The COVID-19 vaccine rollout in Australia has begun

jakeseven7

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It’s not about the national average that I am “whining“ @ketsuzei. It is for getting out of our local 1 week lockdown that has now been extended to 9 weeks and the Chief Minister has made it pretty clear that the only way he thinks we can “safely open” is if our vaccination rate is close to 90% of 12+ population double vaxxed. That’s going to take a lot longer than 80% of the 16+ population. It’s not in line with the National plan at all. It is a moving of the goal posts.

I understand and empathise, having to listen to Chief Minister Barr lapping up the limelight and milking his 15 minutes for every second is somewhat nauseating and by continually moving the goal posts means that all the Premiers / Chief Ministers will extend their chokehold on us all for a while longer.

I do sense a massive amount of resentment building though, media is fanning it now (as they realise perpetual lockdowns/lockouts are going to kill them too) and I’m genuinely fearful of the civil disobedience that is already in full display, exploding into something quite nasty….. :(
 
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N860CR

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genuinely fearful of the civil disobedience that is already in full display, exploding into something quite nasty….. :(

The issue I’m seeing (in Sydney anyway) is that people are totally over it and compliance on an overall scale is poor. Considering the house of cards comes down as a result of one rule breach, the entire system has already collapsed. Even my few “Corona-crazy” friends and acquaintances seem to have moved on (one even asked me in for a wine after walking the dogs… she’d have shot me for even suggesting that 8 weeks ago).

What we do have, however, are police resources being sent to “target” certain groups/areas when the non-compliance is widespread. I didn’t buy into that initially when the targeting of south west Sydney began, but it’s quite blatant now and that level of what is basically ethnic profiling will lead something more extreme (and to an extent, it should).
 

Pom-DownUnder

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He knows the ACT will have basically no choice but to open up when NSW does, and just wants the ACT's vaccination level to be as high as possible by then. Do you really think that any other jurisdiction would be opening up at the moment if they had 10-20 cases a day? What specific policy settings would you be easing right now? Can you give a specific number for the acceptable number of hospitalizations?

I've lost a small fortune by not being able to travel overseas for work, but complaining about Canberra's current lockdown seems just a tad rich to me. This is basically the only time that a lockdown makes at least some sense, and fortunately for Canberra it's the first one we've needed after more than a year of pretty much business as normal.
i think its understood and accepted for the most part.

what we want is very simple:

"When we get to 80% double dose, I guarentee government will be scaled back and be much less intrusive in your life"

rather than coulds and ifs and maybes and 'if you are a good little minions you might get to look at the sun through a window for 5 minutes a day'
 

ketsuzei

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what we want is very simple:

"When we get to 80% double dose, I guarentee government will be scaled back and be much less intrusive in your life"

rather than coulds and ifs and maybes and 'if you are a good little minions you might get to look at the sun through a window for 5 minutes a day'
Well then it's the national plan you have an issue with, or else you just don't understand it. Where is that assurance currently on offer outside the ACT?

If you think Barr is worthy of such vitriol, then you're unlikely to be happy under any Australian administration. Much of what he said yesterday (such as not bothering about introducing a vaccine check system for pubs and the like because it will only be a matter of around *five days* between the 70% and 80% thresholds (however defined), and not wanting to go down the slippery slope of possibly checking for vaccination against flu or polio or whatever) was indeed about minimizing government interference.

Beyond that you might just need to grow up as to what's realistic under current circumstances. Stomping your feet and saying "but but but but it says 80% of 16+" isn't going to get the job done.
 
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Seat0B

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He knows the ACT will have basically no choice but to open up when NSW does, and just wants the ACT's vaccination level to be as high as possible by then. Do you really think that any other jurisdiction would be opening up at the moment if they had 10-20 cases a day? What specific policy settings would you be easing right now? Can you give a specific number for the acceptable number of hospitalizations?

