Oneworld Classic Flight Reward Discussion - The Definitive Thread

[madrooster]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

the change was just to a different flight to a different airport albeit in the same city and on the same date - no change to the eTicket number. The previous change took about 3 weeks to come through though I could see it online pretty much immediately. Apparently it takes longer (requires more scrutiny?) to reissue a previously reissued ticket.

If the ticket number didn't change then it's a revalidation which can be done on the spot.

Reissuing a ticket does not take longer than issuing a brand new ticket. It's entirely automated.

 

[Doctore1003]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Hi all, I've just started booking my first OWE trip in J for myself and my partner next year and I thought I'd share the experience, given how useful it's been reading this thread!

We're breaking the itinerary up into two trips about 6 months apart, USA next September and then Japan early 2017. For USA:

- MEL-xSYD-SFO - QF - booked
- LAX-xHKG-SYD - CX - booked this morning (stupidly didn't realise I was looking for seats in the middle of school holidays, hence no QF availability - lesson learned!)
- Possible intra-USA AA trip - TBC

For Japan, the plan is:
- SYD-NRT either QF or JL
- NRT-MEL - possibly via HKG, either QF, JL or CX - I'm aware of the rules about at least 2 non-QF airlines and max transits/stops in cities - will have to accommodate those.

On a different note, in my research the last few weeks I've been realising award availability from places like SIN is so much better, so I'll be considering using SIN as a launch pad for future OWE or at least as a longer term "stopover" between trips.

Is it too early to start planning travel for late-2017/early 2018??

It really takes some effort to "live in the now" when consumed with OWE trip planning

 

[adelee]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Hi Doctore1003, congratulations on booking the first part of you trip. However, please be aware that once you re-enter the country you started in (Australia in this instance), you won't be able to leave it again to head O/S as part of the same booking.

 

[Doctore1003]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Hi Doctore1003, congratulations on booking the first part of you trip. However, please be aware that once you re-enter the country you started in (Australia in this instance), you won't be able to leave it again to head O/S as part of the same booking.

Hey adelee, are you sure? There's nothing about that in the fare rules, and I thought I saw other people take a similar strategy - ie. coming back to Australia for a "stopover", but a different city than the origin, so the OWE fare continues.

 

[Franky]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

yes - it can become all consuming if you allow it to - but the results if you achieve them is very gratifying being all of your own work.. Here I am at 1930 looking at options when I could be sipping a good white in front of the TV.

Agree with you on Singapore. Being in Perth with negligible QF flights to choose from, and an aversion to going thru the ME, Singapore/KL have become my hub. Singapore comes out in front due to the far lower taxes. I wont be the only one to tell you that 2017 is too far ahead for any bookings to be made, but getting a plan together wont hurt. Best of luck with what your after.

 

[sergeyvzn]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Hey adelee, are you sure? There's nothing about that in the fare rules, and I thought I saw other people take a similar strategy - ie. coming back to Australia for a "stopover", but a different city than the origin, so the OWE fare continues.

adelee is right. Once you are back in Oz, your RTW trip is over. You must break it elsewhere rather than the country of origin to be able to do what you want

its in terms and conditions, give it a good read

 

[Doctore1003]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

adelee is right. Once you are back in Oz, your RTW trip is over. You must break it elsewhere rather than the country of origin to be able to do what you want

its in terms and conditions, give it a good read

Sorry, maybe I was using the wrong terminology. I'm not doing a formal RTW fare, rather the 5 stopover / 35,000 mile award in J at 280k per person.

From the QF terms:
14.5 Classic Flight Rewards - oneworld Classic Flight Reward booking conditions
14.5.1 A oneworld Classic Flight Reward is a Classic Flight Reward Itinerary that includes travel on at least two oneworld Alliance Airlines other than Qantas and does not include any travel on any airline that is not a oneworld Alliance Airline.
14.5.2 Classic Flight Rewards using the oneworld Classic Flight Reward table must be no more than a distance of 56,315 kilometres (35,000 miles). Longer journeys must be broken into separate Itineraries.
14.5.3 A one way oneworld Classic Flight Reward Itinerary will be charged as a return Itinerary. oneworld Classic Flight Reward Itineraries finishing in a port other than the port of origin must include the distance to return directly to the port of origin when calculating the number of Points required to redeem the Flight Reward and the maximum distance for the Itinerary.
14.5.4 The following Stopover conditions apply to oneworld Classic Flight Rewards:
(a) up to five free Stopovers are permitted;
(b) additional Stopovers are not permitted;
(c) only one Stopover is permitted in any one city in the Itinerary; and
(d) only two Transfers may be taken at any one city in the Itinerary.
14.5.5 Surface Segments are permitted as part of oneworld Classic Flight Reward Itineraries, but the distance between the disembarkation point and the next embarkation point will be included in the Reward Point zone calculation for that Itinerary.
14.5.6 Where mixed-class travel is booked in a oneworld Classic Flight Reward, the whole Itinerary will be calculated using the Points level for the highest class booked.

