OneWorld RTW Itineraries Involving Havana

[Cocitus23]

One of you wizards will be able to help me here, I'm sure.

I am trying to construct a OneWorld RTW itinerary, out of MEL, with just two compulsory stopovers: Vancouver (YVR) and Havana (HAV). But the rules create difficulties.

Firstly, any itinerary which includes a stop in Cuba must not include an American carrier anywhere. So this effectively precludes LAX or SFO as points of entry into North America, I think.

That's fine, we can get to YVR either via HKG (QF + CX) or NRT (QF and JL). Then we can take MX from YVR to MEX and on to HAV. Then IB could take us to MAD and on to LHR, from where QF could bring us home to MEL. Or could it? The flight from LHR to MEL will inevitably stop at either SIN or BKK or HKG, which means re-entering Asia a second time. I think this breaks the rules, or does it not count as "visiting Asia" if it is the same flight number all the way through from London?

Maybe I am missing some other obvious option(s). All ideas will be most appreciated.

Thanks,

Cocitus 23.

 

[serfty]

A second routing though in Asia can be had as long as one of them is a "transit without stopover".

To check this, try "Mileage Monkey" or do a 'dummy booking' using the oneworld xONEx booking tool:

oneworld planner

 

[notzac]

Unless you were dead keen to avoid the US, I would just book the DONE4 with a stop in MEX or CUN and then have a separate ticket on MX to do MEX/HAV/MEX or CUN/HAV/CUN. Do also check for the J prices on MX if you travel from MEX, as they're usually only slightly higher than the whY prices for that flight.

It will be far more convenient when the US work out that Cuba really isn't nearly so bad as they make out (though the flipside is that will mean dealing with american tourists whilst in Cuba... swings and roundabouts )

 

[docjames]

Unless you were dead keen to avoid the US, I would just book the DONE4 with a stop in MEX or CUN and then have a separate ticket on MX to do MEX/HAV/MEX or CUN/HAV/CUN. Do also check for the J prices on MX if you travel from MEX, as they're usually only slightly higher than the whY prices for that flight.

It will be far more convenient when the US work out that Cuba really isn't nearly so bad as they make out (though the flipside is that will mean dealing with american tourists whilst in Cuba... swings and roundabouts )

A side trip on MX is about a 50min flight CUN-HAV-CUN and although all Y class aircraft, at least until recently is on F100s which have 35" (yes, 35") pitch in Y.

An alternative way home would be BA LHR-JNB then QF JNB-SYD, but you add an extra continent and thus have a DONE5. Alternatively get a Circle Pacific and go home via EZE or SCL on LA/QF..

Both MX and LA fly MEX-SCL or MEX-EZE iirc.

 

[Cocitus23]

Thank you, gentlemen, all 3 of you. You have certainly all contributed excellent ideas, which I was confident would be forthcoming. As it happens, since posting my question I have had need to visit Qantas on other business so I discussed this topic as well.

Serfty, you are absolutely correct that a "transit without stopover" does not constitute a visit to a continent. So neither the proposed transit through HKG on the way out, nor passing through say SIN on the way home would count as having "visited Asia". Consequently, docjames, your fine lateral thought of coming home via JNB would still be a DONE4, rather than 5. (Australia, Nth America, Europe, Africa.)

Also, docjames, I was especially appreciative of your reminder about Circle Pacific tickets. I had forgotten totally about that possibility.

notzac, your suggestion of a separate ticket for HAV from either MEX or CUN was exactly the first reaction from Qantas, too. By the way, I smiled at and agreed with your comments about USA in relation to Cuba.

Qantas made one other suggestion, which may well turn out to be the cheapest. They said to take one of their specials on a return ticket MEL - YVR - MEL (via LAX both ways, and using Alaskan between LAX and YVR), and then buy a separate ticket in Vancouver for a return charter between there and Havana, which they described as being "dirt cheap, and including accommodation".

Yet another option they mentioned was a Global Explorer ticket.

So, gang, plenty of food for thought, and thanks to you and to Qantas, I think all the options are on the table.

One thing that this exercise has driven home to me (once again) is how weak the OneWorld coverage is in Canada. Even accessing YVR from LAX seems to be impossible, as the RTW rules do not seem to permit use of code shares.

Cocitus 23.

 

[markis10]

One thing that this exercise has driven home to me (once again) is how weak the OneWorld coverage is in Canada. Even accessing YVR from LAX seems to be impossible, as the RTW rules do not seem to permit use of code shares.

