VA aircraft update requirements?

[PERLHR]

As I sit on an internet provided (allegedly) 18 year old 737 in Row 2, I look around. It's scruffy, it has no PowerPoints, it's generally old, it's on a mainline trunk route between Perth and Melbourne and back. It takes nearly an hour to provide the meal (one working front cabin out of a crew of 6 (I think in the cabin...maybe 4) and you can't help but ask is this business class? Sure once the meal was served (it was ok) and the drinks did flow (albeit via call button) not actively checking to ask), i do wonder if its actually simply better down the back on Qantas. IE Meal is provided, lounge access if one has status, drinks will come, power point provided. VA using such old aircraft on this route should really think again!

 

[RooFlyer]

Yep, Qantas has A330s on that route; much better and the way to go if price isn't a hurdle. Except they are regularly and unpredictably subbed out with a ... old B737.

 

[PERLHR]

Yep, Qantas has A330s on that route; much better and the way to go if price isn't a hurdle. Except they are regularly and unpredictably subbed out with a ... old B737.

True. Certainly experienced often enough 330 to 737 to MEL and SYD. Just can't win ...

 

[antycbr]

True. Certainly experienced often enough 330 to 737 to MEL and SYD. Just can't win ...

Go via SQ - except they’ll have you on regional J…

 

[Cessna 180]

Agreed. (Although the age of the plane is irrelevant as I am sure all the required maintenance is complete.) The cabin itself is getting a bit shabby but then what else will they do on a 737?

I upgraded with VA on this exact route a couple of months ago. Was in 1F.

From memory the service was ok, A meal on a plate and a couple of average wines to while away the time. I had some podcasts and a book to read so was ok there, however one thing I do enjoy generally when I upgrade is watching a film on the seat back telly. Just a novelty for me as I do not generally watch many films.

But I did also think the exact same thought, that If I was in row 4 or the exit row on QF, I would have been just as well off.

The few VA flights I have taken last year all seem pretty lack lustre. At least on QF every body gets something and if in J and a good crew it can be a really good experience.

Anyone at our work who travels a bit and were previously VA loyalists are swapping if they can.

 

[PERLHR]

cabin itself is getting a bit shabby but then what else will they do on a 737?

I guess having PowerPoints and the likes should not be that difficult . Never disputing the maintenance on the aircraft but inside and especially in Biz on some of these older 737s really do leave something to make you think again. Quite often I seem to be seeing that the PER sectors are given the dross.

 

[Harrison_133]

I guess having PowerPoints and the likes should not be that difficult .

This will be resolved as the entire fleet is fitted with new business class seats over the next 18 months, noting the first few aircraft to be reconfigured have been older ones.

I don't think you can really judge the age of the aircraft. Qantas are flying A330s and 737s on those routes that are upwards of 21 years old.

 

[Cessna 180]

I guess having PowerPoints and the likes should not be that difficult . Never disputing the maintenance on the aircraftbut inside and especially on Biz on some of these older 737s really do leave something to make you think again. Quite often I seem to be seeing that Per sectors are given the dross.

Fair point, it should not really be that hard to wire in a plug at each seat.

They really do not seem to care about providing any kind of service whatsoever.

 

[oz_mark]

I guess having PowerPoints and the likes should not be that difficult . Never disputing the maintenance on the aircraftbut inside and especially on Biz on some of these older 737s really do leave something to make you think again. Quite often I seem to be seeing that Per sectors are given the dross.

Not sure, I've seen Brisbane folk complain they get all the old aircraft. I've seen Adelaide folk complain they get all the old planes. The old ones are just all around the network.

 

[jase05]

Fair point, it should not really be that hard to wire in a plug at each seat.

They really do not seem to care about providing any kind of service whatsoever.

They are refitting new seating across the whole fleet. This is not something that can be done overnight

 

[elanshin]

Old planes aren't necessarily that bad if they're refurbished and maintained. It's just that usually airlines don't regular refurbish planes they think are on their last legs, then end up using them for another decade.

In all honesty, if VA can refresh their fleet faster than QF, they will get a slight advantage although QF is also in fleet renewal /refurbishment mode.

If VA had all the planes available, would the Max10 be the plane they use for Transcon?

 

[jb747]

Fair point, it should not really be that hard to wire in a plug at each seat.

I don't think it's that simple.The aircraft don't generally use 220/240 volt, and even if they have some, it may be able to handle much draw. So, you need a source of the power, then you need to distribute it safely. Later aircraft were built with it in mind, but not so much the older ones.

 

[henrus]

Fair point, it should not really be that hard to wire in a plug at each seat.

Hmm it's not as simple as just running an extension lead out of the 110V plug in the loo.

