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No reply to disrespectful manner in which Qantas Club access was denied

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username-tba

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Disrespectful treatment by Qantas staff at the Adelaide Qantas Club

I am adding my experience to the many others who have been denied access to the QANTAS Club. On the morning of the 22nd November, my office administrator suggested that I should go to the QANTAS Club in Adelaide, showing my JetStar boarding pass, and my (by then recently expired) Gold Card to have breakfast and carry out some computer work. My office administrator also informed me that although I was currently only at Silver Card status, monies had been paid on receiving an email offering "2 years for the price of one" QANTAS Club membership, so that I could qualify to be a QANTAS Club member regardless of 'card' status.

I have always had difficulty in using any QANTAS Club entitlement, even as a Gold Card bearer, because I travel casually and I believe that a "Club" status should be a certain level of decorum, behaviour, and dress code standard. While easily conforming to decorum and behaviour, I did not believe that I was up to dress standard to enter the QANTAS Club (and this doesn't mean I wore soiled clothes and shoes, but rather I that wore smart casual attire with closed casual footwear but not to a level that I considered to be "Club" status, i.e., a suit and tie). However, at the urging of my office administrator and other colleagues who proffered that my expectation of dress code was too high, from July this year I began frequenting the QANTAS Club and did so often accompanied by my office administrator. To my surprise I found it peopled with what I call "riffraff", i.e., working class people who walked into the Club in work boots, high-visibility reflective clothing, thongs-and-board-shorts (as though they have walked straight off the beach) and other types of low-level attire. One time, for instance, in reference to behaviour, I saw and commented to a colleague, on one young male individual who that taken off his thongs and relaxedly lounged on a padded sofa with one leg draped over the arm rest and his other bare foot on the seat. This is not what I expect(ed) of a "Club" setting.

I am unashamedly an intellectual elitist, and as a post WWII immigrant to this country I have spent decades educating myself, mixing with educated and sophisticated academics, intellectuals, and politicians, and have avoided the people who are football followers, BBQ attendees, and represent the 'salt of the earth' Australian population. I will add that although I have this attitude, I have every right to be here, even as an intellectual elitist amidst a sea of riffraff, in that I have contributed more to Society and the Australian quality of life than the vast majority of Australia people - in 40 years, philanthropically, I have contributed some $7 million to the knowledge and welfare of this country, and will not tolerate what is often levelled at me in response to my attitude: 'if you don't like the country, then leave it'. Yes, I don't like many of attributes of the people of this country, similar to the conclusions of many learned people of this country, but I have a right to be here, more than most, and I have a right to criticise the mediocrity that largely make up its population (as many other learned people of this country have done). And this letter of criticism is directed to what the QANTAS Club has become. This QANTAS Club denied access to a member of Australian Society who is not riffraff.

At about 10:15 on 22nd November at the Adelaide Airport QANTAS Club the following took place:

I approached the QANTAS Club desk (a woman was at the counter); following the advice of my office administrator, I handed over my JetStar boarding pass, and my (expired) Gold Card to gain access.
I was denied access.
When I asked for my Gold Card back, it was denied and essentially confiscated, with the statement that it was expired and that it didn't belong to me, - I consider this to be an affront.

A supervisor was called in and upon hearing the story asked for proof that I was a Silver Card bearer (such as the card itself), or proof that I was a paid member (he asked for a receipt) - now this is ridiculous - I have an expired Gold Card, QANTAS actually had not sent me a replacement Silver Card, and for the second matter why would I carry at all times a receipt of the paid membership?
QANTAS should have had on its computer database that I was a paid 'Club' member
QANTAS should have had on its computer database that I holding a Silver Card

I walked out insulted, and sent a text to my office administrator as to the unfolding of events to keep a record of those events.

I have been a QANTAS Frequent Flyer member since the 1980s, and with that action in Adelaide, coupled by the action of QANTAS senior personnel grounding all planes in recent times over an industrial dispute (an event that dismayed me), QANTAS lost a loyal customer. To me, now, QANTAS is just another carrier as mediocre and low standard as the rest.

I will continue to draw benefits of accruing points when I travel by the QANTAS carrier, as is my right, but I will not be making QANTAS my firm’s preferred carrier as it has been up to now, and I will not be frequenting the QANTAS Club - it is below my standard. And further, to consolidate my attitude, I do not want QANTAS to send me any cards in future.

A colleague of mine in reading this text, asked: "what do you expect QANTAS to do here?…… they won't care".

This is what I expect: a microsecond of shame on the part of those within QANTAS when they read this text to see that the company has failed, and a microsecond of shame on the part of the staff at the Adelaide counter when they see their level of mediocrity and narrow vision [QANTAS staff, in dealing with thousands upon thousands of travelling people, actually should be trained to see a level of broad laterality in the population and not react in a narrow minded manner as did the staff at Adelaide.]