I've lost a small fortune by not being able to travel overseas for work, but complaining about Canberra's current lockdown seems just a tad rich to me. This is basically the only time that a lockdown makes at least some sense, and fortunately for Canberra it's the first one we've needed after more than a year of pretty much business as normal.
I too have lost a small fortune by being unable to travel for work, and that is exactly why I am complaining. If it’s ok for NSW to open up at 80% double vaxxed of 16+, even with 1000+ cases per day - and this is what the national plan says, then why is it not ok for ACT to also open up at 80% double vaxxed with 10-20 cases a day (which proportional to population of Sydney would be equivalent no more than 200-250 cases a day)? Why do we here in the ACT have to go for 90% of 12+? I want my ability to earn a living to be restored, and that is before we even talk about seeing overseas family members.

To be clear, what I am unhappy about is not exactly the lockdown, but rather the extension of the lockdown to chase COVID zero, which will never happen given where we are geographically, by unilaterally following a much higher target than the national plan requires. It is a pointless moving of goal posts which causes economic harm and mental health harm, for not much health benefit.

We may disagree, so I won’t be posting any further on this.
 
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justinbrett

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The problem is the ACT is an LGA that's trying to act like a state. It's still trying to blame NSW for the outbreak despite it and VIC having the same result. So for one, let's just accept the virus is not a political failing and stop trying to apportion blame. It's not helpful.

It's also completely unrealistic the ACT can move independent of NSW when it's an enclave. I don't understand why the national average matters if your borders are closed to the rest of the country. Nobody is opening to NSW on 18 October, so pointless to wait any longer. It seems ACT could be realistic about its geographical location and sync its plan with NSW - even if the NSW travel restrictions linger for a short period after opening up.

I very much doubt it will be only 5 days between 70% and 80%, and nobody in NSW or VIC said everything comes off on day one once we get to 80%. I think they've been pretty clear you'll probably still need to be vaccinated to go to a pub post 80%.
 

mviy

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2% a day is the kind of speed you might get in an age cohort when very few have been vaccinated when demand is expected to be at its peak. I also think 5 days between 70% and 80% is completely unrealistic.
 

Pom-DownUnder

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Well then it's the national plan you have an issue with, or else you just don't understand it. Where is that assurance currently on offer outside the ACT?

If you think Barr is worthy of such vitriol, then you're unlikely to be happy under any Australian administration. Much of what he said yesterday (such as not bothering about introducing a vaccine check system for pubs and the like because it will only be a matter of around *five days* between the 70% and 80% thresholds (however defined), and not wanting to go down the slippery slope of possibly checking for vaccination against flu or polio or whatever) was indeed about minimizing government interference.

Beyond that you might just need to grow up as to what's realistic under current circumstances. Stomping your feet and saying "but but but but it says 80% of 16+" isn't going to get the job done.
Your personal swipes aside ...

Barr is quite good on privacy, happy to give him that, when it comes to vaccine passports I think he is one of the stronger premiers with understanding of how it can be a thin end of the wedge / intrusive etc

On freedoms though he is woeful, attaching far too heavily to the 'protect you because you are unable to protect yourself' condescension is persistently annoying.

much as NSW has done things right, done things wrong, the premise that 'the monday immediately following x% ... this happens' I think is the firmest we have seen other than WA being firm on keeping their heads buried in the sand.

As to 'happy under any Australian administration' happy to concede I thought the public would push back much harder on such tight government control it has been quite eye opening.
 

33kft

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Anyway on more positive news, looks like VIC will pass 70% shortly!
Given at the start of the month this was predicted to be crossed on the 23rd, it will be a bit of a morale boost for lockdown weary Victorians that it will likely be crossed 6 days early.

I don't think the easings (10km / longer exercise) will make much of a difference but the light at the end of the tunnel certainly will.
 

mviy

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On Sunday the VIC government needs to tie some freedoms to hitting different targets. There needs to be some meaningful freedoms for 80% first dose as this is a leading indicator of most likely reaching 80% fully vaccinated. They also should outline what will happen when 70% and 80% fully vaccinated are reached.
 

ketsuzei

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2% a day is the kind of speed you might get in an age cohort when very few have been vaccinated when demand is expected to be at its peak.
Yeah, like a scenario where you're giving second shots to the 12-15 cohort and have relatively few first shots left to deliver. Whether it's five days or seven, the basic point stands.
 

justinbrett

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Yeah, like a scenario where you're giving second shots to the 12-15 cohort and have relatively few first shots left to deliver. Whether it's five days or seven, the basic point stands.