 

[Doctore1003]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

yes - it can become all consuming if you allow it to - but the results if you achieve them is very gratifying being all of your own work.. Here I am at 1930 looking at options when I could be sipping a good white in front of the TV.

Agree with you on Singapore. Being in Perth with negligible QF flights to choose from, and an aversion to going thru the ME, Singapore/KL have become my hub. Singapore comes out in front due to the far lower taxes. I wont be the only one to tell you that 2017 is too far ahead for any bookings to be made, but getting a plan together wont hurt. Best of luck with what your after.

Franky, I lived in Perth until recently so in my mind Singapore isn't far away at all! I realise it actually is now from MEL... but regardless, what a great hub with KL nearby also. Where are you planning your next adventure to?

 

[Franky]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Franky, I lived in Perth until recently so in my mind Singapore isn't far away at all! I realise it actually is now from MEL... but regardless, what a great hub with KL nearby also. Where are you planning your next adventure to?

Wife needs to attend a conference in Florence in September next year, and I would like to do a river cruise in western europe prior to that. Seats are just starting to become bookable, and some are already spoken for. You need to be on the job continuously.

 

[paul_5666]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Hi all,


Recently booked our first RTW trip in J and very excited to get away. It was quite a late booking so we are rather lucky to get such decent availability across our 13 segments. We tried to book online but the booking system couldn't calculate a fare so called up and got a (rude) consultant who did it for us and waived the phone booking fee.
There has been some confusion however with the baggage allowance for our trip. Initially the ticket had no baggage allowance so I rang to clarify why this was so. The ticket was revalidated with baggage but the baggage allowance was different segment to segment despite being transits through to the final destination. So I called QANTAS again who apologised and reissued the ticket (new ticket number) with the same baggage allowance throughout the itinerary (2 pieces on every segment).
So I have two main questions: is this allowance now correct? What is the weight limit of each piece, will the weight/piece be the same throughout or different carrier to carrier? I've been struggling to figure out if IATA or DOT rules apply and I think QF ticketing staff are a bit confused too.


The routing: SYD QF CBR QF PER CX HKG CX MAN BA LON BA HAM (stop) /- BER BA LON BA NYC (stop) AA CUN (stop) AA NYC CX YVR (stop) CX HKG CX SYD
All J except SYD-CBR, MAN-LON, NYC-CUN and CUN-NYC (AA only have F and Y on those flights? Seems very strange so had to book Y unless there is a way around this)

Thanks in advance for your help. This thread has been an amazing repository of knowledge

 

[hutch]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Hi all,


Recently booked our first RTW trip in J and very excited to get away. It was quite a late booking so we are rather lucky to get such decent availability across our 13 segments. We tried to book online but the booking system couldn't calculate a fare so called up and got a (rude) consultant who did it for us and waived the phone booking fee.
There has been some confusion however with the baggage allowance for our trip. Initially the ticket had no baggage allowance so I rang to clarify why this was so. The ticket was revalidated with baggage but the baggage allowance was different segment to segment despite being transits through to the final destination. So I called QANTAS again who apologised and reissued the ticket (new ticket number) with the same baggage allowance throughout the itinerary (2 pieces on every segment).
So I have two main questions: is this allowance now correct? What is the weight limit of each piece, will the weight/piece be the same throughout or different carrier to carrier? I've been struggling to figure out if IATA or DOT rules apply and I think QF ticketing staff are a bit confused too.


