Western Sydney Airport (WSI) Discussion

[SeatBackForward]

I actually think it would be quicker to get to Newcastle on train than WSI from Central,

Good luck with that.

 

[SYD]

Well SYD could be expanded HKG style to have another runway floating in Botany Bay or second Sydney airport could have actually be built in Sydney.

HKG closed their city airport and moved all ops to the current airport miles away. BUT, they built the Express train from the outset.

WSI may work for freight, but it is never going to be the main gateway for tourists or business travellers into NSW.

Not sure too many people are suggesting it’ll be the “main gateway” (at least for a while).

I would never say “never”. If they build an express train (not just an all stations metro), it’s quite possible that WSI could replace SYD in time but probably not in my life time….

Good luck with that.

Yes, there’s the niggly issue that NTL doesn’t have decent PT either. Quite a large air gap between Broadmeadow and Willy town!

 

[elanshin]

Well SYD could be expanded HKG style to have another runway floating in Botany Bay or second Sydney airport could have actually be built in Sydney.

It would cost significantly more and not solve any of the commercial freight problems. On a serious note, where do you honestly think within Sydney there exists the space for another airport besides this place that the government has earmarked for the past 40 years.

I actually think it would be quicker to get to Newcastle on train than WSI from Central, as the central coast & hunter trains are generally express. Newcstle as the choice would also have other benefits as at least its gateway to the Hunter (a tourist attraction), nothing for international guests to do near WSI.

I take it you haven't caught a train to Newcastle? Its 3h unless by some miracle the HSR is built. And that's assuming nothing goes wrong which it can (not as bad as the Southern line though). Your average train will take about 45mins to reach St Marys then you swap onto the metro. It will not take more than 25-30mins from St Marys even factoring wait times.

You're looking at a journey of around 1.5hr which mind you is not that crazy if you look around the world at big city airports to downtown.

Parramatta is in its transformative phase and distance wise it'll be similar. SW Sydney is also the logistics heartbeat of not just Sydney but the whole of Australia and lots of people are living in this corner. Heck Taylor Swift went to Sydney Zoo .. TWICE (that's in Blacktown for the record).

Also as a tourist, you fly into NRT, CDG, ICN, TPE, JFK all the time. Those are all 1-1.5hr from the "city". We just have had it lucky SYD is that close to the CBD.

Well at 3am I can be at SYD in Uber/Taxi 12 minutes (no traffic) and $25. Where as at 3am there is no PT available to WSI (and Uber would be over $200 negating any savings in airfare).

I think we've well established that WSI is not near you nor for you. I can equally say the same for my friend if they want to get to SYD at 3am, that's a $150+ uber ride for them from the Blacktown area.

There will be lots of people out in that neighbourhood both western and SW that WSI is closer for.

NSW trains/metro dont run 24 hours a day. Given the request is to be at airport 2 hours (3 hours if destination is the USA) before an international flight; even for a flight departing at 7am from WSI there is no way to PT from city of Sydney to WSI (trains dont start until 5am).

I'd be very surprised if any local is departing from City of Sydney and going to WSI unless for very specific reasons. As for tourists, its one of those learning curves, vut then again I laughed at my brother for booking a 7am flight from NRT when he asked me if there was PT options and told him to shuffle himself to an airport hotel the night before.

WSI may work for freight, but it is never going to be the main gateway for tourists or business travellers into NSW.

And it's not being touted right now as the replacement for SYD. It exists to

1) shift freight to allow expansion of a highly needed capacity increase in freight delivered right next to the logistics hub of this country. SYD and Botany Bay has very limited capacity to increase logistics and warehousing space as it is.

2) As a secondary alternative in both weather events as well as late night departures/arrivals.

3) to serve the community of one of Australia's fastest growing population sectors.

Have you wondered where a lot of all those immigrants that we're having record numbers go (besides the mega rich that can afford multi-million houses outright in inner Sydney)?

2) Edit: I definitely would rather land at WSI if SYD is closed than rerouted to CBR or NTL even though I live in the lower north shore. It's a distance that a relative is "willing to drive" even if they'll grumble. Newcastle or Canberra? I'm on my own. Also I just checked for fun, its about the same distance from WSI to my place as it is from MEL to my partners parents as they live in Glen Waverley.

 

[Lynda2475]

HKG closed their city airport and moved all ops to the current airport miles away. BUT, they built the Express train from the outset.

Train from HKG to Central is 24 minutes, much much quicker than from WSI to Sydney Central.

If they build an express train (not just an all stations metro), it’s quite possible that WSI could replace SYD in time but probably not in my life time….

