Should long term Qantas Club membership be recognised?

[oz_mark]

If you feel strongly about it the qantas club terms and conditions do provide for a refund if any Changes substantially deprive you of your intended use of your membership. I'm on iPhone right now so can't provide a link, sorry.

I dare say there won't be much of a refund from a life membership bought 17 years ago.

 

[medhead]

I dare say there won't be much of a refund from a life membership bought 17 years ago.

It would depend on current age and age at purchase I guess. I read somewhere in the last week that the current life expectancy for a 65 year old is something like 17 years. On a simple view if such a person purchased life membership 20 years ago then they could argue for a bit under 50% refund. Maybe? :?:

 

[Smackbum]

This can be argued forever. At the end of the day, your paying for a service. You can also substitute my above examples to something like the Tattersalls Club etc etc.

I don't see why QF should offer more for a member of say 5/10/15/20 years? They are running a business, not a charity. If you don't like the services offered for the price you pay, don't join/renew and vote with your wallet.

Strange then that my Summary page includes this illogical section :-

"Additional Status credits required to obtain next Loyalty bonus: 135"

Discounts for longtime QC members is consistent with the above, but Qantas is perfectly entitled to pick and chose who they display loyalty back to. Maybe they are scared off from offering anything new by recent dummy-spitting. Discuss.

 

[oz_mark]

Discounts for longtime QC members is consistent with the above, but Qantas is perfectly entitled to pick and chose who they display loyalty back to. Maybe they are scared off from offering anything new by recent dummy-spitting. Discuss.

Ahh, but there is a discount - first year you get to pay a joining fee!

Offering a discount to long term members would mean that prices somewhere else would go up to cover.

 

[Oneworldplus2]

I apologize to my first reply in this thread, l didn't mean to sound like a sour grape or have a go at anyone. Sometimes l just get the feeling that people are living in "AFF World" and expect way to much from airlines in general, like the title of this thread. (This can also be argued as QF markets itself in lots of different ways).

Looking after QC members who have been a member for the past 15+years, l just can't see QF really giving a rats about tbh. Lets say there are 200k QC members and 100k of those are full paying QC Members and QF decides to give discount renewal membership prices as a loyalty incentive the following year; that's a pretty big loss that QF will encounter. Lets not get bogged down with individual memberships, if you give a discount to one QC member, you have to include the rest.

OT; A CL member on the other hand who brings in a multi-million dollar account to QF would be in a different kettle of fish altogether and could be rewarded up and above normal CL privileges, depending on $$$ or position/celebrity. I feel that QF really looks after their CL members and high flying corporate members, the rest (including WP's and QC members), QF don't care. This can be seen with the Qantas Platinum benefits being eroded over the last 5 or 10 years.

Smackbum "Additional Status credits required to obtain next Loyalty bonus: 135"

I'm sure that this was added after the upgrade certificates were discontinued, but l get your point, "Loyalty Bonus" is the key here. As a side note, l earned 16k QF points for $89 on the EDRCC sign-up, but flying 450SC's, l get 5k QF Points. QF taking the pi** right there.

 

[oz_mark]

I'm sure that this was added after the upgrade certificates were discontinued, but l get your point, "Loyalty Bonus" is the key here. As a side note, l earned 16k QF points for $89 on the EDRCC sign-up, but flying 450SC's, l get 5k QF Points. QF taking the pi** right there.

I don't think so. Offering discounts, bonuses, whatever, up front is a common marketing inducement to get you to purchase or sign up for a product (witness the number of sign up offers). Now, I don't know the mechanics or agreements behind it, but I would suggest that it is not Qantas that is paying for those bonus points (from EDRCC, One-Path, whoever). Indeed, I would suggest that Qantas is making money on those bonus points.

However, the 5000 loyalty points, which replaced the upgrade certs, is a cost to Qantas.

 

[BJReplay]

If you feel strongly about it the qantas club terms and conditions do provide for a refund if any Changes substantially deprive you of your intended use of your membership.

Would be interesting to test that. Problem is, that would be cutting off my nose to spite my face; I would end up with no benefits, rather than less, because I'm pretty sure they'd offer to refund a tiny proportion of my original fee.

If we lived in a more litigious society (and I'm glad we don't), I'd be talking about setting up a class action. Then we'd be suing for the value of our original membership fee, in today’s dollars, as well as the next 40 years of membership fees, the cost of flying enough to get the status credits, and pain and suffering.

Instead, it's easy to whinge, harder to do anything. That said, time to whinge in public

 

[medhead]

Would be interesting to test that. Problem is, that would be cutting off my nose to spite my face; I would end up with no benefits, rather than less, because I'm pretty sure they'd offer to refund a tiny proportion of my original fee.

Indeed, hence only mentioning that it is an option.

