MH's dirty tactics regarding COVID-affected flights

[MH_fan]

I've been hearing a lot about Malaysia Airlines' obstructive and underhanded methods in dealing with passengers with COVID-affected flights, so I wanted to share my experience and, hopefully, provide some advice to others who are in the same situation.

I had two sets of flights to South-East Asia (Bangkok and Hanoi) booked on MH in J at the start of the year for travel in October and November. These flights were, of course, booked before COVID completely shut the travel industry down. Both flights were booked through OTAs. When MH started messing around with the flight schedules in about May, I knew these flights would eventually have to be cancelled, which they eventually were by the airline.

These were the conditions/alternatives being offered:
1. Rebook the same flights/itinerary by Dec 31 for travel to be completed by Jun 30 but need to pay the fare difference for the new flights (which, of course, will be heinously expensive).
2. Turn the flights into a credit voucher for the value originally paid but the voucher needs to be used by Dec 31 for travel to be completed by Jun 30 (which can only be redeemed through their call centre, which won't have access to the cheaper fare buckets that would normally be available online).

After getting past the outrage at such ludicrous terms when other airlines are offering credits lasting 1-2 years or refunds, I refused to accept these terms. I know that these conditions are completely unrealistic and, rather than having to go through the whole process again at a later date, I would rather the money be back in my pocket. I eventually suggested that I'd be willing to pay a voluntary cancellation fee in order to get a refund. This turned out to be a good move, as MH agreed to this. The cancellation fee was $500 (for tickets that I'd paid between $2500 and $3000) but, in my eyes, this was acceptable as I'd be getting the bulk of my money back and won't have to deal with them again. Refunds are predicted to take about 4 months. Also be aware that some OTAs will charge a service fee in addition to the cancellation fee. Aunty Betty didn't (for the Bangkok flights) but Direct Flights (for the Hanoi flights) wanted a bit over $200.

This has left a sour taste in my mouth and I will be far less supportive of MH in the future, especially in the post-COVID recovery period when competition for customers will be fierce (and I'm also a front of the plane flyer).

Tip for airlines: how you treat your customers now will translate into how they treat you when you desperately need them in the future.

 

[moa999]

Might need to change your username then.

Agree though that airlines do need to consider the long-term consequences and reputational impacts of their actions

 

[MH_fan]

LOL! Yes, I have thought about changing my username...

When COVID is over, airlines are going to need customers who have money and I'm going to be one of them, so they better play nice now.
China Airlines have been wonderful to deal with and they will certainly be getting my support when we're able to travel overseas again.

 

[Seat0B]

It’s very interesting how different businesses have responded. Some have been very good to deal with (eg Finnair, QFlyer, Booking.com and Agoda for me). Some have been oK but not stellar (eg Qantas for me) and looking through this forum, some have been totally dreadful.

I hope we all remember this and do vote with our feet and wallets/credit cards when this is eventually over! But I’m fairly sure people have very short memories.

 

[MH_fan]

I agree with you that Finnair have been good to deal with as have QFlyer. Regular communication is what helps customers to be patient whilst waiting for refunds.
Oh, I will remember this and I suspect that people who aren't generally budget travellers (and are the front end travellers) will also have reasonably long memories.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

MH has a force majeure clause in their conditions of carriage at 10.2.3. So they will argue they aren't required to provide refunds due to cancellations outside their control. (but as an aside, it's not the loss of two of their aircraft in three months - one which the airline has given up searching for, and the other which potentially involves negligence - that makes you think twice about flying them... but the lack of a refund?)

 

[cbert]

Same issue for me, booked 3 tickets for elderly family members to travel to BKK this past Easter for a one off family event but flights of course cancelled.

Booked via FC (Byojet).

As they were cheap $600 return tickets they were non-refundable. Thus MH says no refund allowed, instead will to do me the favour and provide credit in the elderly passenger names to travel (at higher cost) before next 30 June, but they have no need to travel to BKK as family event is past.

I have no recourse as ACCC said they expect at a minimum a credit be given which MH has done.

But they wont allow me to put credit in my name to use even though I paid for it on my CC.

Plus travel insurance wont cover as pandmic is not covered event.

Also CC Amex wont charge back casue I am been given a credit.

Last resort is local Consumer Protection in QLD where Byojet is registred.

 

[MH_fan]

I had a flight in a similar situation. Cheapest economy ticket and same conditions. I elected to cancel outright so I'll at least get the taxes back (which they have to refund) but forfeit the rest. For a $600 ticket, you can get back about $150 per ticket.

 

[Isochronous]

Go to your local small claims court and you can probably win if you make the right arguments.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Go to your local small claims court and you can probably win if you make the right arguments.

