Downgraded from Business Class.

[MEL_Traveller]

I think this has been discussed at length up-thread, including internal links to industry sites. However in this case, the overall experience of the individuals has been taken in to consideration and discussed directly with them in terms of additional goodwill.

Red Roo - the industry site is not available to passengers, and seems to be directed at travel agents. If you could ask the relevant department to give us a bit of insight into how they arrive at a refund that would be useful going forward. This would be particularly helpful if we are faced with the choice at check-in of either travelling in a lower class, or taking a flight the next day. We can weigh up the options based on the likely refund due.

 

[fersea]

I think this has been discussed at length up-thread, including internal links to industry sites. However in this case, the overall experience of the individuals has been taken in to consideration and discussed directly with them in terms of additional goodwill.

Sounds like a wonderful result all around. I am sure EmilyP's parents are very grateful for the additional goodwill.

 

[serfty]

Hmm ... i was thinking bad things about flight center earlier today .. then pulled myself up and considered Hanlon's razor ...

Looks like i was being too kind.

 

[MelUser]

Some relatives cancelled a Malaysia Airlines trip earlier this year and it does take time for a refund.

Years ago I cancelled a DONE4 and rebooked as it was cheaper - again refund took some time.

Airline refunds do take time and one just has to be patient.

 

[BAM1748]

I think this has been discussed at length up-thread, including internal links to industry sites. However in this case, the overall experience of the individuals has been taken in to consideration and discussed directly with them in terms of additional goodwill.

What is at the back of my mind is that regular Joe who has worn this ill treatment in the past and will again in the future and has not received "additional goodwill" because they perhaps aren't users of social media or excellent forums like this one.

While QANTAS have rectified (and we don't know to what extent) this individual matter they have not actually the fixed the problem or refund for downgrade process any of us could face tomorrow on QANTAS.

Matt

 

[Flying mermaid]

Some relatives cancelled a Malaysia Airlines trip earlier this year and it does take time for a refund.

Years ago I cancelled a DONE4 and rebooked as it was cheaper - again refund took some time.

Airline refunds do take time and one just has to be patient.

Although in this case RR has indicated that the funds were released by Qantas to Flight Centre 2 weeks ago ......

 

[Ansett]

Although in this case RR has indicated that the funds were released by Qantas to Flight Centre 2 weeks ago ......

Another excellent reason NEVER to use Flight Centre. Fly indirect but book Direct LOL

 

[dajop]

Although in this case RR has indicated that the funds were released by Qantas to Flight Centre 2 weeks ago ......

Think about it. If Flight Centre (or any agent) sits on their refunds for a few weeks they can blame the airline and of course take any benefits of having the cash sitting there for that time.

 

[DC3]

Sounds like a wonderful result all around. I am sure EmilyP's parents are very grateful for the additional goodwill.

So QF gave them a happy ending?

Maybe there was so much goodwill that they cannot work out how they could ever use it all, and will give half of it back to QF.

 

[ellen10]

Although in this case RR has indicated that the funds were released by Qantas to Flight Centre 2 weeks ago ......

It confirms my choose not to deal with Flight Centre.
We had problems when my son was stranded in the UK. Flight Centre were not interested and very unhelpful.
Since then have done all bookings myself directly and those of family and friends.

 

[ComeFlyWithMe]

It confirms my choose not to deal with Flight Centre.
We had problems when my son was stranded in the UK. Flight Centre were not interested and very unhelpful.
Since then have done all bookings myself directly and those of family and friends.

In pretty much all instances, unless there is a tangible benefit to the customer, why introduce another commission taking organisation into the mix.

 

[RAM]

Although in this case RR has indicated that the funds were released by Qantas to Flight Centre 2 weeks ago ......

Well released does necessarily = notified. What exactly does agent mean?

Flightcentre may not find out until it receives its monthly statement after all. Two weeks ago was November 3. I'm sorry but having experienced spin from the best I have discovered 'never assume' to be the most important approach. Also, released to who in FlightCentre? The head office, regional office, office of sale? Details make a big difference and many on this thread want to believe Q has/will do the right thing and time and time again that hope has proven misplaced (such as the reason for silence).

Red Roo will be your best bet here, always helped me out pronto!

Well I am waiting on my question to RED ROO "RED ROO - can you please clarify what exact Q policy is and perhaps provide an explanation as to why it is that duration?"

earlier in this thread and await the answer eagerly. The policy relates to how long for a refund.

There goes the views of the over-optimistic where it looked liked good news and we had convinced ourselves of a successful settlement, wishing them all the best with their NDA, layered with buckets of fair treatment.

Q Spin Dept would have been well pleased at EmilyP's silence. Ask yourself if EmilyP had kept posting - "Nothing from Q today" day after day etc how some would have interpreted it?