The routing: SYD QF CBR QF PER CX HKG CX MAN BA LON BA HAM (stop) /- BER BA LON BA NYC (stop) AA CUN (stop) AA NYC CX YVR (stop) CX HKG CX SYD
All J except SYD-CBR, MAN-LON, NYC-CUN and CUN-NYC (AA only have F and Y on those flights? Seems very strange so had to book Y unless there is a way around this)

Thanks in advance for your help. This thread has been an amazing repository of knowledge

AA only have F and Y on most domestic and regional flights (carribean, central America etc) except for some Trans continental flights (LAX/SFO-JFK). This F is essentially what we know as domestic business - not proper F

 

[sergeyvzn]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Sorry, maybe I was using the wrong terminology. I'm not doing a formal RTW fare, rather the 5 stopover / 35,000 mile award in J at 280k per person.

From the QF terms:
14.5 Classic Flight Rewards - oneworld Classic Flight Reward booking conditions
14.5.1 A oneworld Classic Flight Reward is a Classic Flight Reward Itinerary that includes travel on at least two oneworld Alliance Airlines other than Qantas and does not include any travel on any airline that is not a oneworld Alliance Airline.
14.5.2 Classic Flight Rewards using the oneworld Classic Flight Reward table must be no more than a distance of 56,315 kilometres (35,000 miles). Longer journeys must be broken into separate Itineraries.
14.5.3 A one way oneworld Classic Flight Reward Itinerary will be charged as a return Itinerary. oneworld Classic Flight Reward Itineraries finishing in a port other than the port of origin must include the distance to return directly to the port of origin when calculating the number of Points required to redeem the Flight Reward and the maximum distance for the Itinerary.
14.5.4 The following Stopover conditions apply to oneworld Classic Flight Rewards:
(a) up to five free Stopovers are permitted;
(b) additional Stopovers are not permitted;
(c) only one Stopover is permitted in any one city in the Itinerary; and
(d) only two Transfers may be taken at any one city in the Itinerary.
14.5.5 Surface Segments are permitted as part of oneworld Classic Flight Reward Itineraries, but the distance between the disembarkation point and the next embarkation point will be included in the Reward Point zone calculation for that Itinerary.
14.5.6 Where mixed-class travel is booked in a oneworld ClassicFlight Reward, the whole Itinerary will be calculated using the Points level for the highest class booked.

its a little further up the page you looked at

14.3.5 A Classic Flight Reward Itinerary must contain no more than one departure from the city or country of first departure on that Itinerary.

 

[paul_5666]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

AA only have F and Y on most domestic and regional flights (carribean, central America etc) except for some Trans continental flights (LAX/SFO-JFK). This F is essentially what we know as domestic business - not proper F

That's exactly what I thought Hutch but can we book those F seats and still use the 280k J cap? I wouldn't think so as the booking system sees it as a F booking then for 420k.

 

[hutch]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

That's exactly what I thought Hutch but can we book those F seats and still use the 280k J cap? I wouldn't think so as the booking system sees it as a F booking then for 420k.

Nope. As you mentioned, as soon as you book a single "F" flight, the whole booking becomes a 420K F booking.

 

[sergeyvzn]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

That's exactly what I thought Hutch but can we book those F seats and still use the 280k J cap? I wouldn't think so as the booking system sees it as a F booking then for 420k.

No you can't. American Airlines 2 class domestic flights (F/Y) will book into Y on a 280K itinerary. The exception is LAX/SFO to JFK (I think Miami, too) on a 3 class A321, they have a J class into which your 280K trip may book

 

[madrooster]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

So I have two main questions: is this allowance now correct? What is the weight limit of each piece, will the weight/piece be the same throughout or different carrier to carrier? I've been struggling to figure out if IATA or DOT rules apply and I think QF ticketing staff are a bit confused too.


The routing: SYD QF CBR QF PER CX HKG CX MAN BA LON BA HAM (stop) /- BER BA LON BA NYC (stop) AA CUN (stop) AA NYC CX YVR (stop) CX HKG CX SYD
All J except SYD-CBR, MAN-LON, NYC-CUN and CUN-NYC (AA only have F and Y on those flights? Seems very strange so had to book Y unless there is a way around this)

The NYC-CUN vv. route is a two class J/Y route, so yes there is J on this route. It can be difficult to get J award seats on this route though.

IATA resolution 302 applies to your ticket, not the DoT/CTA exemption rules. The furthest ticketed point in your ticket is HAM at 10112 miles. As HAM is not in the US or Canada, the DoT/CTA rules do not apply.