This complaint was faxed to Qantas over a month ago, and I am still waiting for a reply…..
 

TonyHancock

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Not sure about the Qantas Club Membership aspect but the cards definitely belong to Qantas.

I would expect your QF account to show your club membership. Was there no way you could have logged in on iPad/mobile phone to show this. Could your office administrator have helped with club details. I'm not defending Qantas but I'm sure they would have a multitude of folk trying to gain access that, unlike yourself, were not entitled to access. It does seem odd that they couldn't see your membership though.

The problem with the Adelaide Qantas Club is that there is no Business Lounge so you would have to mix with working class riff raff like myself...although I do make a good fist of being a DYKWIA. :p
 

Austashes

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My office administrator also informed me that although I was currently only at Silver Card status, monies had been paid on receiving an email offering "2 years for the price of one" QANTAS Club membership, so that I could qualify to be a QANTAS Club member regardless of 'card' status.

I can understand that you are upset, but I do not think that your office admin has given you correct advice. Now Iam not disagreeing with what you have described,but had Qantas recieted your payment then you would have been granted entry, as something similar occured at my office. In my experience the office had posted the payment for accounts to pay however the transaction had not occurred at teh time of entry. Lucky forJim I was a few minutes behind him and was able to escort him into the club.

So again, I would confirm that the transaction had occurred, even electronic BPAY payments can take over night. So it MAY be an error oneither side. I don't work for QANTAS, but your email doesn't confirm that your company had completed teh transaction, that's all.
 
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markis10

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Monies paid does not mean membership processed, if it was processed a print out of the current online membership would have sufficed for the prepared individual to gain access. Often less is more when it comes to feedback in a constructive manner.
 

Princess Fiona

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This complaint was faxed to Qantas over a month ago, and I am still waiting for a reply…..

Frankly I'm not surprised. I think they're still probably trying to decipher it all from your "intellectual elitist" point of view.

As I understand it you tried to enter the Adelaide Qantas club on the 22nd of November with an expired Qantas Gold Card and a verbal reassurance that your office administrator had paid Qantas club membership for you due to your drop in status.
The staff took the expired Gold card from you and denied you entry to the Qantas Club as they had no record of Club Membership for you and you couldn't produce any tangible evidence that you had paid membership.
As an aside you have issues with the dress code in Qantas Clubs.
May I suggest that you verify with the office administrator that you did indeed have a valid Qantas Club membership on 22nd November and write a succinct email to Qantas about the denial of access.
Maybe leave out the "intellectual elitist paragraph" and the dress code complaint for another time as they IMO add little to your complaint.

Welcome to AFF :)

PF
 

jlm

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It's appears the transaction to purchase Qantas Club membership had not gone through at the time you attempted entry.

What start date does your account show now?

As for the rest: get over it. What people wear has no relation to their intelligence or position in society. The Qantas Club is not some exclusive invitation-only aristocratic Gentleman's Club. It's a room with seats and food to wait for a flight. If you have a problem with that try a private jet, because I think you will find the same problem with Business and First Class lounges.

Welcome to AFF.
 

Aussie_flyer

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It's appears the transaction to purchase Qantas Club membership had not gone through at the time you attempted entry.

What start date does your account show now?

As for the rest: get over it. What people wear has no relation to their intelligence or position in society. The Qantas Club is not some exclusive invitation-only aristocratic Gentleman's Club. It's a room with seats and food to wait for a flight. If you have a problem with that try a private jet, because I think you will find the same problem with Business and First Class lounges.

Welcome to AFF.

seems we think alike
 

medhead

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That sounds about right for the ADL qantas club. I've had many similar attitude experiences from the ADL QC staff. (I'll refrain from describing which staff member i think it woul have been). However, you should have asked them to check your profile details in the computer. I also would have insisted on keeping the gold card precisely because they have not yet sent you a replacement card.

I entirely disagree with you about the dress standard. The QC rules clearly state smart casual not business attire. So you are wrong to claim that smart casual is not up to standard. Work clothes are another matter but I'll leave it at that, as it is a topic not worth discussing.

I can understand that you are upset, but I do not think that your office admin has given you correct advice. Now Iam not disagreeing with what you have described,but had Qantas recieted your payment then you would have been granted entry, as something similar occured at my office. In my experience the office had posted the payment for accounts to pay however the transaction had not occurred at teh time of entry. Lucky forJim I was a few minutes behind him and was able to escort him into the club.

That's not exactly correct. OP was travelling with Jetstar, so it is highly likely none of his details, ie status level or QC membership, were on the boarding pass. The QC staff member would have had to look up the member's details.
 