Hopefully I will be long dead before that ever happens.

 

[justinbrett]

Yes, there’s the niggly issue that NTL doesn’t have decent PT either. Quite a large air gap between Broadmeadow and Willy town!

It’s not that bad. It’s a direct bus from Newcastle interchange to the airport and local bus (Opal) prices. It’s not super frequent but at least hourly IIRC.

There’s also a very nice alternative of Stockton ferry from Queens Wharf to Stockton and then a short direct bus to the airport. Again all at standard opal prices and just as quick as the direct bus.

When I lived in Newcastle (Honeysuckle) and wanted to be cheap I’d go PT. Especially going towards the airport you can work to the timetables. Coming home was a gamble to see if the bus times worked out.

 

[RooFlyer]

Absolutely. Hopefully for those of us not living in Sydney though one day it gives us on option of a decent transfer between domestic and International rather then the current unsatisfactory setup at SYD

Exactly. All this talk about how far by car or train to WSI for Sydneysiders at the moment. Does anyone actually think that with the airport growth, the public transport won't expand? Just like it did for SYD? And the concept that Sydney airports are just for Sydneysiders is pretty lame.

Many of us in regional areas, or even smaller capitals like Adelaide need to fly to one of the east coast cities to begin international. At the moment, I avoid SYD like the plague - the Dom-Int transfer, the old infrastructure etc. I would fly in and out of WSI over SYD any day and as I've said before, I think airlines will encourage use of WSI by fares and scheduling. Core services at SYD (with some slots opened up by moving non-core to WSI), lesser demand flights at WSI, but possible scheduled connections.

Well SYD could be expanded HKG style to have another runway floating in Botany Bay or second Sydney airport could have actually be built in Sydney.

And the noise and environmental consequences? The population density around SYD means that it will never be expanded nor things like Bankstown expanded (I know nothing about that airport, other than it exists). Considering the cost, traffic congestion, noise and everything else, no government would approve an application by SYD airport to expand. They would simply say "WTF - what are you thinking? We've got this new international airport at WSI, with expansion built in. You were offered first right to build and develop it, but you declined. Tough."

 

[Lynda2475]

It would cost significantly more and not solve any of the commercial freight problems. On a serious note, where do you honestly think within Sydney there exists the space for another airport besides this place that the government has earmarked for the past 40 years.

Well my preference is to remove SYD curfew and expand SYD into Botany Bay adding a genuine 3rd runway (not one that criss crosses the other 2) and possibly a 4th runway.

Also Bankstown could have been converted to a freight airport.

Noting WSI's location was only confirmed in 2014 (that is only 10 years by my count), had governments actually planned properly for growth 40 years ago there would have been plenty of land on outskirts of metro Sydney already on rail lines. In the 80s (40 years ago) 5 mins past Liverpool station was all hobby farms (which could have been acquired cheaply).

I take it you haven't caught a train to Newcastle?

Nope and I admit to confusing with central coast (also a place with plenty of undeveloped land 40 years ago).

Your average train will take about 45mins to reach St Marys then you swap onto the metro. It will not take more than 25-30mins from St Marys even factoring wait times.

But you have to get to central first to then get a train that goes to St Mary's so 1.5hr best case scenario to get to WSI (and if charges are similar to current airport access fee then more expensive than a Uber in peak time to SYD).

I think we've well established that WSI is not near you nor for you. I can equally say the same for my friend if they want to get to SYD at 3am, that's a $150+ uber ride for them from the Blacktown area.

But they chose to live that distance from the existing airport. I chose to buy within 30 mins of SYD, and if anything other than LCCs go to WSI it makes flying impractical for me or my fellow frequent flyers who routinely need to land at MEL by 7:30 to be confident of making 8:30am meetings in CBD.

I'd be very surprised if any local is departing from City of Sydney and going to WSI unless for very specific reasons.

My point exactly, its not a reasonable commute whatsoever for any local (or tourist) living (staying) in the city, eastern suburbs, north shore, inner west, southern suburbs, a huge chunk of West (i.e. Strathfield to Paramatta) and a lot of the South West (Bankstown).

As for tourists, its one of those learning curves, vut then again I laughed at my brother for booking a 7am flight from NRT when he asked me if there was PT options and told him to shuffle himself to an airport hotel the night before.

There isnt exactly a plethora of hotels planned for WSI. Have any 4 star offerings been announced? At least at LHR you have a Sofitel connected to the terminal.