 

[THE TRIMMER]

As a self funded QC senior life member,I joined for priority checkin,lounge access,baggage allowance.Not for status. I feel that that these benefits are being eroded & I am p****d off. I can,t see why Qantas would want to alienate people who have shown their loyalty & guaranteeing their flying dollars to Qantas, when all the people who have status are whining like an EH diff are threatening to take their bats & balls & go to the dark side.Does Qantas want loyalty,if so just give us what we paid for!

 

[serfty]

PS gives seat selection now, where QP doesn't, so at least PS can avoid that middle seat.

As far as what QP used to be like, I joined in 1994 (I still have 3 month suspended QP membership that I will never see due to being LTSG).

Back then fare were High. There was a lot of Fat in the fares to cover the costs of QP/GW amenities and they were much, much better than they are now.

The cheapest standard return MEL/SYD fares were around $280 and required a Saturday or three nights stay. That $280 would buy a lot more than it does these days.

The fares were exactly the same on Ansett. With Compass, Virgin Blue and Impulse operating the pressure was on and there was not so much funding for the QPs.

When AN went under the pressure was off and the QP catering started to decline; in fact IMHO for about 2 years until 2003/2004 it was a lot worse than it is now.

 

[ozavanti]

As a self funded QC senior life member,I joined for priority checkin,lounge access,baggage allowance.Not for status. I feel that that these benefits are being eroded & I am p****d off. I can,t see why Qantas would want to alienate people who have shown their loyalty & guaranteeing their flying dollars to Qantas, when all the people who have status are whining like an EH diff are threatening to take their bats & balls & go to the dark side.Does Qantas want loyalty,if so just give us what we paid for!

Sorry to be blunt Trimmer, but in my opinion QANTAS CLUB members are getting exactly what they pay for, which is access to the QP.

Qantas (and other businesses) are shrew enough to put in the old saying of 'we reserve the right to alter the terms and conditions of this membership'. Credit Card Companies/Banks are a great example. You obviously rolled the dice and have been on the winning side of the risk/outlay vs return calculation, hence why you thought that a lifetime membership was good value when purchased.

As others have said, It's not like QP members aren't getting an alternative to retain 'flying' privileges. It's a simple equation really, show more bum in seat loyalty to Qantas and the increase in status to Status Silver and above will come.

Personally, as someone who pays around $15k per annum to Qantas to get my 'free' Gold Card, I feel quite comfortable seeing those that pay $470pa (plus some flights) not getting the same as me. Additionally it also works for me - I don't expect access to the Business Lounge, 1st Lounge or Chairman's Lounge for the level of cash I bring to QF.

You may say that QP members aren't just spending $470pa with Qantas, which is true, but as I said, if you want the perks (that are more than access to the QP) you have to pay and as said previously Loyalty isn't Cheap.

 

[dfcatch]

I agree 100%. I paid for benefits that have been removed. Of course, that's part of the risk for paying in advance, but that doesn't mean I need to be happy about it.

To those saying "fly more if you want status" - I don't want status, just the benefits I paid for. I agree that customers who fly a lot should get status, but I cannot understand why as a paying member, I get less than a silver frequent flyer.

1/ You're not getting much less than a silver member, essentially the same benefits. (I was recently QP&PS and tbh the only real increased benefit I had as Silver was that I got OW Ruby - which was of benefit as I fly in the US a lot.)

SERFTY - as always fills in the gaps, silver also gives you seat selection

2/ I agree with your main point - and that is that they are taking away benefits to which you have paid for.
One day I will no longer be WP and will have to rely on my QP membership once more and I'm just as unhappy as you with the removal of benefits.

3/ Don't forget that both Silver & Club members have had their benefits reduced equally.

OZAVANTI - I disagree with you here.

I think it's perfectly reasonable for QP members (like myself), who bought a product that included a set of benefits (of which lounge access is only one) to expect to receive those benefits. Personally the checkin and baggage benefits of QP membership are/were just as important to me as lounge access.
And while QF retains the right to change them as they see fit, members retain the right to feel short-changed. Just as WPs have discussed ad nauseum re anytime access.

You would no doubt feel suitably miffed if a Gold benefit which you value was removed and not replaced with a new benefit which you felt had equal value...dare I say "enhanced".

 

[tuapekastar]

Sorry to be blunt Trimmer, but in my opinion QANTAS CLUB members are getting exactly what they pay for, which is access to the QP.

But they actually pay for (and are getting) more than just lounge access. It is 'Qantas Club' membership they are paying for, i.e. membership to a club, one benefit of which is lounge access.

Among other listed benefits are:

Invite a guest
Qantas Frequent Flyer membership
On Departure Upgrades
Priority reservations & waitlisting
Dedicated check-in
Priority baggage handling & allowances
Flight announcements

...so it is clearly more than just lounge access that is being paid for.