Therefore the correct baggage that applies throughout your ticket would be:

SYD-CBR-PER-HKG-MAN-LON-HAM - CX with 30kg weight
TXL-LON-NYC - BA with 3 pieces, 32kg per piece
NYC-CUN - AA with no allowance (pay for bags)
CUN-NYC-YVR - AA with no allowance (pay for bags)
YVR-HKG-SYD - CX with 2 pieces, 32kg per piece

If QF was happy to reissue the ticket with 2 pieces on all your coupons, then I'd be keeping quiet as it's against the IATA 302 rules. To play it safe in this instance, I would recommend sticking to 2 pieces, 23kg per piece due to this being a non standard allowance.

 

[paul_5666]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

The NYC-CUN vv. route is a two class J/Y route, so yes there is J on this route. It can be difficult to get J award seats on this route though.

IATA resolution 302 applies to your ticket, not the DoT/CTA exemption rules. The furthest ticketed point in your ticket is HAM at 10112 miles. As HAM is not in the US or Canada, the DoT/CTA rules do not apply.

Therefore the correct baggage that applies throughout your ticket would be:

SYD-CBR-PER-HKG-MAN-LON-HAM - CX with 30kg weight
TXL-LON-NYC - BA with 3 pieces, 32kg per piece
NYC-CUN - AA with no allowance (pay for bags)
CUN-NYC-YVR - AA with no allowance (pay for bags)
YVR-HKG-SYD - CX with 2 pieces, 32kg per piece

If QF was happy to reissue the ticket with 2 pieces on all your coupons, then I'd be keeping quiet as it's against the IATA 302 rules. To play it safe in this instance, I would recommend sticking to 2 pieces, 23kg per piece due to this being a non standard allowance.

Thanks Madrooster, I thought IATA applied too but I'm happy to keep quiet and stick to 2 x 23kg allowance if that is what has been ticketed.
Revenue fares with AA through their website on JFK-CUN route seem to be selling Business seats (fare code I) but the QANTAS booking engine is showing it as first class? Is this just a problem with QF and I can actually book into these award "first" seats with a 280k fare? Sorry for the silly questions!

 

[prozac]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

...
There has been some confusion however with the baggage allowance for our trip. Initially the ticket had no baggage allowance so I rang to clarify why this was so. The ticket was revalidated with baggage but the baggage allowance was different segment to segment despite being transits through to the final destination. So I called QANTAS again who apologised and reissued the ticket (new ticket number) with the same baggage allowance throughout the itinerary (2 pieces on every segment).
So I have two main questions: is this allowance now correct? What is the weight limit of each piece, will the weight/piece be the same throughout or different carrier to carrier? I've been struggling to figure out if IATA or DOT rules apply and I think QF ticketing staff are a bit confused too.
...

There is a code relating to baggage allowance when flying more than one carrier on the ticket. It is called the Most Significant Carrier Rule (MSC). This rule states that on flights which are operated by several airlines, the baggage regulations of the airline that operates the geographically longest or most significant stretch of the journey apply.

 

[vetrade]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

All J except SYD-CBR, MAN-LON, NYC-CUN and CUN-NYC (AA only have F and Y on those flights? Seems very strange so had to book Y unless there is a way around this)

I think you have been misinformed paul_5666. Most AA domestic flights only have F and Y but their flights from the US to Canada and the Caribbean etc. have Y & J (some may also have F but I'm not sure about that). I have flown in J class (on J reward tickets) on a couple of their Caribbean flights and while it's better than Y, it's definitely not up to what we generally expect in J but it is still J class. If you search for an AAdvantage milesaver reward on the JFK to CUN route (using the US aa.com website) you will find that there is J available (booked into "U" class which is available to you under a OW RTW 280K reward) so it's definitely not correct for anyone to tell you that only F and Y are available on the JFK - CUN route.

 

[paul_5666]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I think you have been misinformed paul_5666. Most AA domestic flights only have F and Y but their flights from the US to Canada and the Caribbean etc. have Y & J (some may also have F but I'm not sure about that).

I think I've made a mistake, and yes you seem to be right. On the QF booking site I was seeing part F award availability on the non-direct flights with the F leg being the domestic leg and the international leg being in Y. I made the assumption that there was F on the direct international route because of the way it was displayed but there was just no J award seats available.