodation for all teh shopping activities)
5) Touristy things (not really drinks)

However, if I am going for relaxation, it will be
1) Accommodation
2) Food
3) Air fare

It's all about different purpose of the trip, I think. I even stay at Ibis for shopping convenience when that's the only convenient place (apart from Etap...)

 

[Starship]

To me the enjoyment is both the travel and the destination.I admit to enjoying the benefits of status such as upgrades and lounge access.Although in the past we have had great stays at 2-3 star hotels there were also some shockers.

Predominantly working in aviation, spending most of the night on the phone to Europe or the US and the days in the office, when i travel i am living my life in airports (who are some of my major clients), so i look forward to the long haul flight part as '14+ hours to clear the head and think / sleep / get to the destination'.

Yes - i am highly interested in the performance of the individual aircraft i am travelling on - and get strange looks from the FA's who do not know me - particularly as i look at my watch constantly on departure and arrival [timing certain aspects] as they think i might be 1/. co-ordinating a bomb plot 2/. something sinister 3/. a nightmare passenger - obsessive compulsive and already stressed out before we have even left the ground.

Generally i am timing runway clearance times [ie. from turn on to the runway until the rotation point (nose up) on lift off - or similarly on departure]

Even with optimised push back and taxiway routing at LAX [as part of the ASPIRE fuel reduction trials with the airlines / FAA / Airservices] the first Qantas A380 departure from LA last Monday night - took 29 minutes from push back until it was on the runway ready to roll!

So i also enjoy the lounges / upgrades - and being able to roll into a nice hotel after a series of meetings. Sheraton Frankfurt is one of my favourites as it is just there.

But being able to walk around Brussels for a day, check out the archeaological site under the Cathedral in Geneva, look at the paintings of the East Gallery in DC, stroll up Oxford Street looking at the shops, have coughtails in the Summer palace Vienna, go cycling in the Salzkummergut, try crab at Fishermans wharf in SF, drive to the top of the Rockies in Colorado, fish the Columbia river, 'play ball' at the John Grisham [not the real name, but he funded it so kids could play baseball] park in Virginia - are why i like travelling (for work). [That and meeting interesting people along the way - including some of the top experts in their fields from NASA / Boeing / Airbus.......].

I think i would want to do this, even if i was not getting paid for it!!
[albeit there are shocking experiences - hotels / wallets stolen / major delays / lost luggage - but we survive].

 

[Starship]

Though the purpose of flying employees around in J, as I understand, is to improve productivity as the idea is that you land refreshed and ready to go to work the moment you land.

Do not disagree QF009, but i tend to think counter intuitively. Many do not enjoy the travel journey aspect - after the first trip [as i have said, I have no problems paying J] but for some the preference is get there a day early, have a look around, go to the the meeting, take the afternoon off, see a show etc. etc. Yes they still need to deliver on the work!

In the competitive space for good employees, letting them have time off when travelling means they are conscientious - as they want more opportunities to do it again, feel like they have had some fun rather than just work, tell their friends, co-students, families about it [who also want to work for us]

As this thread is about people who self fund travel - and can in some instances comment on the rake of the seats of various configurations, the accumulation of points from a DONE4, the quality of the plonk, the range of the amenities, rate the menu in the Flounge, - clearly there is a self selection process here.

I have to try to also appeal to people for whom planes / wind direction / schedules are not the first things they think of when they wake up in the morning.

[my wife thinks i have not grown out of my boyhood enjoyment of planes - she is right - but she enjoys the hotels and the shopping]

 

[Evan]

I would say i am 65-70% self funded WP (the rest recently is all international Y for work). I wont stay in a cheap hotel if a good one can be had for a few $$ more, i managed 90% funded by work to become ICH PC RA (Priority club, IC Royal Ambasador) and i think its great, cant make SPG due to not enough good rates that work will pay for.

I will be WP until July 2010, after that who knows but i suspect i will find a way if not work related.

As for the Y vs J debate with days off etc mentioned by people here, i would love to have the choice, some counties i have been to before, and want in and out thats it, others i would take the time. As it happens i dont get a choice ! so whY it is.

E