The 6:30am BNE-SYD is gone and I am not on it [No ESTA]

[drron]

We were travelling to Hawaii in February and had problems with ESTA. We did my 12 year old nephew his ESTA app about 3 weeks prior to travel and double checked the application, and it came back "Application Pending". It was approved later that evening. When they checked in at Perth to fly via Sydney, the passport number entered was wrong, so he had to redo his ESTA there and then in Perth, otherwise he could not get on the flight to Sydney to connect. Lucky they got to the airport with enough time.
on the same day, my daughter-in-law flew Qantas to Melbourne, and then had to connect to Jetstar to fly to Hawaii and was checked in at Melbourne about 1 hour before her flight.
About 15 minutes before check in closed, the check in girl approached her and told her she could not get on the flight because she didn't have a currest ESTA. She didn't know she needed a new ESTA when she got a new passport and thought nothing of it. Lucky she had her mobile and did the application only for it to saying it
was pending. Supervisor was so nice he kept checking to see if it was approved and held the check in open for 10 minutes after close. OMG it finally approved, otherwise she could not board. Meant having to fly the next day via Sydney, with change fees. The girl was really sorry, as she stuffed up and should have known at check in. Anyway, we all made it to Hawaii after such panic.

OMG.So now we have an example where a proper LCC could bend the rules to help a passenger but VA cant.
JohnK's assertion that it acts like a LCC is obviously wrong.They are more inflexible than a LCC.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

OMG.So now we have an example where a proper LCC could bend the rules to help a passenger but VA cant.
JohnK's assertion that it acts like a LCC is obviously wrong.They are more inflexible than a LCC.

I might be mistaken but it looks like QF bent the rules here? QF was the operator of the domestic connection.

However, while it looks like QF was willing to keep the option to check-in open as late as possible, there doesn't seem to be any mention that a boarding pass would have been issued anyway and the pax allowed to fly to SYD if the ESTA hadn't come through in time.

 

[serfty]

You know ... the more I think about this, the more I feel the Very Low fare of AUD370 r/t was the reason 'hearts were hardened'.

I have no doubt VA staff in BNE could have been more flexible - and initially were showing indication of doing so but it seems something changed in the backroom.

By whatever "rules", VA have been honoring these fares - but if a PAX fails to adhere to the "rules" (intentionally or not) then ... tough for the PAX.

It's not LCC - it's just commerce ...

If I were running a business I would do the same thing - I am perfectly entitled to do so.

I have one of these fares later this year with a 6am departure from MEL ... I normally rent a car (I live a 1½ hour drive from MEL) - in this case I will just stay at an Airport hotel and walk across at 4am ...

 

[greenfish]

You know ... the more I think about this, the more I feel the Very Low fare of AUD370 r/t was the reason 'hearts were hardened'.

I have no doubt VA staff in BNE could have been more flexible - and initially were showing indication of doing so but it seems something changed in the backroom.

By whatever "rules", VA have been honoring these fares - but if a PAX fails to adhere to the "rules" (intentionally or not) then ... tough for the PAX.

It's not LCC - it's just commerce ...

If I were running a business I would do the same thing - I am perfectly entitled to do so.

I have one of these fares later this year with a 6am departure from MEL ... I was going to rent a car - in this case I will just stay at an Airport hotel and walk across at 4am ...

I think you've hit the nail on the head.

There is a good chance it would be unprofitable for VA to carry a passenger for the mistake fare price, given the various taxes levied along the way; it wouldn't be a massive surprise if the bookings had been annotated to ensure lower than usual "hidden" flexibility.

Sadly, in this case, this is VA 1, JohnK 0.

 

[Austman]

Let's take you (JohnK) out of this picture for a second and let's say I had my 80 year old parents booked to wherever. I drop them off at MEL airport but get a call two hours later saying 'oh, your folks didn't have the right visa, but we carried them to SYD anyway at their undertaking, now they need to get home, how would you like to pay for that?'

I'd be asking the airline why they took my parents to SYD in the first place given the terms and conditions are clear that they can't board unless they have all the relevant visas.

I'm suggesting that Virgin in BNE could have made it 100% clear and only with the passenger's agreement and at the passenger's own risk, that they would carry the passenger to SYD but the passenger would then need to produce a valid ESTA before they would be allowed to board the SYD-LAX flight.

In other words, if the passenger wanted to take the chance, at their own risk and possible expense, the choice was up to the passenger.

Passengers often take similar risks - eg with LCC to LCC and separate ticket connections. Sometimes they get stranded.