Mal

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I have always had difficulty in using any QANTAS Club entitlement, even as a Gold Card bearer, because I travel casually and I believe that a "Club" status should be a certain level of decorum, behaviour, and dress code standard. While easily conforming to decorum and behaviour, I did not believe that I was up to dress standard to enter the QANTAS Club (and this doesn't mean I wore soiled clothes and shoes, but rather I that wore smart casual attire with closed casual footwear but not to a level that I considered to be "Club" status, i.e., a suit and tie). However, at the urging of my office administrator and other colleagues who proffered that my expectation of dress code was too high, from July this year I began frequenting the QANTAS Club and did so often accompanied by my office administrator. To my surprise I found it peopled with what I call "riffraff", i.e., working class people who walked into the Club in work boots, high-visibility reflective clothing, thongs-and-board-shorts (as though they have walked straight off the beach) and other types of low-level attire. One time, for instance, in reference to behaviour, I saw and commented to a colleague, on one young male individual who that taken off his thongs and relaxedly lounged on a padded sofa with one leg draped over the arm rest and his other bare foot on the seat. This is not what I expect(ed) of a "Club" setting.

Lounge dress code is often discussed here. It's a very controversial subject. However, your apparent belief that the Qantas "Club" is more of an old style club is wrong. The Qantas dress code is in the T&Cs:

http://www.qantas.com.au/travel/airlines/qantas-club-terms-conditions/global/en#jump9
10.7 Smart, casual dress standards apply at all times. Individual lounge managers will have discretion to administer these standards as they reasonably deem appropriate in the circumstances.

And seems very liberal when actually applied at the lounge.

I approached the QANTAS Club desk (a woman was at the counter); following the advice of my office administrator, I handed over my JetStar boarding pass, and my (expired) Gold Card to gain access.
I was denied access.
When I asked for my Gold Card back, it was denied and essentially confiscated, with the statement that it was expired and that it didn't belong to me, - I consider this to be an affront.

A supervisor was called in and upon hearing the story asked for proof that I was a Silver Card bearer (such as the card itself), or proof that I was a paid member (he asked for a receipt) - now this is ridiculous - I have an expired Gold Card, QANTAS actually had not sent me a replacement Silver Card, and for the second matter why would I carry at all times a receipt of the paid membership?
QANTAS should have had on its computer database that I was a paid 'Club' member
QANTAS should have had on its computer database that I holding a Silver Card

Qantas does have records on their computer (linked through your FF number) regarding membership status. However, I suspect in your case, the payment had been made but hadn't yet been activated (Qantas normally say "Your membership will be activated 24 to 48 hours".)

As the Qantas cards do legally belong to Qantas (again in the T&Cs), they have the right to seize the Gold card that they suspected was being incorrectly used.

I will continue to draw benefits of accruing points when I travel by the QANTAS carrier, as is my right, but I will not be making QANTAS my firm’s preferred carrier as it has been up to now, and I will not be frequenting the QANTAS Club - it is below my standard. And further, to consolidate my attitude, I do not want QANTAS to send me any cards in future.

Your choice. I think there is a cooling off period for Qantas Club membership - or at least a pro-rata refund option available. So you can cancel the membership.

I suspect where everything went wrong was that you presented the expired card, the front door person checked it's validity on the computer and the computer said that your Qantas Club access hadn't been processed yet. If you had with you a receipt for the cost, discretion probably would have been shown. But as the staff have many people "trying it on", they get very weary of processing similar claims all day long.
 

Blackadder

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On your dress levels, there is no need to go to the extremes of a suit and tie even for the business lounge.
As an " intellectual elitist" , I would have thought you would seek confirmation from QANTAS regarding entry eligibility. Obviously personal responsibility doesn't extend to the intellectual elite.
 

PJMiller

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Welcome to AFF, and for a memorable first posting. Many more experienced AFFs than I, will I respond, I'm sure.

I do not fly with JQ, for reasons not dissimilar to yours. However, may I add, that I have found with Virgin Australia a level of politeness and generosity of spirit - to go " the extra yard' - that I consider to be very "Australian". Virgin put on extra flights to assist stranded passengers when QANTAS grounded its fleet last year, and again, when Air Australia collapsed. These events evidence to to me, that an "Australian spirit" does exist, and willingness to look after others passengers when in need. Being "stranded" by an airline is near top of my list of service poverty. I hope you enjoy the rich experiences that members of the Australian Frequent Flyer community freely share through this website.
 
Credit cards which earn frequent flyer points is a popular way to earn frequent flyer points. You can receive thousands of points on everyday spend. And, many of these cards offer generous signup bonuses! Compare to find the credit card that best suits your needs.