2) As a secondary alternative in both weather events as well as late night departures/arrivals

Interesting, right now if a plane diverts to CBR or BNE due to weather QF put you up in a hotel overnight. I imagine if you end up at WSI (instead of SYD) that QF wont be stumping up the extra $170 in Uber fares to get you back to your home in Sydney.

 

[SeatBackForward]

There isnt exactly a plethora of hotels planned for WSI. Have any 4 star offerings been announced? At least at LHR you have a Sofitel connected to the terminal.
...
Interesting, right now if a plane diverts to CBR or BNE due to weather QF put you up in a hotel overnight. I imagine if you end up at WSI (instead of SYD) that QF wont be stumping up the extra $170 in Uber fares to get you back to your home in Sydney.

They're so thick in Notsydney, that is anything west of Pyrmont, that they build airports without considering all the other things an airport might need...oh wait.

Major Development Plans​

Proposals for large development projects at Western Sydney International Airport are approved by the Australian Government as a Major Development Plan (MDP). Below are the MDPs that have been approved at WSI.
...

The Major Development Plan proposes a ‘precinct’ concept (see below) that will deliver serviced super-lots, arterial road connections, an internal road network and the construction of a warehouse, bulky goods building, and a hotel precinct, to serve the early requirements of the region and airport operations.

...

Construction Estate works for the BPSO are scheduled to commence in late 2023, and will be completed by July 2024, with the warehouse, bulky goods development and hotel estimated to be completed by late 2025.

And this is just upon opening.

 

[Quickstatus]

Here is the Link for the WSI precint
There is a lot of development in that area which will exceed the forward lifetimes of those commenting here.

 

[jase05]

Also Bankstown could have been converted to a freight airport.

Hilarious stuff

 

[jase05]

Here is the Link for the WSI precint
There is a lot of development in that area which will exceed the forward lifetimes of those commenting here.

Exactly.
This isn’t about our lifetimes it’s about generations into the future
Happy for the government to invest in the future

 

[Lynda2475]

They're so thick in Notsydney, that is anything west of Pyrmont, that they build airports without considering all the other things an airport might need...oh wait.

So only 1 hotel, with no brand or class noted, probably an Ibis Budget (no thanks).

But my point was I wouldn't want to stay out there, just get back to Sydney as fast as possible in the unfortunate event I was every diverted there. And that the airline if it diverts somewhere more than an hour away from the destination purchased should be liable for the cost to get me to the location I actually purchased.

Post automatically merged: Aug 27, 2024

Hilarious stuff

No more hilarious than building an airport outside of Sydney and then using Sydney in the name.

 

[Himeno]

Well my preference is to remove SYD curfew and expand SYD into Botany Bay adding a genuine 3rd runway (not one that criss crosses the other 2) and possibly a 4th runway.

Right now, you could consider WSI to be NRT. Maybe in 30 years, they'll expand SYD into the bay and do what they did for HND.

 

[jase05]

No more hilarious than building an airport outside of Sydney and then using Sydney in the name.

Clearly you don’t know how freight operates to even suggest Bankstown.

At the end of the day no one is asking you to go out there but there will be millions that do and in 40-50 years hopefully people look back on it and thank the government for the foresight to make it happen.

 

[Himeno]

No more hilarious than building an airport outside of Sydney and then using Sydney in the name.

No different to many of the airports across Europe that Ryanair fly's to.

 

[dajop]

But my point was I wouldn't want to stay out there, just get back to Sydney as fast as possible in the unfortunate event I was every diverted there. And that the airline if it diverts somewhere more than an hour away from the destination purchased should be liable for the cost to get me to the location I actually purchased.

This happens already, BNE/OOL and MEL/AVV - IIRC typically passengers seem to either wait until plane resumes to final destination or they put a bus on to get them there.

 

[RooFlyer]

Right now, you could consider WSI to be NRT. Maybe in 30 years, they'll expand SYD into the bay and do what they did for HND.

Except NRT is still out in the countryside after all the years after opening. WSI is starting off from the edge of the urban conurbation.

You could think of it this way - SYD is on the eastern edge of greater Sydney and WSI is on the western edge.

 

[jase05]

No different to many of the airports across Europe that Ryanair fly's to.

Belongs in the travel mistakes thread but yes as a young fella it was a rude shock to land at Frankfurt-Hahn for the first time only to realise it’s nowhere near Frankfurt and having to hitch a ride into Koblenz

 

[Lynda2475]

No different to many of the airports across Europe that Ryanair fly's to.

Well Im not concerned with LCCs, only full service airlines.

 

[dajop]

No different to many of the airports across Europe that Ryanair fly's to.

London Stansted, about the same distance from central London and WSI is from the centre of Sydney.