What's the argument? MH's CoC says no guaranteed refunds for force majeure. ACCC confirms force majeure suspends absolute rights under ACL and voucher is acceptable if CoC provides.

What does that leave?

 

[cbert]

Yesh thats what I thought as well but Byo rep said "some taxes are non-refundable" , and they cant tell me how much not refundable until I cancel and agree for them to keep base fare.

Plus getting taxes from MH has been a nightmare, I had another flight just before COVID with them I couldn't take with about $200 in taxes.

They agreed to refund taxes but sent me in circles to seek refund from agent, then get agent to sign docs and know everytime I contact MH about my taxes I get silent treatment with no replies and call centre is no help.

Not sure what to do here (have no luck with MH!) as agent says its with MH and MH wont reply and this was a pre COVID airfare, about October last year.

I had a flight in a similar situation. Cheapest economy ticket and same conditions. I elected to cancel outright so I'll at least get the taxes back (which they have to refund) but forfeit the rest. For a $600 ticket, you can get back about $150 per ticket.

 

[cbert]

Go to your local small claims court and you can probably win if you make the right arguments.

Yeah I just need find time to do it, I am sure Court not going to knock back 3 aged old pensioners and tell them they must fly during pandemic or lose their airfare money....but lets see.

 

[Isochronous]

What's the argument? MH's CoC says no guaranteed refunds for force majeure. ACCC confirms force majeure suspends absolute rights under ACL and voucher is acceptable if CoC provides.

What does that leave?

The ACCC isn't a court. They don't make law.

As for the CoC - contracts can say anything they like. Doesn't mean a court will enforce its terms unquestioningly or at all.

 

[MH_fan]

Talk about double standards... MH give you such a short time to use any travel credits despite the uncertainty of overseas travel restrictions, which are definitely extending into next year, but they are taking their sweet time with refunds. I'm still waiting for the refunds for my Bangkok flights that were cancelled in mid-May! It's now over 3.5 months! AY took 5 months to refund my tickets that were cancelled in mid-March (bought via an OTA) so I guess I'll expect the same with these tickets since they were also bought via an OTA.

 

[Melburnian1]

Mattg's contention in his AFF article about how various airlines and other travel businesses have treated us that 'airline passengers have long memories' is debatable.

Australian voters certainly don't, and I don't believe travellers do either.

Old habits die hard. Look at how few Australians switch banks. A greater percentage switch electricity/gas retailers or telcos, but again, only a minority each year.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Mattg's contention in his AFF article about how various airlines and other travel businesses have treated us that 'airline passengers have long memories' is debatable.

Australian voters certainly don't, and I don't believe travellers do either.

Old habits die hard. Look at how few Australians switch banks. A greater percentage switch electricity/gas retailers or telcos, but again, only a minority each year.

I think passengers have ‘selective’ memories. They will forgive almost anything as long as it suits them (earning SCs, earning FF points, or a cheap fare). They will punish anything, even if unwarranted, if it confirms their prejudices.

 

[troels]

I am currently in a dispute with Malaysia over two (directly booked) tickets they cancelled by in March. I raised the dispute via my credit card company after Malaysia failed to respond to my requests for refunds. They have quoted some Malaysian domestic legislation (MAVEN) in support of their rejection of my claim but as far as I am concerned they have to operate under Australian law (ACL/ACCC) and rules.

Anyway I'm still fighting and will go to VCAT if necessary.

Why aren't ACCC going down the name an shame route like they did with Qantas and Eithad?

Singapore airlines by contrast refund me without fuss for flights on the same trip.

 

[oz_mark]

I am currently in a dispute with Malaysia over two (directly booked) tickets they cancelled by in March. I raised the dispute via my credit card company after Malaysia failed to respond to my requests for refunds. They have quoted some Malaysian domestic legislation (MAVEN) in support of their rejection of my claim but as far as I am concerned they have to operate under Australian law (ACL/ACCC) and rules.

Anyway I'm still fighting and will go to VCAT if necessary.

Why aren't ACCC going down the name an shame route like they did with Qantas and Eithad?

Singapore airlines by contrast refund me without fuss for flights on the same trip.

In the case of Qantas and Etihad, the ACCC basically held them to their own Conditions of Carriage/Contracts. Both of those airlines said the refund was an option if the airline cancelled. What does Malaysians contract say?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

In the case of Qantas and Etihad, the ACCC basically held them to their own Conditions of Carriage/Contracts. Both of those airlines said the refund was an option if the airline cancelled. What does Malaysians contract say?

It says no refunds for force majeure. But see also post #13 above - there could be a separate action available to the passenger outside anything the ACCC is willing to enforce.

 

[madrooster]

Why aren't ACCC going down the name an shame route like they did with Qantas and Eithad?

Does the ticket start from Australia? If not, then you would be bound by the origin's rules if you booked directly on their website.