Whats happened with Tiger

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samh004

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I thought the decision was meant to happen on the 5th?

Can’t say next week sounds any more promising.
 

koonyaflyer

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Travel Daily says that the hearing has been adjourned until Friday the 5th of August. Interestingly flights from 29 August show very decreased routings .. No more HBA or ADL IIRC
 

oz_mark

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Tiger are hoping for the 5th:

MEDIA UPDATE STATEMENT FROM TIGER AIRWAYS AUSTRALIA – updated Monday 1 August 2011


Singapore, 3 August 2011
. Tiger Airways Holdings Limited provides the following update with regards to the suspension of Tiger Airways Australia Pty Limited's ("Tiger Airways Australia") domestic services.

As background, the Civil Aviation Safety Authority of Australia ("CASA") had applied to the Federal Court of Australia on 7 July 2011 to seek an extension to the period of suspension of Tiger Airways Australia's flights to 1 August 2011. The court hearing for this application was scheduled to be held on 3 August 2011, following a court adjournment by consent from 1 August 2011.

In relation to the above, Tiger Airways Australia and CASA, have jointly applied to the court for a further adjournment of the proceedings brought by CASA from 3 August 2011 to 5 August 2011. The court has today adjourned the proceedings by consent to 5 August 2011.

Tiger Airways Australia and CASA are currently in ongoing discussions regarding the suspension and see no utility in having a hearing today whilst these discussions continue.

Tiger Airways Australia flights will, by virtue of the adjournment, remain suspended until 5 August 2011.
 

MarkD

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I understand there were issues with tiger, but how hard is it going to be to get flying again. If they are given approval to fly they will not have any pax anyway. Going to take some really clever marketing to come back from this. Kind of feel sorry for the them in a strange way. Definately feel for the staff/ contractor hope they are being paid
 

serfty

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There was an interesting post on FT - more interesting if true: (Stick with Qantas or a large carrier for SYD-MEL - FlyerTalk Forums)
mayfam said:
Rick said about Tiger Airways: "But personally I would never trust or fly them."

That pretty well is what I'm thinking.

I took a look at what CASA flagged them for, as best I could find out. Of course, it's well known that more than one of their flights descended too low when approaching MEL. By itself, that's not a biggie, because ATC could catch it. Some flights weren't affected anyway if the crew never descended below the minimum altitude because their flight path never took them there. But what came to light is that Tiger Airways weren't maintaining a current set of "flight rules" on their airplanes, so were programming the flight director with the wrong information. This IS a biggie, because it calls into question the entire flow of information from manufacturer and certification authority and airports to Tiger's operations.

What could that mean? Examples (admittedly conjectural): a runway closure unknown to the crews; a change in the AFM (airplane flight manual) with new field length data at a high temperature condition; a change in operating procedure in severe turbulence.

As CASA probed for information, they found there was more and more to look at, and Tiger was sounding cooperative without being sufficiently responsive. I can post the link if anyone is interested.

So I fear that the errors were quite severe, and pervasive enough to require the almost-unheard-of grounding for a month (so far) by CASA. When coupled with a poor customer service record concerning delayed and cancelled flights with downright uncaring communications to passengers, I get the picture of an airline who thought that flying cheap allowed them to get away with just about anything. And they did - for a while. What finally irks me is that they are refusing to allow all pax who booked before this fiasco to cancel and get a full refund. The attitude is: "We got your money, and if we can keep it we will. Never mind that you booked on an airline with an unquestioned safety record, and now an unsafe history is evident."
 

BAM1748

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Tiger is making a release this evening in Singapore as to the current financial report - relating to Tiger Australia.
 

harvyk

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One of two things here
1. Tiger just dont get it that they are in the ****
2. CASA are being contrary and dont want tiger flying


Damn you iphone and fat fingers. Sent from my iphone and AFF app :))

I'd say Tiger just don't get it that they are in the **** is the more likely of the two answers. Remember that it's not CASA that is doing the grounding, it is the federal court. The initial 7 days was CASA's doing. The rest of that time they needed to get the courts to agree.



