Lower Frequent Flyer charges, review of International fare structure

[willjd]

From Qantas media
SYDNEY, 15 October 2004
The fuel surcharge will increase from $22 to $29 per sector, for international travel.
The Chief Financial Officer of Qantas Airways, Peter Gregg, said the airline had made the decision reluctantly.
"However, with jet fuel now at more than US$60 a barrel and showing no sign of falling, an increase in the airline's fuel surcharge was unavoidable," he said."

Fast forward to Dec 2014
News.com.au
The fee on a one-way economy ticket to destinations in Europe and North Africa will rise by $15 to $270, Oil was trading at $70 a barrel.

Oil has now dropped below the level of that in 2004 yet the fuel surcharge has now been absorbed into the ticket price. Some amazing "spin" from teh qantas marketing department to sell this one....

 

[vetrade]

Disappointing that QF have only seen fit to reduce the charges for Y & Y+.

And I'm guessing there won't be a refund for pax who have already booked and paid the taxes & fuel surcharges for award flights to be flown over the next 11 months......................

 

[robd]

Disappointing that QF have only seen fit to reduce the charges for Y & Y+.

And I'm guessing there won't be a refund for pax who have already booked and paid the taxes & fuel surcharges for award flights to be flown over the next 11 months......................

It seems it wouldn't make any difference to my upcoming Classic redemptions -

J Class, Europe & UK = Nothing.

 

[RichardMEL]

Until they drop to the level of Virgin Australia or the US carriers, this is not so much a 'positive' but a 'slightly smaller negative' for the program.

Would you also like QF service and amenities to drop to US carrier levels?

 

[Ansett]

We all recognise that Fuel Surcharge's have and are being used to allow for the ups and downs in the cost of fuel we should remember that airfares, primarily in Y, are significantly cheaper in real terms than they where 10 to 15 years ago. The real increase can be seen in premium classes such as J and F.

The real hurt is in redemption airfares especially in these cabins where taxes are extremely high to start wit

I for one would like to see fuel and other taxes abolished form award flights or at least reflect a more realistic price such as with AA redemption's.

They say the cost of redeeming flights has not increased what has happened is that the earn rate has decreased significantly in many cases thus making it harder to achieve the points required which in a small way to many members is an actual increase in cost to obtain said reward.

We all agree that QFF has been very profitable and will more than likely remain so. Surely it is time to bring redemption rates in line with the new zones and to charge customers on award flights a simpler and fairer price in points and money.

I for one have a target to achieve and will spend all my QFF points and shall going to BFOD. Loyalty is or should be a 2 way street and I do not see QF walking on the same planet as its frequent flyers never mind street.


Mile the cow too hard and it will kick.

 

[Supersonic Swinger]

Would you also like QF service and amenities to drop to US carrier levels?

I'm not sure what the QF service and amenities are which make earning QFF points and paying significantly higher fuel surcharges worth it. If I'm flying Trans-Pacific, now that UA have upgraded their fleet on the routes, in economy I get meals, video on demand and lounge access (if I have status) on all four airlines, yet QF has the economy seat with the least pitch and usually the highest pricing.

 

[amaroo]

It seems it wouldn't make any difference to my upcoming Classic redemptions -

J Class, Europe & UK = Nothing.

LOL I've just toasted >1.2M QFFP for our end of year Euro holiday ... kinda glad there isn't anything in that list.

 

[medhead]

From Qantas media
SYDNEY, 15 October 2004
The fuel surcharge will increase from $22 to $29 per sector, for international travel.
The Chief Financial Officer of Qantas Airways, Peter Gregg, said the airline had made the decision reluctantly.
"However, with jet fuel now at more than US$60 a barrel and showing no sign of falling, an increase in the airline's fuel surcharge was unavoidable," he said."

Fast forward to Dec 2014
News.com.au
The fee on a one-way economy ticket to destinations in Europe and North Africa will rise by $15 to $270, Oil was trading at $70 a barrel.

Oil has now dropped below the level of that in 2004 yet the fuel surcharge has now been absorbed into the ticket price. Some amazing "spin" from teh qantas marketing department to sell this one....

Be very careful. You've quote the price of a barrel of jet fuel from back in 2004. Not a barrel of oil.

Eia.gov is showing a price of $1.478 per gallon for US gulf coast kerosene-type jet fuel at 20 Jan 2015. 43 US gallons per barrel = US$63 per barrel US gulf coast kerosene-type jet fuel. We don't even know if that is a comparable bench mark for the 2004 figure.

