Oneworld Classic Flight Reward Discussion - The Definitive Thread

[Danger]

A number of members have reported trying to add a FF seat to an existing reservation when they can see a seat available on Qantas but the call centre agents can't. I ran into this today, not on a oneworld classic award but a regular frequent flyer booking on oneworld carriers and I think I may have some insight.

I was trying to change an existing, 3-leg itinerary ex-Paris. The already booked reservation included a LHR-HEL and that's what I wanted to change to a few hours earlier. I could see the seat on Qantas and ExpertFlyer showed one seat left. The agent couldn't see any seats in either class. While we were on the phone, I booked online the seat she couldn't see and expressed my aggravation at having to do it this way as I was now unprotected on an onward long-haul leg.

The agent looked into it and her conclusion was when I asked her to make the change, she was looking at availability priced in euros, not British pounds. I asked if this was a point of sale thing and she said no, just the system or screen they use. When she later looked for seats priced in pounds, she also couldn't see any but that's likely because I took the final seat.

I think the takeaway here is that if you're trying to add a flight that's priced in a different currency to what the existing itinerary is priced in, you may get an error over the phone. I don't know if asking the agent to search for availability on the 'screen' that shows availability priced in the original currency would help (or even be possible), but it might be worth a shot.

I've now had a second experience with this.

Two days ago I wanted to add CX LAX-xHKG-MEL to an existing oneworld award. Like everyone else when they go to do this, the flights were available online, but when I asked the HBA-based agent to add them, he couldn't see them. I said I could see them online; why can't he? He told me there's often a "synchronisation issue" that means availability is not updated across platforms at the same time and that if I tried to book the seat myself, it would fall at the payment page. Challenge accepted! I proceeded to book and confirm the very seat he couldn't see. I gave him the reference and he went away to investigate. After a few minutes on hold he returned to the call to tell me that it's a limitation imposed by Cathay and out of Qantas's control.

There's obviously multiple accounts of this sort of issue occurring. I'm now convinced it's not a limitation of offshore call centres (either through incompetence or poor training). Equally, I'm not convinced that the two excuses I've been given (different available from different currencies (rather than point of sale) in the case of the AY issue and a third party limitation in the case of CX) are accurate. They may well be true but my feeling is it's a Qantas deficiency somewhere in the booking system and it's much easier to blame someone or something else.

 

[yaksha98]

I sadly haven't heard of any tales of reinstatement requests being successful in the dozens of incidences on this forum alone The good news for mine is I was planning on changing the date of those flights anyway, otherwise I'd be stuffed (QR at xmas time - no chance at this late date).

My advice would be look for an acceptable solution on QF flights - if pushed they can convert paid flights to award bookings. But only on their own metal.

I was successful in my reinstatement request with a dropped QR flight - my (long winded) post on the whole saga is here: "oneworld" award (132.4K/249.6K/318K/455K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

 

[blu]

After unsuccessfully asking two Agents for a Reinstatement Request to QR, we tried the online feedback option . That resulted only in a form letter about travel insurance.

 

[Atlascat]

I was successful in my reinstatement request with a dropped QR flight - my (long winded) post on the whole saga is here: "oneworld" award (132.4K/249.6K/318K/455K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Thanks, that gives me a little hope but I suspect I’d have to fight very hard with Qantas like you did and I’m not sure if it’s worth the energy. Might just have to fly economy instead unfortunately.

 

[Capt. Clarence Oveur]

I have had a similar experience today - I have an existing J booking that I wanted to change due to cancellation of one of the legs. I did quite a bit of searching on the Qantas classic rewards search tool and came up with 6 new flight segments, all showing availability, but the call centre person told me those flights are "only for new bookings" and what she could change my booking over to was showing zero availability for all flights Australia to Europe Jul-Sep next year. Therefore she advised me to cancel the booking and do a new booking if I wanted to take those flights on the website.