I understand there were issues with tiger, but how hard is it going to be to get flying again. If they are given approval to fly they will not have any pax anyway. Going to take some really clever marketing to come back from this. Kind of feel sorry for the them in a strange way. Definately feel for the staff/ contractor hope they are being paid

Difficult, but not impossible. TT's main customer base was those people who put the $ above everything else. Either through necessity, or through choice. Thus to get back in the air all TT have to do is put up some ad's about really cheap airfares and the fact they are back and "better than ever". (Ignoring the fact that the only reason they are now "better than ever" is because CASA took them to task) and they will win their pax back. The trick of course will be not only winning the pax back, but being sustainable and still following every CASA rule and regulation.
 

oz_mark

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I'd say Tiger just don't get it that they are in the **** is the more likely of the two answers. Remember that it's not CASA that is doing the grounding, it is the federal court. The initial 7 days was CASA's doing. The rest of that time they needed to get the courts to agree.

I was under the impression it was by consent, rather than the courts agreeing to it! (Tiger seem not to want its dirty laundry aired)
 

harvyk

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I was under the impression it was by consent, rather than the courts agreeing to it! (Tiger seem not to want its dirty laundry aired)

The initial grounding was CASA's doing, the additional grounding was due to CASA applying to the courts, the extention into this month was a joint CASA \ TT thing. I do expect the not wanting to air dirty laundry might have something to do with TT not putting up a fight.
 

serfty

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I am not sure whether TT lose more money by operating their aircraft then by not operating them.
 

markis10

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I'd say Tiger just don't get it that they are in the **** is the more likely of the two answers. Remember that it's not CASA that is doing the grounding, it is the federal court. The initial 7 days was CASA's doing. The rest of that time they needed to get the courts to agree.

CASA requires the court to continue its grounding authority beyond a set time limit (5 working days) , in effect so long as they have just cause its a rubber stamp by the court, so its still very much a CASA grounding while they conduct the investigation.

CASA have published a transcript of an interview this morning on 5AA with one of their people, interesting:

Civil Aviation Safety Authority - CASA interview with 5AA Friday 5 August 2011

PRESENTER: Now you were going to be in court this afternoon I think, is that still going to go in?
PETER GIBSON: Don't know at this stage, it is scheduled to go into the Federal Court in Melbourne at 2.15 this afternoon, whether that goes ahead really depends on discussions between us and Tiger this morning.
PRESENTER: I think I know the answer, but you will know that it's costing them literally millions of dollars not to be flying, do you take that into account?
PETER GIBSON: Well, we certainly take into account the fact that this is disrupting the travel plans of many, many people, we certainly do take into account that all those people who are employed by Tiger are hurt by this, so we're very mindful of the impact. But at the same time, we've got to put safety first, and it's no good us making decisions to allow Tiger back into the skies, until we're absolutely satisfied that they can operate safely now, but also more importantly, continue to operate safely into the future.
PRESENTER: Is there a chance that they won't fly again, that they won't get this right?
PETER GIBSON: Well, we certainly haven't made the decision yet on whether we can lift the suspension. We're striving to get to that position. We would like to see them flying again, but we can't make a decision on whether or not that can happen, until we're completely satisfied that all the safety issues have been addressed.
PRESENTER: Thanks for your time this morning. Peter Gibson, from the Civil Aviation Safety Authority, and that's the side we do want to know about, isn't it, if we're going to buy a ticket with Tiger, we want to know that it's all ticked off.
 

travelislife

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Well I have a flight booked with Tiger (booked in April) for Friday the 12th of August. I got an email on the 01/08/11 saying that the flight was cancelled. So they obviously know more than they are letting on or their systems are a bit confused. Either way I am not expecting to fly on with them on that date!
 

harvyk

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Well I have a flight booked with Tiger (booked in April) for Friday the 12th of August. I got an email on the 01/08/11 saying that the flight was cancelled. So they obviously know more than they are letting on or their systems are a bit confused. Either way I am not expecting to fly on with them on that date!

They have mentioned that even when CASA lifts the ban, they will not resume flights for several days afterwards as it'll take time for them to organise getting people and planes into position, and then actually selling seats on those flights.
 

fjc

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Apparently, Tiger Airways is subsidiary of Tiger Airways Holdings, which is partially owned by Singapore Airlines. Should the grounding make the Oz flying public concerned about Qantas maybe using off shore engineers and flight crews? Or, is it more a problem with Tiger's management?
 

TheInsider

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Should the grounding make the Oz flying public concerned about Qantas maybe using off shore engineers and flight crews? Or, is it more a problem with Tiger's management?

What makes Australians so much better than engineers from other places from the world?
 

Mal

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I'm thinking of taking a tiger flight when they start flying again. Anyone else up for the joy ex bne?
 
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