Recommended by the Australian Frequent Flyer

elvee

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Wow. An intellectual elitist would likely not judge others by their choice of clothing or the position they find most relaxing; nor would they find such difficulty in understanding the rules which permit entry to the QF Club. I fear you are someone who longs to be intellectually superior and achieves the feeling purely through misguided self-ascendance.

Some of the most influential, intelligent, well-educated and financially secure individuals I have ever met have on occasion presented themselves in gym singlets or tracksuit gear. The QF Club does not adhere to your laughably elitist expectations of clothing and decorum, and hence none of the 'riffraff' need change their style if they've already gained entry (a feat someone as elite as you was apparently not worthy of).

As some other posters above mentioned: get over yourself.
 

Fantic125

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Most probably not the response you are seeking, but, you have been treated correctly.

No membership, no status; no access.
 

medhead

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Seems some of us are getting a bit confused by the intellectual elite term. IME such intellectuals are only elite with respect to the topics that hold their intellectual interest. So it isn't really surprising that they might not be up to date with more mundane matters.

I also think that the word elite was not used as an overall I'm better than you. But that's just me.
 

samh004

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Oh I do love a good read.

This QANTAS Club denied access to a member of Australian Society who is not riffraff.

They denied you access because you weren't paid up, and surely an intellectual elitist like yourself knows that you do need a current membership, paid up as it were, to receive benefits of a club. Surely an intellectual elitist like yourself wouldn't have just taken the word of an office manager. I'm not discrediting his word, but you should always have some sort of proof, surely?

When I asked for my Gold Card back, it was denied and essentially confiscated, with the statement that it was expired and that it didn't belong to me, - I consider this to be an affront.

No doubt the action would cause offence, but it's perfectly in keeping with the terms and conditions that you agreed to when you became a member of Qantas Frequent Flyer, and the Qantas Club. Heck, even my Platinum card clearly states that the "use of this card is governed by the Qantas Frequent Flyer and the Qantas Club Terms and Conditions, as amended from time to time".

A cursory glance on the Qantas website reveals clause 6.2: The Card is and will remain the property of Qantas and must be returned on demand. It is not a payment card.

A supervisor was called in and upon hearing the story asked for proof that I was a Silver Card bearer (such as the card itself), or proof that I was a paid member (he asked for a receipt) - now this is ridiculous - I have an expired Gold Card, QANTAS actually had not sent me a replacement Silver Card, and for the second matter why would I carry at all times a receipt of the paid membership?
QANTAS should have had on its computer database that I was a paid 'Club' member
QANTAS should have had on its computer database that I holding a Silver Card

I do agree with you in the ridiculousness of the situation here. Having been a Gold member previously, you'd expect them to figure you for only Silver now, however there is a way to drop straight to Bronze, and that is if you hadn't taken the 4 required points-earning flights in the previous 12 months of your membership year.

At the very least, they could have checked your details in their system. I'm not sure why they didn't... although, I hope you weren't telling them how intellectually elitist you were at the time, because they may have considered that an affront, and worked from clause 10.6: Qantas Club staff have the discretion to refuse entry to any Member or guest at any time if, in their reasonable opinion, the Member has not or will not comply with these Terms and Conditions or the Club Rules, or the refusal is necessary or convenient for the orderly operation of the lounge or other facilities or the safety or comfort of other Members, their guests and staff.

QANTAS staff, in dealing with thousands upon thousands of travelling people, actually should be trained to see a level of broad laterality in the population and not react in a narrow minded manner as did the staff at Adelaide.

That's a bit pot calling the kettle black, don't you think?
 

elvee

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Seems some of us are getting a bit confused by the intellectual elite term. IME such intellectuals are only elite with respect to the topics that hold their intellectual interest. So it isn't really surprising that they might not be up to date with more mundane matters.

I also think that the word elite was not used as an overall I'm better than you. But that's just me.

Correct, however the OP seems have to used the term to encompass superiority in all its forms. It's a misuse of 'intellectual elitist' in that the OP was not privy to the intellectual status of the alleged 'riffraff' - but instead applied the term to suggest an explanation for differences in dress code.
 

airbridge

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I follow football and attend BBQs. I am a QP life member. Please, I beg you, cancel your membership.
 

The Rok

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I suspect the reason QF have not responded so far is that they have sent your complaint off to Manila to be translated into "Australian English" and then returned to QF Australia to respond to....

It took me a couple of reads to understand what your complaint was, clothing/dress standards in the QC or an access issue....

As others have said I suspect your Office Administrator was not fully aware of your current status with QC at the time of your entrance to the lounge...

Having said that, not sure that I would be crying over not being allowed into the ADL QP, its not exactly the Four Seasons....
 
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