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- Apr 12, 2013
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This, to me, would be tantamount to "Denied Boarding"
This is a very believable interpretation. But the mention of "Denied Boarding" probably guarantees another 10 pages of discussion.
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This, to me, would be tantamount to "Denied Boarding"
If you say the airline "coughed up" by inadvertently transferring Duffa onto the earlier flight causing the oversale, what would you call it when the last to people to check in ie the rightful owners of those seats (who were always booked in J on that flight) are told the flight is oversold if Duffa were to remain on that flight in J???
find so ironic that the people who were most vocal on the 'other thread' are inferring the OP on this thread was wronged, bumped, downgraded & basically once he had been given the J boarding passes that was it, possession is nine tenths of the law etc etc without contemplating the consequences of that ie if Duffa remained in those seats it would most certainly be at the expense of someone else.
Well what if that someone else what you? I asked you earlier in the thread what would you do if you were the last to check in on that flight and were told that you'd been downgraded? You responded by saying that you always pre-allocate your seats however playing devil's advocate for a moment, just say there was a config change and the seat numbers you had originally reserved did not exist on the new aircraft and as a result left you with no pre-allocated seat numbers resulting in the downgrade.
Knowing your 'modus operandi' from other threads eg when BA tried to downgrade your MIL there is absolutely no way you'd accept that & you'd be saying that it wasn't good enough and demanding your seats back and that Duffa be moved back to his original flight. The very action you would suggest to resolve the issue is exactly what did happen in this case.
hmmm, it's either a downgrade or yet another example of "World-Worst" practice ...
It's a downgrade! With a twist....
Hmmm, I can't see any believability issues with the OP....
QF coughed-up - simply as that.
Why worry about the title? It's a cough-up that resulted in a downgrade or a delay.....amateur hour in the extreme.
Denied boarding, Downgraded, Shafted .... the outcomes are all the same.
not that Classic Award fares are not changeable - they are, as long as "U" class seats are available. I believe that the only J seats available on the earlier flight were those in the J bucket not U otherwise the CSA on the J class checkin would have been able to change it. Whilst the OP was within his rights to ask about changing, the CSA was also within their rights to say that there weren't any award seats available to change to on that flight.
I don't think the CSA realised it was an award ticket so when they went to display available flights the system would've only display those flights with "U" class award availability and given the disrupt situation I sincerely doubt that there would have been any of those seats available.
As the CSA couldn't change it they referred Duffa to the supervisor at counter 20 because they thought there may have been a problem ie that pax holding a J ticket couldn't be moved to a J seat however it was obviously a case of J seats not showing available to a pax holding an award ticket booked in the "U" fare bucket. Not all CSA's have the ability to override ie transferring a pax on a U ticket to a flight that only has seats available in the J bucket.
As above I would suggest the CSA knew exactly what they were doing and that special processing was required - hence referring Duffa to the service desk. where I presume was a supervisor.... As the CSA couldn't change it they referred Duffa to the supervisor at counter 20 because they thought there may have been a problem ie that pax holding a J ticket couldn't be moved to a J seat however it was obviously a case of J seats not showing available to a pax holding an award ticket booked in the "U" fare bucket. Not all CSA's have the ability to override ie transferring a pax on a U ticket to a flight that only has seats available in the J bucket. ...
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Who would have thought that calling a spade a cough-up would create such emotion
That is not what we are arguing, as I can suggest that neither Princess Fiona or myself believe that the situation was handled appropriately.
The argument is about those who are most vocal about the fact that the OP was downgraded, when the facts suggest that they were bumped back to their original flight.
There is a difference.
IMHO they were downgraded. Nothing wrong with the title - probably why it hasn't been moderated :idea:
There are three possibilities: A) downgrade, B) denied boarding, C) nothing happened .... take your pick and be happy.
edit: I'd suggest the "anti-downgrade" cheer squad are the most vocal.
i.e. Rebooked twice.The title has been moderated now.
Actually I think there's a fourth possibility. Qantas made a mistake, clumsily rectified it, resulting in the OP flying on the flight and class of travel he originally booked.
i.e. Rebooked twice.
I have a feeling Duffa would have no joy at the service desk and by calling an empowered agent bypassed whatever the Perth Staff were up to.