If Q or the social media representatives RED ROO were not into spin then they surely would have posted, without any risk of privacy issues, resolution pending. That they did not and waited until EmilyP said 'no change' really says it all about the 'Customer consideration' from Q, or lack thereof.

Perhaps they were relieved that many were interpreting silence as a positive outcome.

Without breaching privacy, I’d like to clarify that Qantas have released the funds back to the agent 2 weeks ago, and it’s now up to them to coordinate with your parents.

This process was explained to your parents earlier today, and I recommend that they continue their discussions with their dedicated Qantas contact.

If this happened two weeks ago then why was 'This process was explained to your parents earlier today'? and not two weeks ago?

This looks like yet another attempt to shift the focus on the continuing failings from Q (like the implied digs at the travellers earlier in this thread by Red Roo) - 'disappointed' 'misrepresented' etc. I may be harsh but the hole is nearly through to London IMHO.

It really riles me - two weeks ago vs today. In my book yet another serious break-down in Q customer repair. Why this two week delay in conveying what is ostensibly good news? Is it even true? Who knows, one thing is for sure FlightCentre are unlikely to point the finger at Q are they?

I think this has been discussed at length up-thread, including internal links to industry sites. However in this case, the overall experience of the individuals has been taken in to consideration and discussed directly with them in terms of additional goodwill.

Yet again, a convoluted "Get lost, we're not going to give you anything you can hold us to in future." It was a perfectly reasonable request as this is not an isolated incident and travellers want to know what contract variations Q has up its sleeve. The terms "harsh and unconscionable" come to mind.

Then as a distraction - toss in unquantified 'leave to the imagination to expand' the goodwill.

How many hours have been taken up for the two parents gathering documents, going in to see TC, ringing Q on the phone etc etc. Let alone the aggravation, shock and disappointment. Then to be denigrated by Red Roo - 'misrepresenting' unbelievable. Red Roo can claim privacy on one hand yet accuse with no substantiation on the other.

It would have to be a 4 figure or more sum to represent "goodwill" after this disgraceful treatment. All of us know it will not be.

Sounds like a wonderful result all around. I am sure EmilyP's parents are very grateful for the additional goodwill.

Hope springs eternal but Q's track record suggests otherwise unfortunately. Being accused of misrepresentation is definitely not what I would call a wonderful result.

Hmm ... i was thinking bad things about flight center earlier today .. then pulled myself up and considered Hanlon's razor ...

Looks like i was being too kind.

How do you resolve the 'released two weeks ago' with told 'earlier today'? Also exactly who is the agent? is it even a level above FC and below Q, perhaps Q wholesale even?

 

[Red Roo]

...I’d like to clarify that Qantas have released the funds back to the agent 2 weeks ago, and it’s now up to them to coordinate with your parents.

It was not my intention to point blame at the agent. Rather, to highlight that there is a process in place that can take time.

Once again, I'd like to remind you that discussions are ongoing with the passengers directly, as has been the case from the beginning and outside this forum.

 

[EmilyP]

Without breaching privacy, I’d like to clarify that Qantas have released the funds back to the agent 2 weeks ago, and it’s now up to them to coordinate with your parents.

This process was explained to your parents earlier today, and I recommend that they continue their discussions with their dedicated Qantas contact.

Interestingly enough, my parents were contacted by QF about 10 minutes after I posted my comment this morning. They were advised that funds were released to them by QF on November 2nd.

That was news to my parents and the exact amount and location of these funds are yet to be determined.

FYI - this was only after the Flight Centre manager called QF to follow up directly. We won't find out until next Monday (when the batch is processed) how much the refund is.


I would hate for anyone reading this thread to be under the impression that:

1. QF have been proactively in touch with my parents regarding this fare difference refund
2. They have received a full refund

Flight Centre advised my parents again today that 'the refund will not be as much as you expect'…..

so it just seems like we are back to square one with this???????

 

[Flying mermaid]

Think about it. If Flight Centre (or any agent) sits on their refunds for a few weeks they can blame the airline and of course take any benefits of having the cash sitting there for that time.

yup this is what banks used to do with their 5 days to clear cheques - used to make a mint on short term money markets.

 

[DC3]

... Flight Centre advised my parents again today that 'the refund will not be as much as you expect'…..

So, FC has got a secret.

 

[EmilyP]

So, FC has got a secret.

FC manager didn't know what the $$ is until it gets released by a batch on Monday.

I agree with a PP that the constant allegations of 'misrepresentation' by QF 'PR' are laughable.

I will update on Monday if there is any news.

But I can state without hesitation that my parents will be utilising some of the very helpful advice they have received and will be taking this further unless the fare difference is fair and reasonable.

Emily

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Interestingly enough, my parents were contacted by QF about 10 minutes after I posted my comment this morning. They were advised that funds were released to them by QF on November 2nd.

