Superannuation Discussion + market volatility

[Buzzard]

We got the Health Card last year after the government reduced the deeming rates. There was no assets test just an income one which included my Public Service pension plus deemed income from our bank accounts, super etc. But no worries about car values, chattels etc.

Only 18 months to go and the card is mine!

 

[VPS]

Only 18 months to go and the card is mine!

I'll beat you by a year

 

[Catweazle]

I do hope we are all reviewing our superannuation funds at least twice a year to ensure that progress is being made to achieve a satisfactorily funded long term retirement.
Often I hear of folks going to shelf stacking at supermarkets once they found the cost of living was higher than anticipated.

I wonder if my memoirs could be a New York Times #1 Bestseller?

 

[cove]

Ok the ATO has asked a slew of questions about our SMSF. It was easy to answer No to all potentially problematic issues. We don’t lend money to rellies and we don’t have our business assets entwined in our investments. We have stuck with listed stocks so that was easy.
NO best seller earnings , no royalties and nothing extraordinary. Just very glad we switched out of AMP and increased our fund towards the top end of the tax free zone by making pension withdrawals.
Have stopped unloading containers and have no plans to go shelf stacking.

 

[get me outta here]

Helping them buy property when they should otherwise have been off the books as is lots of fun.

The other expensive thing is children but I'm not counting my chickens that they will all be completely off the books

 

[CaptJCool]

The age pension figures dropped yesterday for September 2021.
down nearly 18,000..... hypothesising those 2021 20% returns plus housing valuations had an impact.
the assets test data suggests so

 

[rogerkambah]

The age pension figures dropped yesterday for September 2021.
down nearly 18,000..... hypothesising those 2021 20% returns plus housing valuations had an impact.
the assets test data suggests so

Well, that would be upsetting to those 18,000 persons.

I must be missing something, but how would housing valuations impact. I thought homes were not counted as assets?

 

[serfty]

Well, that would be upsetting to those 18,000 persons.

I must be missing something, but how would housing valuations impact. I thought homes were not counted as assets?

A pensioner's home is not counted as an asset when calculating pension or payment, but it's valuation can affect how a pension or payment is assessed (in relation to the assets test).

How owning a home can affect pensions and payments | Department of Veterans' Affairs

Learn how owning your own home will impact the amount we pay you

www.dva.gov.au

 

[rogerkambah]

A pensioner's home is not counted as an asset when calculating pension or payment, but it's valuation can affect how a pension or payment is assessed (in relation to the assets test).

How owning a home can affect pensions and payments | Department of Veterans' Affairs

Learn how owning your own home will impact the amount we pay you

www.dva.gov.au

Yes, I had previously looked at that page but realised it relates to veterans' pensions through DVA rather than aged pensions, which the OP had posted the figures for.

Found the reference now in services Australia.

Asset types - Services Australia

Assets are property or items you or your partner own in full or part, or have an interest in. They can affect your payment.

www.servicesaustralia.gov.au

Principal home and up to 2 hectares of land are exempt, so I don't think housing valuations would impact unless its property that is rented out, or a holiday home.

NFA required

 

[odysseus]

The age pension figures dropped yesterday for September 2021.
down nearly 18,000..... hypothesising those 2021 20% returns plus housing valuations had an impact.
the assets test data suggests so

View attachment 266192
View attachment 266193

Or it's just regular noise.

Per the historical Change TTY figures, it's the lowest annual change in the series, and a number of other years have also had decreases. So doesn't stand out as significant relative to any other year.

 

[andye]

Well, that would be upsetting to those 18,000 persons.

Possibly but its kind of like moving into a higher tax bracket. Having said that, concession card eligibility may make some at borderline worse off overall

 

[CaptJCool]

Possibly but its kind of like moving into a higher tax bracket. Having said that, concession card eligibility may make some at borderline worse off overall

Yea
the earlier years 17 & 18 year reduction were direct result of Law changes. (Reduction of exempt defined benefit income from 50% to 10% and then the Tapering rate change from $3 to $1.50)

this one period reduction is not about the impact of law changes because there haven’t been any....

so this was my hypothesis.
Financial conditions on second / third property valuations (inheritance in sydney) and/or higher income as result of earning rates 20/21 (noting investment deeming rate also reduced to keep people on age pension). And yes the pensioner concession card would be lost (but eligibility for Comm seniors health care card would probably remain because it’s based only on taxable income as tax-free super isn’t counted For it)

the other observation is the inflow of new claimants turning 66.5/67 is likely to be affected by the strengthening impact of superannuation thus reducing the number signing up BECAUSE 60% - 70% plus of an increasingly larger cohort don’t meet the income threshold (inflow drops while outflow as result of death remains around 140,000 per annum). the IGR observes this as 85% of 85yo qualify but only 30-40% of the new cohort...

also, financial circumstances do change so some become eligible ‘down the track‘ in their mid/late 70s

also, depending on which of a couple had a defined benefits income stream (one or both) can see the surviving spouse lose eligibility based on the different thresholds for singles and couples...

 

[cove]

Finally no more ATO questions about our SMSF which just invests in ASX stocks. It is quite distracting. We still use E Superfund to do the accounting and audit and they have done a good job organizing the accounting and audit for our 2 person fund.

 

[tgh]

Aahh Cove , you must be a really big fish to attract the enforcers… they can smell money a mile off..
I have never had a single question .. little fish syndrome I guess… long may it continue..

 

[cove]

Well @tgh that inquisition is now over. Others will get their turn.

 

[cove]

@tgf those ATO sniffers must have mistaken the pool chlorine smell for money….I go there to keep that red stuff running around….

 

[QF WP]

APRA fails its super performance test. One of the most challenging problems plaguing superannuation choice is how to evaluate historical performance outcomes against a fund’s stated objectives, which has been cast into relief by the regulator’s inaugural return test for 80 MySuper products.... APRA fails its super performance test

Wholeheartedly agree - APRA falied to understand one of the major tenets of investing - risk versus return (as well as members best interests). I'll bet none of them are invested in Mysuper options in their own supre fund..

 

[CaptJCool]

Your super could be taxed up to 32 per cent when you die — here's how to avoid it

It's not called a 'death tax', but millions of Australians' retirement savings may be taxable upon death, writes Nassim Khadem.

www.abc.net.au

Withdrawing your super and paying tax

Information for individuals about withdrawing and paying tax on their superannuation.

www.ato.gov.au

 

[cove]

Just read that about 45% of Americans think that it would take a miracle to retire and live comfortably. With the inflation outbreak the numbers are jumping dramatically.

 

[Brissy1]

Your super could be taxed up to 32 per cent when you die — here's how to avoid it

It's not called a 'death tax', but millions of Australians' retirement savings may be taxable upon death, writes Nassim Khadem.

www.abc.net.au

Withdrawing your super and paying tax

Information for individuals about withdrawing and paying tax on their superannuation.

www.ato.gov.au

So super you leave (nominate) to your spouse or children, and if you wish to leave some to others, do that from other assets. To my cats: the home, other houses, and share portfolio