Is this just a way of QF getting people to cancel their bookings, take the cancellation fees and churn us, hoping we will go away and find something else to use these points for? Honestly, though if you never get to use these points they are practically worthless.

HI Brideshead - sounds like you are on the mark...I'm in same position as you. I've had 3 calls so far to try and swap out a leg on my OWA when I found a better available leg. I am concerned they will cancel the whole OWA.
Lack trust they will do the right thing.
good luck
Oveur

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I've now had a second experience with this.

Two days ago I wanted to add CX LAX-xHKG-MEL to an existing oneworld award. Like everyone else when they go to do this, the flights were available online, but when I asked the HBA-based agent to add them, he couldn't see them. I said I could see them online; why can't he? He told me there's often a "synchronisation issue" that means availability is not updated across platforms at the same time and that if I tried to book the seat myself, it would fall at the payment page. Challenge accepted! I proceeded to book and confirm the very seat he couldn't see. I gave him the reference and he went away to investigate. After a few minutes on hold he returned to the call to tell me that it's a limitation imposed by Cathay and out of Qantas's control.

There's obviously multiple accounts of this sort of issue occurring. I'm now convinced it's not a limitation of offshore call centres (either through incompetence or poor training). Equally, I'm not convinced that the two excuses I've been given (different available from different currencies (rather than point of sale) in the case of the AY issue and a third party limitation in the case of CX) are accurate. They may well be true but my feeling is it's a Qantas deficiency somewhere in the booking system and it's much easier to blame someone or something else.

Wow!

I would not have expected that sort of issue from HBA.

I know HBA agents are competent, but I really can’t understand how CX’s systems are so fine tuned that they can go into an existing booking and limit a completely stand-alone sector being added!

I suspect it is a QF imposed limitation of some sort, designed to reduce, more generally, maximum benefit being derived from any award?

 

[Warragul]

Wow!

I would not have expected that sort of issue from HBA.

I know HBA agents are competent, but I really can’t understand how CX’s systems are so fine tuned that they can go into an existing booking and limit a completely stand-alone sector being added!

I suspect it is a QF imposed limitation of some sort, designed to reduce, more generally, maximum benefit being derived from any award?

I don't think the CX partition in the Amadeus ecosystem (QF is in there as well) would need to do that. A new standalone booking would not have the existing segments incluing in the flight details provided to CX, whereas adding to an existing booking would. So once existing segments are detected then the addtional ones are rejected and hence the failure.

Well thats a theory anyway.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I don't think the CX partition in the Amadeus ecosystem (QF is in there as well) would need to do that. A new standalone booking would not have the existing segments incluing in the flight details provided to CX, whereas adding to an existing booking would. So once existing segments are detected then the addtional ones are rejected and hence the failure.

Well thats a theory anyway.

Would that not just be for connecting travel either side of the CX flight that requires cx to check-in or receive a passenger for?

But more importantly, what motivation would CX have to restrict that? It is still selling the FF seat, I can’t see any revenue benefit.

 

[djkelly69]

I said I could see them online; why can't he?

Do you know if the agent could see the individual sectors if searched by themselves? It sounds like it might be a throughfare issue.

 

[Warragul]

Would that not just be for connecting travel either side of the CX flight that requires cx to check-in or receive a passenger for?

But more importantly, what motivation would CX have to restrict that? It is still selling the FF seat, I can’t see any revenue benefit.

Agree re CX motivation question.

In my experience Amadeus hosted carreirs will receive the entire itinerary of a booking that as segments on other Amadeus hosted carriers. A 'benefit' of sharing the same record locator.

 

[hutch]

Every time I book one of these 318J tickets, I tell myself never again... Qantas certainly does not make life easy.

Anyway, does anyone know if I will have married segment issues with separately searched Malaysian and JAL flights?

My routing of concern is:

KUL-NRT on MH
HND-HEL on JL

I found J availability on each leg separately.