Different benefits are of differing importance to each member. Lounge access is usually the most important to members, and as a former paid QC member (and who may well end up back there again someday) it was for me, but I certainly rated priority checkin (Dom and Int) a pretty close second (some of those economy checkin queues went on forever :shock.

Baggage was never an issue for me as I prefer to travel as light as possible and never had need to use the 'extra' allowance, but obviously is a major benefit to others.

THE TRIMMER lists lounge access, dedicated checkin and baggage as his/her main benefits. The checkin benefit is being removed, domestically at least and I can understand why he/she is royally pissed off (particularly as they have 'life' membership and cannot simply walk away and not renew - whether they can get a pro-rata refund, who knows).

It remains to be seen what impact NGCI will have and how much impact the removal of the dedicated domestic checkin will have on QC members (and PS QFFers) but there is sure to be some, and it also removes a point of difference between these and NB QFFers.

No doubt, as you state, QF can alter these conditions as they see fit. And no doubt they do the research and see what sort of 'hit' they may take from people not renewing QC memberships, and in this instance their research has driven the decision they've taken.

Lastly, it could be argued that Gold (and Platinum) QFF members should not get complimentary QC membership (it does happen, think American Airlines for one). That would set the cat amongst the pigeons. :shock:

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Sorry to be blunt Trimmer, but in my opinion QANTAS CLUB members are getting exactly what they pay for, which is access to the QP.

To be blunt....what utter rubbish....

The QP was only ever PART of the benefits of being a QC Member. This was how it was always sold and promoted.

QF are of course free to change what offerings they sell. However an ETHICAL business....let alone one that wants to have loyal customers, should if it removes benefits and devalues what has been sold should rectify that in some way.

ie rebating some of the fee, a flight voucher, gift card...whatever. At least some effort to look after the customer who has PAID for a set of benefits.

Just deleting a host of benefits and keeping the full fee is appalling behaviour.

If one arrives at the airport to F

, but as I said, if you want the perks you have to pay and as said previously Loyalty isn't Cheap.

Now you contradict yourself as members were paying. So it was not a "perk"...but a list of benefits that should have been delivered.

 

[samh004]

I agree in part with the OP that long term paying of QC fees should be recognised, but not with lifetime status, as that just then devalues the point of flying for status.

Perhaps a discount per the number of years would work best. Similar to many memberships, dependant on how long you've been a member for you could have a discount of from 5% to 25%. I don't think 50% off would be cost effective, though maybe after 50 years of membership without achieving LTG it might be offered

 

[codash1099]

I don't want a discount or a refund. I don't want QF to offer additional rewards the QP members that would be costly.

What I cannot understand is why they removed benefits that did not cost much in the first place. If we (NB QP members) don't fly enough to even get PS status, then by definition, we are not using the facilities that are available to any great extent. Therefore retaining a level of priority check-in would not be a great burden. And if even that is a problem, why not give them NGCI tags so that they get some relief from the system?

Seat selection is a more recent introduction, but it would not cost QF much, if anything, to offer seat selection to NB QP members. They could even be put behind PS in the selection queue.

 

[33rpm]

I'll still keep QC, even if I only fly 4 times a year - just being able to sit away from screaming kids for a short time is well worth the $$$. :mrgreen:

If you are QF gold, as per your profile, why on earth would you want pay for QP membership? Admittedly, I paid for lifetime QP membership but that was before I started flying as much as I do now.

 

[33rpm]

Lastly, it could be argued that Gold (and Platinum) QFF members should not get complimentary QC membership (it does happen, think American Airlines for one). That would set the cat amongst the pigeons. :shock:

Wow, maybe the life membership that I bought all those years ago would suddenly have meaning if this were to ever happen.

 

[Archphoto]

If you are QF gold, as per your profile, why on earth would you want pay for QP membership? Admittedly, I paid for lifetime QP membership but that was before I started flying as much as I do now.

Because I may not be able to keep my Gold status, in which case I'll need to fork out the $$$ to enable lounge access.

 

[antycbr]

It remains to be seen what impact NGCI will have and how much impact the removal of the dedicated domestic checkin will have on QC members (and PS QFFers) but there is sure to be some, and it also removes a point of difference between these and NB QFFers.

It's had an impact for me - I flew my last planned QF domestic itinerary CBR-MEL-CBR this weekend just gone; I now have no forward bookings on QF but have 14 bookings on DJ. As a QC/PS I got smacked around by this "enhancement" twice. The other one that got me was the "some fees are decreasing, some fees are increasing" propaganda with the fees I actually incur - the assisted award booking fee - increasing to 6,000 for international.

DJ status was the icing on the cake.