It's going to take over 14 days to get first jabs from 70% to 80%, I'm not sure how you think it's going to be any quicker for second jabs.
 

lovetravellingoz

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In welcome news for something that should have occurred weeks ago all Vic construction workers will now need to have had at least their first vaccination dose by midnight next Thursday to work on a construction site.

This should spike the vaccination rate up, and moreso as to do it within a week will mean that many will need to get AZ. While some Pfizer had already been set aside for construction workers I doubt that given the size of industry that it would be anywhere near the possible demand that is likely from doing this within a week.

Note that while the Commonwealth Gov announced some extra Pfizer/Moderna doses that it would appear from bookings that those extra Pfizer doses have not yet arrived, and Moderna was not scheduled to be delivered to Pharmacists till Monday 20th Sept (so possibly another day or so to get any volume into arms).
By Peta Fuller, ABC News

Vaccines will be mandatory for Victorian construction workers

Those who work in the sector will need to get their first does by next Thursday, September 23.
Daniel Andrews says there will be some limited medical exemptions but: "That industry needs to take this seriously."
There'll also be some limited exemptions if people can prove they've booked an appointment.
Tea rooms will need to close and food and drink can't be consumed indoors at work.
By Michael Doyle, ABC News

Construction workers will not be allowed to cross between metropolitan Melbourne and regional Victoria

From 11:59pm on Friday, construction workers will not be allowed to travel back and forth between metropolitan Melbourne and regional areas.
Premier Daniel Andrews says movement from construction workers was a risk to regional communities and it was no longer safe.
"They're not easy decisions to make but there is no alternative," he said.
 
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burmans

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2% a day is the kind of speed you might get in an age cohort when very few have been vaccinated when demand is expected to be at its peak. I also think 5 days between 70% and 80% is completely unrealistic.
Agree, in my view there will be an inevitable slow down in the vaccination rate between 70 and 80%.
 

lovetravellingoz

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The Victorian Government expects to reach the 70 per cent first dose target today, and due to this has announced some changes to the Greater Melbourne and Regional (Note regional also has had many other easing's already) Restrictions.


For Greater Melbourne:
By Peta Fuller, ABC News

Some restrictions will be eased for those in lockdown

Victoria will hit their 70 per cent first dose target today. And that means *some* freedoms.
  • Outdoor gatherings will be allowed. But it'll depend on your vaccine level — those with no vaccine or one dose: limited to groups of two. Fully vaccinated: groups of five (but from two households)
  • An increase of the radius for shopping and exercise from 5 to 10 kilometres
  • An increase of exercise time from two to four hours
  • The reopening of outdoor communal gym equipment and skate parks
  • Personal training with up to two people plus the trainer
  • In-home childcare extended to families where just one parent is an essential worker
  • Real estate inspections for new purchases and ending leases
  • An increase of construction staff from 25 to 50 per cent, where 90 per cent of those staff are vaccinated

In Regional Victoria indoor gyms and pools will reopen, with density and capacity limits in place, and tour transport can operate with up to 10 people per vehicle.
 

Must...Fly!

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From 11:59pm on Friday, construction workers will not be allowed to travel back and forth between metropolitan Melbourne and regional areas.
That is going to be devastating to a lot of people. So many commute in from outer areas which are nominally regional because they can't afford to live anywhere else closer to the CBD.
 

mviy

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And smaller builders take on work where they can get it, so even if based in metro they could head to regional areas to do jobs, so this will be devastating for them as well. Hopefully these restrictions will be one of the early ones to get removed on the roadmap as higher vaccination levels are met. We'll have to see what's announced on Sunday.
 

ketsuzei

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It's going to take over 14 days to get first jabs from 70% to 80%, I'm not sure how you think it's going to be any quicker for second jabs.
No doubt you all know better, but what I was referring to (along with my knowledge of advance bookings) was:


Mr Barr on Tuesday said the ACT government did not anticipate it would need to allow fully vaccinated Canberrans different freedoms, because the difference between 70 and 80 per cent vaccination coverage in the territory would be about five days.
 

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