Two-way Trans-Tasman Bubble starting 19 April 2021

Kiwi_Flyer

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The wording in the declaration is

6. I declare that I have been in New Zealand for the 14 days prior to my flight to Australia.
 

Berlin

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The wording in the declaration is

6. I declare that I have been in New Zealand for the 14 days prior to my flight to Australia.
That doesn't really match with all those great Ski getaways to Queenstown that Jacynda had been touting, does it?
 

Beano

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That is on a different page. We'll just have to see how it works out with the first travellers, hopefully reporting on these pages.
 

Kiwi_Flyer

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That was the wording when I completed my declaration for next week. Hopefully the wording will be amended soon.

From NZ government's perspective it would be great if all Aussie visitors stayed for at least 2 weeks.

That is on a different page. We'll just have to see how it works out with the first travellers, hopefully reporting on these pages.

That is the actual declaration you have to make, at the time that I did mine. Qantas website wording is somewhat irrelevant.
 

burmans

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The fact they haven’t changed yet doesn’t mean they won’t. Current wording is correct until the changeover date!
 

henrus

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The fact they haven’t changed yet doesn’t mean they won’t. Current wording is correct until the changeover date!
Technically though people can already apply for ATD's after the changeover date. Anyone doing a return to Australia in the first 3 days of the bubble will be caught out by this.
 

Berlin

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I started to look at booking early in the bubble to take advantage of the points only flights in QF J.
However, with no lounge access in either SYD or AKL and limited in-flight food/beverages (less than QF domestic at the moment) and no IFE there is no way I mam going to use the standard number of points until the level of service returns to somewhat normal levels.
NZ E service appears pretty normal and better use of cash if you're going down that path.
Looks like we will be getting at least Business class lounge food and drinks in the "First" class lounge spaces. Not the same as the proper Flounge but better than nothing.
 

Kiwi_Flyer

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The fact they haven’t changed yet doesn’t mean they won’t. Current wording is correct until the changeover date!

It should be changed at least 3 days before 19th given must apply between 3 & 7 days before travel. The period has already started for some people.
 

henrus

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Btw- I just scored J class tickets from Auckland to the Gold Coast on Qantas at a sales fare of a little over 500$ each which is a bargain at these times if you ask me
That's not too shabby. I'm using google flights so prices are in AUD but at just $181 to upgrade it's quite a good deal (also comes with 60 extra status credits). Sadly the other direction (OOL-AKL) doesn't match. It seems to be ~5 May to 30 October on sale.
 

Beano

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Technically though people can already apply for ATD's after the changeover date. Anyone doing a return to Australia in the first 3 days of the bubble will be caught out by this.
I'm waiting for Australian clients to visit us in NZ. If they have to stay 14 days, that may be a problem.
 

dajop

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My take on that is that if you were to come back having left Australia without applying for an exemption (or being exempt automatically), you'd be in breach of the current COVID Biosecurity Outbound restrictions which currently has a maximum penalty of 300 penalty units ($63,000) or 5-year imprisonment. Now they won't use the full amount but I'd expect some fine at the very least, people are going to try this and I suspect they may try and make an example of a few people early on.
The way the determination is currently written is all about leaving Australian territory (not coming back), and that you are not allowed to leave Australian territory unless you have an exemption to leave Australia. Specifically:

An Australian citizen or permanent resident (the person) must not leave Australian territory as a passenger on an outgoing aircraft or vessel unless:
(a) an exemption set out in section 6 applies to the person
BUT, you are granted an exemption by travelling direct to New Zealand.
An exemption from the requirements of section 5 applies to the following persons:
(a) ...
(f)a person who:
(i) is travelling directly to New Zealand; and
(ii) has been only in Australia for at least 14 days immediately before the day the flight or voyage of the outgoing aircraft or vessel commences.
(just quoting the pertinent parts)

But once outside Australian Territory then it seems there is no further restrictions in either this determination or the inbound traveller requirements. However I am sure if this loophole was exploited in any significant way, the legal minds within the Australian public service could frame appropriate determinations to prevent this happening.
 

burmans

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Technically though people can already apply for ATD's after the changeover date. Anyone doing a return to Australia in the first 3 days of the bubble will be caught out by this.
Agree the transition period may be problematic. You could always apply for an exemption, it is clear the current wording does not reflect the intent.
 

justinbrett

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I think it's pretty clear:

Automatic exemptions​

You are exempt from travel restrictions, and can leave Australia without applying for an exemption if you are:
travelling directly to New Zealand and you have been in Australia for 14 days or more immediately before your travel date
Note: This only applies when New Zealand is the destination of travel. If you are transiting through New Zealand to another destination, you must apply for an outward travel exemption.

I'd argue if you clear NZ immigration you have not transited. Stay a couple of nights and then go somewhere else.

NZ legally can't do anything to stop you leaving NZ. Australia - short of cancelling your passport - can't do anything either.
 

justinbrett

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But once outside Australian Territory then it seems there is no further restrictions in either this determination or the inbound traveller requirements. However I am sure if this loophole was exploited in any significant way, the legal minds within the Australian public service could frame appropriate determinations to prevent this happening.

They can penalise you on return, but not much they can do to prevent it (unless they cancel your passport)
 
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dajop

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They can penalise you on return, but not much they can do to prevent it (unless they cancel your passport)

True, perhaps the best word is "discourage" it rather than "prevent" it. Although one could argue there are already substantial disincentives to such actions. For one person a trip AKL-SIN-MEL could to cost up to $6000 including hotel quarantine (and that's using Scoot to travel SIN-MEL @$1400 one way). Go further the costs could end up being $10-15000....
 

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