That is not what we are arguing, as I can suggest that neither Princess Fiona or myself believe that the situation was handled appropriately.
The argument is about those who are most vocal about the fact that the OP was downgraded, when the facts suggest that they were bumped back to their original flight.
There is a difference.
Despite several misreps of what I have posted, here goes...
Q made a mistake, story/treatment from Q personnel involved was different/inconsistent, Red Roo is not attempting to clarify the situation.
Why I believe has many similarities to EmilyP's parents issue;
Q made a mistake, story/treatment from Q personnel involved was different/inconsistent, Red Roo is not attempting to clarify the situation.
In the other thread - Red Roo makes vague allegations and appears to be trying to point the finger at the parents, the Agent, or the wholesaler.
In this thread - quite silent.
Red Roo represents a group of full time paid Q communications staff and senior managers.
Do you think their performance in either thread has been:
a) Exemplary, showing concern for customer inconvenience, time lost and confusion involved
b) Passable, seeking to expedite response and resolve issue but likely refunds will not match lost value let alone inconvenience and time taken to resolve
c) Poor, seeking to shift focus/blame to other parties with no apparent concern for time and effort involved for EmilyP's parents
d) Deplorable, only aim to confuse issue, shift blame away from Q and mislead through both unsubantiated/vague claims interspersed with extended periods of silence when posts by AFFers favouring Q for positive action were totally groundless, only responding when EmilyP corrects false impression of Q's activity (or inactivity as several times has been the case).
Your call?
IMHO alleging misrepresentation by what happened, trying to blame un-named 'agent' (who some immediately jumped on as TC failing) yet saying 'two weeks ago' and then 'notified parents this morning' does not sit well with me.
The common issue for many of these threads is customer (lack thereof) service, honest communication and owning a failure.
No. You choose to go on earlier flight in a class lower than you booked.I've often asked at the airport if there was an earlier flight I could get on, and been told yes but only in economy. I'm curious - had I accepted that, would you class that as a downgrade? And blame the airline for it?
Obviously an extremely difficult concept.Appears to be a difficult concept to grasp.... for some.
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No. You choose to go on earlier flight in a class lower than you booked.
But and I mean but. If you ask for seat on earlier flight and they give you a business boarding pass and then after a few minutes tell you we made a mistake you have to go back to your original flight in business or travel in economy on your new flight. This is a downgrade. No doubt about it regardless of what sort of spin you want to put on it.
Here is another situation. You pay for economy and put in an upgrade request to business. On morning of the flight your upgrade request is granted. You then go to airport, check-in and have business class boarding pass, go to lounge and start relaxing. Then you are paged. Apologies Mr opusman but your upgrade was a mistake. Here is your new boarding pass for economy 68E. How? Who made the mistake? The computer made the mistake and it handed out too many upgrades. But I had 43H allocated for the past 11 months. Sorry Mr opusman but 68E is the only seat left on the flight. Original booked class is meaningless.
So not only have you now been downgraded but you have seriously been shafted.
I must say the same applies for those who obviously are arguing the opposite of what I amObviously an extremely difficult concept.
The situation with EmilyP's parents and this one with Duffa appear to be exactly the same. Some of the people are calling both decisions justified. If it was right to remove Duffa from this flight then it was totally wrong to ask EmilyP's parents to move from business class.
In my opinion Qantas got both of these wrong. Totally wrong and the handling of the situations extremely poor. They also got the other one wrong (going to NRT) but saved themselves when there was a no show in business.
I have been on AFF for close to 10 years and I don't remember reading these types of situations that often. We have now had 3 in less than 2 months. Who knows how many more. I am starting to see a pattern emerge and it is not looking good.
No need to apologise. You don't have to agree with me. We are all entitled to our opinion.Sorry JohnK, but I must challenge this.
The 2 situations with EmilyP's parents and Duffa are identical. Both involve an oversold business class cabin. Both involve a downgrade. Both handled poorly.
It is irrelevant what flight they ended up flying on; whether it was originally booked, a later one or earlier.You can't see a difference between being bumped from your originally booked flight, and being bumped back to your originally booked flight (and class) after a last minute change made under possibly chaotic conditions?
No difference.You can't see a difference between being bumped from your originally booked flight, and being bumped back to your originally booked flight (and class) after a last minute change made under possibly chaotic conditions?