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Clear up about earning points on 'stopovers'

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anat0l

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Need some clear up about how points are calculated when you have to "stopover" (probably the wrong generic word) at a certain place.

For the following discussion, "stopover" means anywhere in between your first and final destination. It is not intended as a place you will stay at for more than 24 hours (you might leave the airport and stay at a hotel while you wait for next flight, but otherwise nothing significant). Then again, please clean up this definition if it helps in the next few questions.

Let's take an elementary example: the Kangaroo route QF1 (which IIRC is SYD-BKK-LHR or SYD-SIN-LHR). In either case, there is a stop in between (either Bangkok or Singapore). On itineraries, this is usually said as "Sydney to London via Bangkok/Singapore".

According to QF rules (again IIRC) for flights that involve a stopover the Great Circle distance is used to find the points earned, not the actual flight distance flown. As you can see, in the above case, the Great Circle from SYD-LHR will easily be < the actual distance of SYD-BKK-LHR.

1) Is this the correct way that the points are figured out?
2) When booking on qantas.com.au, sometimes travelling to a destination will involve a stop of some sort. How can I tell if the Great Circle rules apply? (Does it only apply if both sectors are the same flight number? Are there exceptions?)
3) What are the pros and cons of, say in this example, booking separate flights of SYD-BKK (or SYD-SIN) then BKK-LHR (or SIN-LHR)? Would it work out better for your points vs. extra $$$ (if it does cost extra $$$)?
4) Any other advice/tips/quirks?

Thanks everyone.
 

Keith009

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- A 'stopover' is defined as a stop of 24 hours or greater. I think you're refering to a 'transit.'

- If you fly all the way on QF1 to LHR without a change in flight number or stopping over, your points will be the Great Circle distance between SYD and LHR.

- If you change flight numbers at transit point,eg SYD-SIN QF31, SIN-LHR BA16/QF9, then your accrued points will be the actual mileage of both SYD-SIN and SIN-LHR (plus applicable status/cabin bonuses). You will also get more SCs IIRC. There is no need to purchase seperate tickets as this can all be done on 1 ticket, even for the BA flights due to the JSA.

- If you stop over in SIN or BKK, you will also get mileage as if you're doing SYD-SIN/BKK, SIN/BKK-LHR seperately. But you will incur additional airport taxes.

Hope that helps.
 
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NM

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In the case of trips such as the Kangaroo route, it all depends on what your ticket shows. If the ticket is issued as QF1 SYD-LHR or QF9 MEL-LHR or similar, then you get the point for the distance between SYD and LHR or MEL and LHR as Qantas has determined that distance to be. The Qantas determination for SYD-LHR is 10,586 miles and MEL-LHR is 10.516 miles. This is the case regardless of the fact that the aircraft made a transit through SIN or BKK.

If the ticket is issued as SYD-SIN-LHR, SYD-BKK-LHR or MEL-SIN-LHR etc, then you earn the QF FF points for each sector. So for SYD-BKK-LHR example, you would earn 4.684 for SYD-BKK and you will earn 5,944 for BKK-LHR.

So it all depends on how the ticket has been issued. Separate sectors on separate coupons (or e-ticket equiv of a paper ticket coupon) will earn points for each sector. If its one sector for the through journey then you only get points for the through sector.

Note that if you have SYD-BKK-LHR ticketed as two segments, then you will also be charged the fuel surcharges as 2 x $102 = $204. But if you have the ticket issued as SYD-LHR then you only pay the fuel surcharge for the Australia-Europe of $172.

So the only way to travel on a single segment through flight SYD-LHR is to only be in transit for the 2 hours or so that the same flight number (and aircraft) transits BKK/SIN/HKG. If you change flight number, remain over night etc, then it must be ticketed as two separate segments and hence you earn miles for each segment and pay the fuel surcharge for two segments.
 

Kiwi Flyer

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QF009 said:
- A 'stopover' is defined as a stop of 24 hours or greater. I think you're refering to a 'transit.'
In general yes, but both stopover and transit have many different definitions by airlines, products and even governments and airports (for purposes of assessing taxes and determining visa requirements). There is no single standard definition.

NM is as usual correct. For QFF earning it is the flight coupons that matter. If changing flight number, or stopping over (1 or more days) then each flight must be on a separate coupon. If flying through on the same flight number and not stopping over (1 or more days) then it can be on one coupon, or on 2 coupons (I dont think QF has any flights with 3 or more legs?).

Other than higher taxes there is not necessarily an extra cost for having a single through flight ticketed as 2 coupons. However, availability may differ due to married segment logic - eg there may be availability in a certain booking class for SYD-LHR but not both of SYD-SIN and SIN-LHR on the same flight. This different availability may in turn lead to different fares.

Also some airlines try to force ticketing to combine the 2 coupons - eg SQ does this for SQ flights issued on SQ tickets.
 

NM

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Kiwi Flyer said:
(I dont think QF has any flights with 3 or more legs?).
I once had a DONE4 with QF10 LHR-SIN, QF10 SIN-MEL and QF10 MEL-SYD included. This was for travel in early May 2005 and I needed the extra SCs to get that last UC before they were discontinued.

The TA would not book it as I wanted it. Said I had to book it straight through. So I booked it as sep segment on different days, then after it was issued I called Qantas and changed the date of the second and third legs of QF10.
 

Kiwi Flyer

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Triangle flights (ie AAA-BBB-CCC-AAA) with one flight number for all 3 legs are interesting case. Usually causes problems with FFP credit.
 

NM

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Kiwi Flyer said:
Triangle flights (ie AAA-BBB-CCC-AAA) with one flight number for all 3 legs are interesting case. Usually causes problems with FFP credit.
Thankfully not to many of those. Probably causes problems with checked baggage at times also.
 

Dave Noble

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Kiwi Flyer said:
NM is as usual correct. For QFF earning it is the flight coupons that matter. If changing flight number, or stopping over (1 or more days) then each flight must be on a separate coupon. If flying through on the same flight number and not stopping over (1 or more days) then it can be on one coupon, or on 2 coupons (I dont think QF has any flights with 3 or more legs?).
They do have a 4 leg service. BNE-GLT-ROK-MKY-TSV. Flight number 2300

Dave
 

kevrosmith

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Re: How to Calculate Points/SC's for Qantas flights?

Figured this was as good as any existing thread to pose some (generally newbie) questions just to clarify points/SCs earned when travelling "via" somewhere:

Comparing these three flight options:

(A)
01sydlhr.JPG

(B)
02MELLHR.JPG

(C)
03MELDXBLHR.JPG

In A and B, I'd earn points and SCs based on SYD-LHR and MEL-LHR direct distance only, whereas in C, I'd earn points and SCs for each sector separately, MEL-DXB and DXB-LHR.

Is that correct?

In option A and B, do you actually get off the plane in DXB? Or just sit in the plane on the tarmac while they re-fuel?

(ps. I did find this thread, but thought I'd update the principle with the new DXB stop http://www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au/community/qantas-frequent-flyer-program/clear-up-about-earning-points-8962.html)
 
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dodgeyhack

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Re: How to Calculate Points/SC's for Qantas flights?

In A and B, I'd earn points and SCs based on SYD-LHR and MEL-LHR direct distance only, whereas in C, I'd earn points and SCs for each sector separately, MEL-DXB and DXB-LHR.
Is that correct?
Yep
In option A and B, do you actually get off the plane in DXB? Or just sit in the plane on the tarmac while they re-fuel?
Not been via DXB yet, but 99.9% sure you would get off.
 
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