Maybe it really was a case of "computer says no" or perhaps Virgin doesn't like to agree to the passenger taking the risk.

 

[blackcat20]

A couple of posts referred to the price he paid. How is that relevant to the service he received. If they didn't intend to honour the ticket, they should have cancelled them straight away.

It's relevant because VA offered to reaccommodate the OP with change fee and fare difference. When you only pay a few hundred for your ticket, the fare difference is huge (which is why the OP didnt want to pay it).
And as Serfty says above, the fare is possibly part of the reason VA weren't so keen to help out (though of course we can't know for sure).

 

[serfty]

...
And as Serfty says above, the fare is possibly part of the reason VA weren't so keen to help out (though of course we can't know for sure).

I can think of no other strong reason why they apparently decided not to try to assist a SG in this circumstance.

 

[nlagalle]

1/ Do you have data to back up your claim that most people don't check in at the airport?

come come David.. really? you think that most still check in at the airport for a domestic flight?? although i don't have the figure, i'm willing to bet more use online methods than rocking up.

2/ If the system doesn't allow things to be done - that is also a fail.

Why is it a fail if that is a design? because it didn't work in someones favour this time?

It's not as black and white as simply assessing what the frontline lowest rank employee is allowed to do.

As an example - most airlines have what's known as a "flat tire rule" - usually unpublished, but in many cases discretionary guidance is provided to supervisors.

people are just assuming because John didn't get on the flight the staff didn't look into options.. perhaps they did but couldn't make it work?

That's just one example of where things are not as clear cut as you make out.

Of course - JQ is an airline where the rules are applied hard and fast and to hell with customer service initiatives - being punitive to pax who fall outside the SOPs is a method of reinforcement.

See above...

So if that's the position you take - then you're supporting JohnK's view that VA behaves like a LCC.

seems to me that because they weren't able to get him on the flight they must be considered an LCC, without knowing what they actually did in the back room

You really seem to be missing the entire point that premium brand businesses go out of there way to assist customers. (Or at least leave them feeling like they've been assisted as best as possible).

Of course paying an LCC style mistake fare gives you a champagne taste on that beer budget doesn't it? Lets not forget this was a mistake fare.. we should not expect the ultra treatment if something goes pear shaped.. heck I lost out on a mistake fare, but i wore it as that's the luck of the draw.

 

[JohnK]

I think you've hit the nail on the head.

There is a good chance it would be unprofitable for VA to carry a passenger for the mistake fare price, given the various taxes levied along the way; it wouldn't be a massive surprise if the bookings had been annotated to ensure lower than usual "hidden" flexibility.

Sadly, in this case, this is VA 1, JohnK 0.

You are probably right and I suspect that's the main reason for the hurdle I faced with check-in. Is that good enough though? Most people here think that it's probably som nam na on my part. Perhaps they are right but a little hypocritical from a community that tries to exploit every offering to the maximum whether it be credit card signon bonuses, double SCs offers, any seat awards etc.

But I have a funny feeling that it's actually going to cost VA a lot more than the ~AUS375 I paid for the airfare. How? Very simple. I will try to hurt VA at every opportunity. VA Gold pretty much has anytime access to lounges with a guest that is flying? That may have changed.

I am not going to provide VA feedback on this issue and I sincerely hope that the same doesn't happen to anyone here in your travels. And if you have come into this thread gloating about my misfortune and telling me serves you right then don't you worry I sincerely hope much worse happens to you and I will he laughing with great satisfaction when that happens. Oh and if you are refused service in a First lounge or if the service in a first lounge is poor then I will make sure to post a serves you right message.

I stuffed up and VA were not interested in assisting. But no one here knows what I went through on Saturday morning or the next 2 days. No one here knows what I was going through before the trip or what I am going through now and I for one think I deserved a lot better from VA staff than what I received.

Thanks to all who offered helpful assistance and support. Time to move on....

 

[serfty]

... Time to move on.

... and with that this thread is closed.

 

[JohnK]

Re: BNE-SYD-LAX-BNE VA Y US$266 on Orbitz [gone]

Why what happened? I had visions of his first flight being delayed and then him missing the return leg? Did he have some problems with authorities questioning why he was returning so soon?

Apart from that it was grab your passport, and go. He flies all the time so obviously would have an ESTA already which I know can be an issue for some people.

These things happen. Everyone makes stupid mistakes. Some people lose a lot of money. Some people lose a limb. Some people die. Neither of those happened to me. If I was flying Qantas there'd be no story and this was confirmed with Qantas BNE domestic check-in staff. As the Virgin staff are clueless here we are. Lesson learnt.