 

[Catweazle]

Just to confirm, this would only result in a reduction of award redemptions on flights listed as a QF or JQ number? So, by way of example, no DXB - MRU on EK reductions?

 

[RichardMEL]

I strongly suspect the lack of change in UK/Europe fuel taxes are in line with EK, and QF are "bound" by that agreement. If/When/Maybe EK change their policy I think QF will be forced to match (ie wasn't there a case a couple of years back where QF and EK were out of whack on this)?

There may be more movement on this shortly though I don't know anything specific, just a feeling.

 

[markis10]

Be very careful. You've quote the price of a barrel of jet fuel from back in 2004. Not a barrel of oil.

Eia.gov is showing a price of $1.478 per gallon for US gulf coast kerosene-type jet fuel at 20 Jan 2015. 43 US gallons per barrel = US$63 per barrel US gulf coast kerosene-type jet fuel. We don't even know if that is a comparable bench mark for the 2004 figure.

Spot pricing is 47% dearer than in Dec 2004 if we us US pricing from their energy department as a benchmark.



Jet Fuel - Daily Price - Commodity Prices - Price Charts, Data, and News - IndexMundi

 

[RooFlyer]

Not disputing your illustration markis10 any ideas if Qantas might use a similar benchmark for its comparisons or forecasting? (ie closer to home region), or what market(s) it would do its hedges in?

What I'm thinking is that as the vast majority of its fuel is consumed in the Australasian region (ie including domestic), then maybe it would make its contracts out more locally as well? Where is Australian consumed jet fuel refined?

 

[Alanslegal]

I just booked EK flights JFK - DXB and the taxes were US $720 pp ..... crazy taxes

 

[markis10]

Not disputing your illustration markis10 any ideas if Qantas might use a similar benchmark for its comparisons or forecasting? (ie closer to home region), or what market(s) it would do its hedges in?

What I'm thinking is that as the vast majority of its fuel is consumed in the Australasian region (ie including domestic), then maybe it would make its contracts out more locally as well? Where is Australian consumed jet fuel refined?

I believe Qantas use Singapore Jet A1 pricing versus US spot pricing, for the purposes of trend there is unlikely to be much of a variance between the two benchmarks across the time frames we are talking about

 

[andye]

Am I right to assume this will not be retrospective for award flights bought but not flown yet?

 

[vetrade]

It seems it wouldn't make any difference to my upcoming Classic redemptions -

J Class, Europe & UK = Nothing.

Ditto................

 

[NM]

When I first read about this, I thought QF had finally come clean on the fuel fine gouging. But when looking though the details, it appear to me as just marketing hype to try to be perceived as doing the right thing. In my opinion, the end result is far from the right thing.

Firstly, the table quoted up-thread is deliberately misleading, with the old and new surcharges being quoted as one-way and the reduction being quoted as return. While the numbers may be accurate, I believe the choice of one-way and return has been selected specifically to be misleading in terms of making the reduction look better than at actually is, for anyone not looking closely at the column headings. I call it misleading and deceptive marketing, verging on dishonest in my opinion.

Secondly, we still have fuel fines included in the FF redemptions! They have not been removed or absorbed into the base fare (where they really should be). They should be removed altogether from published fares AND frequent flyer redemptions.

And no changes for Europe. To me this just shows how little influence QF has in the relationship with EK.

And what about FF redemptions on partner airlines? Does the fuel surcharge paid by QFF members for award flight redemptions on partner airlines actually go to the airline inuring the fuel costs?

 

[RooFlyer]

Gosh NM, I missed that bit about stating the one way old fuel fine, but then saying the reduction for return!

Disgraceful.

Anyone here, including Red Roo want to defend, explain or excuse that bit of sleight of hand (IMHO)?

And people wonder why I'm cynical about Qantas marketing/loyalty.

Ho, ho, ho.

 

[Red Roo]

To clarify, and as per the table posted down thread, reductions will apply on routes where we have made adjustments, and where Business and First cabins are available.

The media release highlights Economy and Premium Economy as this is where customers will see the greatest differences.

Am I right to assume this will not be retrospective for award flights bought but not flown yet?

This does not impact existing bookings, however it does apply to all new bookings made from 28 January 2015.

 

[docjames]

Yes, getting through the fine detail, promises a lot in the way the media release is written, actual substance far less.

Sadly once again it seems to be more Qantas spin than actual substance.

Disappointing.

A "fairer and simpler" way would have been to apply it across the network and roll into base fares.