That was news to my parents and the exact amount and location of these funds are yet to be determined.

FYI - this was only after the Flight Centre manager called QF to follow up directly. We won't find out until next Monday (when the batch is processed) how much the refund is.


I would hate for anyone reading this thread to be under the impression that:

1. QF have been proactively in touch with my parents regarding this fare difference refund
2. They have received a full refund

Flight Centre advised my parents again today that 'the refund will not be as much as you expect'…..

so it just seems like we are back to square one with this???????

I guess it depends what the 'goodwill' gesture is over and above the actual refund.

I think we calculated the total amount that should ethically be refunded is somewhere in the $2800 range. That would just be the difference between the one way business class fare paid, and the lowest ticketed fare sold that day on that flight. But that would just get you back to the level you should be rightfully at - and doesn't take account of the downgrade, how it was handled, and the loss of comfort etc etc.

If the Flight Centre refund is as we suspect... around $1250, there should be an additional package to somewhere around the same again (another $1250-1550 or so). Plus something for the goodwill. We'll have to wait until monday.

I would have liked to have seen something along the lines of a confirmed proactive upgrade certificate... which could have been used against any economy fare for the next trip to the USA. (Confirmed in the sense that as long as there was a business class seat for sale you would have been confirmed into that seat, not dependent on the day of travel).

 

[EmilyP]

It was not my intention to point blame at the agent. Rather, to highlight that there is a process in place that can take time.

Once again, I'd like to remind you that discussions are ongoing with the passengers directly, as has been the case from the beginning and outside this forum.

Red Roo, I appreciate your role on forums such as this, but nobody is disputing that my parents have been speaking to QF.

Unfortunately it is the tone and context of these discussions that is a let down.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Well released does necessarily = notified. What exactly does agent mean?

Flightcentre may not find out until it receives its monthly statement after all. Two weeks ago was November 3. I'm sorry but having experienced spin from the best I have discovered 'never assume' to be the most important approach. Also, released to who in FlightCentre? The head office, regional office, office of sale? Details make a big difference and many on this thread want to believe Q has/will do the right thing and time and time again that hope has proven misplaced (such as the reason for silence).



Well I am waiting on my question to RED ROO "RED ROO - can you please clarify what exact Q policy is and perhaps provide an explanation as to why it is that duration?"

earlier in this thread and await the answer eagerly. The policy relates to how long for a refund.



Q Spin Dept would have been well pleased at EmilyP's silence. Ask yourself if EmilyP had kept posting - "Nothing from Q today" day after day etc how some would have interpreted it?

If Q or the social media representatives RED ROO were not into spin then they surely would have posted, without any risk of privacy issues, resolution pending. That they did not and waited until EmilyP said 'no change' really says it all about the 'Customer consideration' from Q, or lack thereof.

Perhaps they were relieved that many were interpreting silence as a positive outcome.



If this happened two weeks ago then why was 'This process was explained to your parents earlier today'? and not two weeks ago?

This looks like yet another attempt to shift the focus on the continuing failings from Q (like the implied digs at the travellers earlier in this thread by Red Roo) - 'disappointed' 'misrepresented' etc. I may be harsh but the hole is nearly through to London IMHO.

It really riles me - two weeks ago vs today. In my book yet another serious break-down in Q customer repair. Why this two week delay in conveying what is ostensibly good news? Is it even true? Who knows, one thing is for sure FlightCentre are unlikely to point the finger at Q are they?



Yet again, a convoluted "Get lost, we're not going to give you anything you can hold us to in future." It was a perfectly reasonable request as this is not an isolated incident and travellers want to know what contract variations Q has up its sleeve. The terms "harsh and unconscionable" come to mind.

Then as a distraction - toss in unquantified 'leave to the imagination to expand' the goodwill.

How many hours have been taken up for the two parents gathering documents, going in to see TC, ringing Q on the phone etc etc. Let alone the aggravation, shock and disappointment. Then to be denigrated by Red Roo - 'misrepresenting' unbelievable. Red Roo can claim privacy on one hand yet accuse with no substantiation on the other.

It would have to be a 4 figure or more sum to represent "goodwill" after this disgraceful treatment. All of us know it will not be.



Hope springs eternal but Q's track record suggests otherwise unfortunately. Being accused of misrepresentation is definitely not what I would call a wonderful result.



How do you resolve the 'released two weeks ago' with told 'earlier today'? Also exactly who is the agent? is it even a level above FC and below Q, perhaps Q wholesale even?

Why do you highlight part of your posts in red capital letters?

Is it because you are "really riled" at the "harsh and unconscionable" treatment QF are subjecting us to by refusing to publish their own internal policies on the Internet? Or is it merely to highlight the important parts?