General IT Project Discussion (split from Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age)

Status
Not open for further replies.

medhead

Suspended
Joined
Feb 13, 2008
Posts
19,074
[EDIT]

This thread was split from it's original thread in Travel News.

[/EDIT]
I found this interesting, my FF points will no longer be handled by Fortran :(

Oracle's Siebel to run Qantas Loyalty | The Australian

Oracle's Siebel to run Qantas Loyalty

QANTAS Loyalty has embarked on a multi-million-dollar project to replace its 23-year-old frequent-flyer system ,which supports 6.9 million members.
It has chosen Oracle's Siebel Loyalty as it phases out Profile, a customer relationship management application developed in Fortran, a programming language created in the 1950s.
Qantas Loyalty's IT team will run the project with help from IBM and Indian companies Tata Consultancy Services and ITC InfoTech.
Qantas Loyalty chief executive Simon Hickey said the Oracle contract, which was "in the double-digit, millions of dollars" category, was sealed in the past few weeks.


Or Another storiy about qantas - BIAS! :p
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

Nothing wrong with programming languages such as Fortran, Cobol, RPG etc. Real programmers work with these languages....
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

Nothing wrong with programming languages such as Fortran, Cobol, RPG etc. Real programmers work with these languages....
But the converse is not true! I can program Fortran and RPG (the poor man's Cobol), but would never consider myself a real programmer :shock:

Then again, I have also done some crazy things in 6502 and 6809 assembler :oops:

Its these modern, gui-based object-oriented uber-inefficient bug-infesting code generators that leave me cold.
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

It all leaves us dinosaurs cold:lol:
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

In Qantas-land, this is known as "enhancement". :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Haha, so true!

Oh - and in case anyone is wondering about why I made that comment ... Let's just say I have an idea what they're in for. And no it's not from being involved with a Fortran->Oracle cutover, but rather other aspects of the news report.

(Hope that's vague enough to avoid any issues :) )
 
Read our AFF credit card guides and start earning more points now.

AFF Supporters can remove this and all advertisements

Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

Good luck to Qantas. I am sure the project will run over time, over budget and will end up delivering less than what is wanted.

You've worked on an IT project before ,haven't you?
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

Real programmers work with these languages....

No, real programmers program in machine code... :lol:

Good to see they are moving away from the mid 70's (Fortran 77, I doubt it was Fortran 90 \ 95 as it was already a dying language then) ... The problem with Fortran is the people who really know it are now all retiring and well not to put a too finer point on it - dying.
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

No, real programmers program in machine code... :lol:

Good to see they are moving away from the mid 70's (Fortran 77, I doubt it was Fortran 90 \ 95 as it was already a dying language then) ... The problem with Fortran is the people who really know it are now all retiring and well not to put a too finer point on it - dying.

FORTRAN is still thrown around a bit, hence why there are still supported forms of it here and there. It's not a immensely difficult language to learn, unless you can tell me - in terms of FORTRAN - what it means to "really know" (the language), i.e. what is the minor detail that I'm overlooking here...
 
No, real programmers program in machine code... :lol:...
No real programmers go:

push [reset] ... flick, flick, flick, flick ... check ... push [store]; flick, flick, flick ... check ... push [store]; flick, flick, flick ,flick, flick ... check ... push [store]; ...

... flick, flick ,flick, flick ... check ... push [store] ... double check ... push [go].
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

No real programmers go:

push [reset] ... flick, flick, flick, flick ... check ... push [store]; flick, flick, flick ... check ... push [store]; flick, flick, flick ,flick, flick ... check ... push [store]; ...

... flick, flick ,flick, flick ... check ... push [store] ... double check ... push [go].

If you're referring to punch cards, then...

*runs away*
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

(Hope that's vague enough to avoid any issues :) )

Makes perfect sense to me, unfortunately. Let's hope nothing goes seriously wrong..
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

But the converse is not true! I can program Fortran and RPG (the poor man's Cobol), but would never consider myself a real programmer :shock:

Then again, I have also done some crazy things in 6502 and 6809 assembler :oops:

Its these modern, gui-based object-oriented uber-inefficient bug-infesting code generators that leave me cold.