There is less that 24 hours between flights, so this is a transit and not a stopover. I know I can't do JAL-JAL in this scenario unless I search KUL-HEL and find availability that way, but hoping I won't have issues with the separate carriers.

Overall routing is:

CBR-SYD-ICN (stop) - QF
ICN-KUL - (stop) - MH
KUL-NRT (transit) HND-HEL (stop) MH/JL
HEL - ORD (stop) - AY
ORD - HND (stop) - JL
CTS-HKG (transit) HKG-MEL - CX/CX

 

[vetrade]

Every time I book one of these 318J tickets, I tell myself never again... Qantas certainly does not make life easy.

Anyway, does anyone know if I will have married segment issues with separately searched Malaysian and JAL flights?

The married segment issue only potentially comes into play when both flights are with the same airline, so you won't have this problem with separate carriers.

 

[hutch]

The married segment issue only potentially comes into play when both flights are with the same airline, so you won't have this problem with separate carriers.

Thanks, thought that was the case. Award isn't pricing as a OW award and that is the only thing that I think could be causing that...

Other than QF error.

 

[vetrade]

Thanks, thought that was the case. Award isn't pricing as a OW award and that is the only thing that I think could be causing that...

Other than QF error

It's well known that CX frequently imposes a block on married segments transiting HKG, so your CX flights CTS-HKG-MEL could well be the problem. You can get around it by having a stopover in HKG rather than a transit. The theory is that they want to force you to spend some time in HKG so that you spend some money there.

 

[hutch]

It's well known that CX frequently imposes a block on married segments transiting HKG, so your CX flights CTS-HKG-MEL could well be the problem. You can get around it by having a stopover in HKG rather than a transit. The theory is that they want to force you to spend some time in HKG so that you spend some money there.

More than happy to spend time in HKG. Though, think I'm out of stopovers. I'll see if I can find some ORD - HKG availability

 

[djkelly69]

Award isn't pricing as a OW award and that is the only thing that I think could be causing that...

Assuming you are trying to book online, the system has been known to have issues with visiting an airport more than once (despite the fact it is allowed in some circumstances).

 

[Danger]

Do you know if the agent could see the individual sectors if searched by themselves? It sounds like it might be a throughfare issue.

I'm afraid I didn't ask but given CX's love of married segments, I can't imagine it would have been possible.

 

[tooten69]

Hi all, quick question.

How likely is it for yourself and your bags to make this suggested connection? I feel that a 25/30min transit time is crazy... Has anyone had experience with something this tight?
(it seems like AA bookings have this tight turn around time on many suggested bookings!)

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Hi all, quick question.

How likely is it for yourself and your bags to make this suggested connection? I feel that a 25/30min transit time is crazy... Has anyone had experience with something this tight?
(it seems like AA bookings have this tight turn around time on many suggested bookings!)View attachment 302641View attachment 302640

They are doable. I had a similar connection a few months ago in CLT. We were ultimately late arriving due to a storm and I had just ten minutes to get from gate to gate. I made it but unfortunately the bags just missed out. They were forwarded the next day by courier. AA paid out AUD60 for essential purchases I’d made to get me through the night/day.

People and bags routinely make these connections.Worth noting in the USA that the block time and flight time can can vary wildly… MCO-DCA is blocked at 2hrs15 but the flying time is around 1hr30. So there’s usually wiggle room.

 

[tooten69]

They are doable. I had a similar connection a few months ago in CLT. We were ultimately late arriving due to a storm and I had just ten minutes to get from gate to gate. I made it but unfortunately the bags just missed out. They were forwarded the next day by courier. AA paid out AUD60 for essential purchases I’d made to get me through the night/day.

People and bags routinely make these connections.Worth noting in the USA that the block time and flight time can can vary wildly… MCO-DCA is blocked at 2hrs15 but the flying time is around 1hr30. So there’s usually wiggle room.

Oh great, thanks for the information.