Cocitus 23.

One world coverage in Canada is poor because you have to compete with the flag carrier that is well known for being very competitive on the its home turf, to the detriment of product and prices when they succeed.

 

[Cocitus23]

Thanks, markis10, for your observation. Yes, I appreciate that AC has a stranglehold on the territory. It was so much better for us when CP was part of OneWorld. But we know what happened to CP. I guess that Star Alliance suffered a similar setback in Australia with the demise of AN.

Funny thing, I was living in Vancouver at the time that CP went under, and coincidentally QF ceased serving YVR. I was flying a tremendous amount on business, but it seemed to be all on Star Alliance carriers, because that was my only option. I had platinum status with QF, and one day I received a letter from them with words like "Dear Cocitus, We notice that you seem to have abandoned using Qantas and OneWorld services over recent months ...." I replied, "I haven't abandoned you. You have abandoned me! ...." It must have elicited some sort of sympathetic reaction, because they maintained my status, although I'm sure that for a few years I did not comply with the stated requirements.

 

[docjames]

Can I add - dont use Cubana. Use AC or MX. Cubana can be a nightmare to deal with in the event of flight issues (such as we had after Hurricane Ike went through and we were delayed).

We ended up buying new tickets on MX CUN-HAV (already on MX for HAV-CUN but had chosen Cubana for CUN-HAV due to better timings with inbound JFK-CUN flight on MX) - Cubana would barely give us the time of day, let alone any idea when we could be placed on a new flight. As usual with the more "marginal" carriers, their ability to recover from issues, is also, "marginal".

Let us know how you get on.

 

[serfty]

...

Serfty, you are absolutely correct that a "transit without stopover" does not constitute a visit to a continent. So neither the proposed transit through HKG on the way out, nor passing through say SIN on the way home would count as having "visited Asia". ...

Dunno about that!

I indicated a 'A second routing though in Asia can be had as long as one of them is a "transit without stopover".' - however if you touch Asia, (even on say QF9 MEL-LHR as your sole Asian landing) then you need to include Asia in your continental count.

 

[dede]

I'd like to help but I havana clue!

 

[Cocitus23]

Dunno about that!

I indicated a 'A second routing though in Asia can be had as long as one of them is a "transit without stopover".' - however if you touch Asia, (even on say QF9 MEL-LHR as your sole Asian landing) then you need to include Asia in your continental count.

Thanks for that correction, Serfty. Upon reflection, I'm sure you are right. Gee, there are some subtleties in these rules, aren't there?

My apologies to anyone whom I may have misled. In my discussions in the Melbourne Qantas office I was talking to their two resident experts on these fares, and they were both at pains to say that not only would a transit through SIN on QF9 be acceptable, but so would the transit through HKG involving a transfer from QF to CX. I wrongly jumped to concluding that since neither of them alone counted as "visiting Asia", nor would both of them on the one itinerary.

So coming home via Africa would indeed be a DONE5, I now believe.

Cocitus 23.

 

[docjames]

Thanks for that correction, Serfty. Upon reflection, I'm sure you are right. Gee, there are some subtleties in these rules, aren't there?

My apologies to anyone whom I may have misled. In my discussions in the Melbourne Qantas office I was talking to their two resident experts on these fares, and they were both at pains to say that not only would a transit through SIN on QF9 be acceptable, but so would the transit through HKG involving a transfer from QF to CX. I wrongly jumped to concluding that since neither of them alone counted as "visiting Asia", nor would both of them on the one itinerary.

So coming home via Africa would indeed be a DONE5, I now believe.

Cocitus 23.

That was my interpretation when looking at a LONE4 last year (to avoid it becoming a LONE5).

 

[Happy Dude]

Hi Cocitus,

You can access the US with Havana on your itinerary so long as you use the non-US carrier codeshare.

You could use MEX as a hub for travel to HAV and the US? Something like:

YVR-MEX-HAV-MEX-the US-MEX-MAD (all on MX, or MEX-MAD on IB)

I am departing in a fortnight on a LONE4 and I'll be visiting Cuba, but because I'm travelling domestically in the US and didn't have heaps of segments spare to utilise the JL codeshares between the cities I'm visiting, I will book MEX-HAV-CUN separately.

I concur with the others about Asia. You can have a stopover in one direction and touch down in the other.

 

[Cocitus23]

Thanks, docjames and Happy Dude, for your insights. I appreciate your input.

Cocitus23.