I've always considered "real" programmers as meeting 2 criteria, 1) they look both ways before crossing a one way street, and 2) are able to complete their task within the limitations of the system they are using, as in well yes there are a lot of "old" systems out there, but that doesn't mean it can't be achieved.

Sometimes these limitations produce better systems if not with the ability to expand. I have an embedded systems background, and its amazing what one can do with a 2kb memory block, I always thought it was a luxury to have 8kb!. Even my field is changing now though, you can buy cheap microcontrollers/processors with Mega BYTES of memory and all sorts of data interfaces, and all it has brought are devices that try to do too much, and in an untidy way because of the additional resources people don't have to consider managing the resources, and get lazy.

I see way too many I.T projects (and even electrical/electronic products) now focusing on expansion or features rather than reliability, and they end up with 1001 features, with half of them buggy or non-functional rather than a 50 feature working in 99 years marvel.

Even though I am not that old myself I often get younger engineers having a joke at my expense because I chose to use a cheap and small device in something I am developing, but then they are the first to wonder why they fail to get the $$$ and don't get given the critical projects.
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

I've always considered "real" programmers as meeting 2 criteria, 1) they look both ways before crossing a one way street, and 2) are able to complete their task within the limitations of the system they are using, as in well yes there are a lot of "old" systems out there, but that doesn't mean it can't be achieved.

Sometimes these limitations produce better systems if not with the ability to expand. I have an embedded systems background, and its amazing what one can do with a 2kb memory block, I always thought it was a luxury to have 8kb!. Even my field is changing now though, you can buy cheap microcontrollers/processors with Mega BYTES of memory and all sorts of data interfaces, and all it has brought are devices that try to do too much, and in an untidy way because of the additional resources people don't have to consider managing the resources, and get lazy.

I see way too many I.T projects (and even electrical/electronic products) now focusing on expansion or features rather than reliability, and they end up with 1001 features, with half of them buggy or non-functional rather than a 50 feature working in 99 years marvel.

Even though I am not that old myself I often get younger engineers having a joke at my expense because I chose to use a cheap and small device in something I am developing, but then they are the first to wonder why they fail to get the $$$ and don't get given the critical projects.

LOL so much of that is true.

I am one of the "younger generation" (I graduated with B Eng (Enviro) and B IT (Software Design) in 2007) but at least I know that if you're stuck with a memory constraint then for heaven's sake stick to it! If that means you can't write the program in C++ then find another way dammit!
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

No, real programmers program in machine code... :lol:
Sure and then they learn Fortran, Cobol and RPG.

When they are bored and want to totally stuff things up they get into Unix and start writing in Java, C, C++ etc. Then anyone can join the fun even if they were never going to be real programmers.

The funny side to all is how people think modern programming languages are great. They are extremely inconsistent and I have encountered many a time when a series of instructions behaves differently at random. Well let's see today 1+1 = 2.0000000000000001 and tomorrow 1+1 = 2.0000000000000002 and so on.

Why do major financial institutions run with the old programming languages? I have had my fun with RPG for just on 25 years. A few more years and I will be ready to retire and watch the garbage churned out with the modern programming languages....
 
Re: Qantas Frequent flyer out of the stone age

It all leaves us dinosaurs cold:lol:

Hell i'm not that old and I still remember coding in ADA, Pascal (not Turbo) and assembly for M6800's - And that was in the 90's at Uni.

VB was the only visual programming language they taught back when I was there. Java was a 'new' course that was introduced the year after I left.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Become an AFF member!

Join Australian Frequent Flyer (AFF) for free and unlock insider tips, exclusive deals, and global meetups with 65,000+ frequent flyers.

AFF members can also access our Frequent Flyer Training courses, and upgrade to Fast-track your way to expert traveller status and unlock even more exclusive discounts!

AFF forum abbreviations

Wondering about Y, J or any of the other abbreviations used on our forum?

Check out our guide to common AFF acronyms & abbreviations.
Back
Top