Astronics EmPower is the most common system and they've got this very basic diagram on their site. In short once connected to the aircrafts 3 phase power system, wiring is then required between each seat row with power supplies then the outlets installed. All this takes a fair amount of time because it needs to be installed under things that need to be removed like carpet/seats/roof etc.

The install is similar for USB and the following video gives a brief overview of wiring involved:

As jb747 mentioned above, simple for new aircraft but a pain for existing fleet.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Agreed. (Although the age of the plane is irrelevant as I am sure all the required maintenance is complete.) The cabin itself is getting a bit shabby but then what else will they do on a 737?

I upgraded with VA on this exact route a couple of months ago. Was in 1F.

From memory the service was ok, A meal on a plate and a couple of average wines to while away the time. I had some podcasts and a book to read so was ok there, however one thing I do enjoy generally when I upgrade is watching a film on the seat back telly. Just a novelty for me as I do not generally watch many films.

But I did also think the exact same thought, that If I was in row 4 or the exit row on QF, I would have been just as well off.

The few VA flights I have taken last year all seem pretty lack lustre. At least on QF every body gets something and if in J and a good crew it can be a really good experience.

Anyone at our work who travels a bit and were previously VA loyalists are swapping if they can.

The only difference between VA business and Qantas economy is the wider seat and some extra legroom.

With qantas you’re pretty assured of getting IFE and fast wifi in all cabins. VA on the other hand will give the front cabin a pre-departure beverage.

 

[PERLHR]

Hmm it's not as simple as just running an extension lead out of the 110V plug in the loo.

Astronics EmPower is the most common system and they've got this very basic diagram on their site. In short once connected to the aircrafts 3 phase power system, wiring is then required between each seat row with power supplies then the outlets installed. All this takes a fair amount of time because it needs to be installed under things that need to be removed like carpet/seats/roof etc.
View attachment 367005
The install is similar for USB and the following video gives a brief overview of wiring involved:

As jb747 mentioned above, simple for new aircraft but a pain for existing fleet.

Having said all that ofcourse....quite a number of carriers throughout the world have indeed refurbed their existing older fleet.....to keep up with the competition....anyhow we believe that VA are in the process of ...but it still does make the paying travelling public consider what they want and while QF have the older aircraft (737) the majority I have bee on from SYD and MEL to PER have had if I recall re charging points...and for 4 hours or so...it's kinda useful! Why is the VA WiFi so rubbish compared to QF? They proudly announce it on the deck and it hardly ever works en route!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Having said all that ofcourse....quite a number of carriers throughout the world have indeed refurbed their existing older fleet.....to keep up with the competition....anyhow we believe that VA are in the process of ...but it still does make the paying travelling public consider what they want and while QF have the older aircraft (737) the majority I have bee on from SYD and MEL to PER have had if I recall re charging points...and for 4 hours or so...it's kinda useful! Why is the VA WiFi so rubbish compared to QF? They proudly announce it on the deck and it hardly ever works en route!

I’d still take an unrefurbished 18-year-old 737 over a new Max8 or 9!

 

[antycbr]

The only difference between VA business and Qantas economy is the wider seat and some extra legroom.

And several hundred dollars typically, for the same 737 recliner type cabin.

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

This is the(ir) money pinching VA.
BrettG and JohnB left a long time ago.
Even PaulS.
Just thank your (insert what or who your lucky is with), here, that we have a pretty good VA, who have lounges with loos attached, ...
Yes, ZL might be good in some respects, but when it comes to the mini compact ADL lounge with no loos enclosed, you get it.
JayneH and her team are in the not to spend too much mode.
Make do with what you have.
Look at it this way, nearly all the aircraft they buy, are 2nd hand.
Except the max.
---
Maybe with the sale, and new buyer of VA3, we might get new things/(toys) on board to pass the flight time.

 

[ThatMrBlake]

They are refitting new seating across the whole fleet. This is not something that can be done overnight

It’s a shame though they are only doing a half hearted refurb on the older birds. No new luggage bins or sky interior - just new seats in what still looks like a dated 737. Also removing a row of economy x also removes a row of competitive advantage vs QF.

You also have to wonder what type of next gen recliner QF may possibly install which potentially will make the new VA seats look second rate in J.

 

[HS-TQE]

It’s a shame though they are only doing a half hearted refurb on the older birds. No new luggage bins or sky interior - just new seats in what still looks like a dated 737. Also removing a row of economy x also removes a row of competitive advantage vs QF.

You also have to wonder what type of next gen recliner QF may possibly install which potentially will make the new VA seats look second rate in J.

If EconomyX wasn't getting the 'premium' (i.e mostly upgrades/redemptions) with the extra row and Private Equity felt they could make more with squeezing in more Y seats with the LCC-ish seats, then it makes perfect sense for Private Equity to reduce the EconomyX row by 1 to get more paid revenue/premium for EconomyX.