[rumour] US to join oneworld as an affiliate before full AA merger

[burmans]

Re: US Dividend Miles - post your SUCCESSFUL award bookings here.

why be suspicious? what does it matter? current thinking is, as serfty posted, the last day for redemption is 31 October. and if turns out to be wrong or delayed, so what? what's lost?

Would have thought they "why does it matter" part was obvious. The whole reason we and people on FT are discussing this is because it affects their behaviour in terms of redemptions post October 31. So as to the "so what" or "what's lost" question, it would appear that feeling forced to make a decision and book by 31 October may make people make different decisions than they would make if they felt the change would take next year (or indeed some may hold off to use on AA 1st November and possibly discover its not possible).

I'm not trying to knock serty's post incidentally but I've seen the post that started all this too and (as serty acknowledges) it seems to refect one view of what will happen but has after reasonable some time yet to be confirmed. So I for one wouln't be reading it as gospel until I see it confirmed.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Re: US Dividend Miles - post your SUCCESSFUL award bookings here.

Would have thought they "why does it matter" part was obvious. The whole reason we and people on FT are discussing this is because it affects their behaviour in terms of redemptions post October 31. So as to the "so what" or "what's lost" question, it would appear that feeling forced to make a decision and book by 31 October may make people make different decisions than they would make if they felt the change would take next year (or indeed some may hold off to use on AA 1st November and possibly discover its not possible).

I'm not trying to knock serty's post incidentally but I've seen the post that started all this too and (as serty acknowledges) it seems to refect one view of what will happen but has after reasonable some time yet to be confirmed. So I for one wouln't be reading it as gospel until I see it confirmed.

the MOST that anyone can lose is $150 for a cancellation or change. there is absolutely nothing else to be lost (and of course the benefit of booking as soon as possible gives max availability, and avoids trying to call the USDM call centre in the dying days along with everyone else).

we're paying a few dollars to travel first class around the world, I would argue that far outweighs any 'stress' at being forced into an early decision

 

[serfty]

Re: US Dividend Miles - post your SUCCESSFUL award bookings here.

Maybe I'm cynical but I personally think getting all of those three outstanding approvals in a month is ambitous. I'm also a bit suspicious about the suggestion that a day after legal merger close they will have integration to be able to credit to an AA F number. That's a lot of IT work to have done on a deal not yet approved and frankly am not sure you could test it (would sending real live customer details accross to AA to test this out even be allowed for a deal that has not been approved by the court, its surely a breach of privacy to share my data with AA in the absence of an approved merger)?.

The point I was mainly making is that it is quite likely that USair will operate as a *O carrier prior to the merger being fully consummated (including that of FF systems) and this is likely to occur before 2014.

That is much less than 22 months and given executives have cited such, the end of 2013 will almost certainly see this.

 

[anat0l]

Re: US Dividend Miles - post your SUCCESSFUL award bookings here.

Does anyone know if US DM get a bit tight when it comes to North American stopovers?

Example: South Pacific (Australia) to North America redemption. Destination Havana, en route stopover in Vancouver. Any problems with that?

What about North American transits? I know that AA has a rule that a transit is considered to be anything < 24 hours outside North America but inside North America it's < 4 hours.

Depending on the MPM for Australia to Havana, I suppose the only thing that may be an impediment is TPAC availability and/or the MPM (if routing via Asia)...

 

[legroom]

USDM Bonus Miles

Hi

What's the worst case scenario to the USDM with the merger ?

We are sort of expecting 1:1 conversion but has there been any clue (or precedents) showing that it may be less favourable ?

Stay with AA or "stock up" with USDM ???

Thanks

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Re: USDM Bonus Miles

Hi

What's the worst case scenario to the USDM with the merger ?

We are sort of expecting 1:1 conversion but has there been any clue (or precedents) showing that it may be less favourable ?

Stay with AA or "stock up" with USDM ???

Thanks

there is no speculation... the conversion will be 1:1. those in charge if the merger are in the record as confirming the 1:1.

buying miles through USDM is a cheap way to get AA miles (which has an annual purchase cap of 60k miles).

the 'worst case' scenario is that USDM now follows AA award routing rules... that is (basically) that an award can only be issued if there is an existing published revenue fare for a particular route. so basic itineraries via qf or cx (etc) are possible (including connections). 'pushing the envelope' itineraries will be out.

 

[burmans]

Re: USDM Bonus Miles

Hi

What's the worst case scenario to the USDM with the merger ?

We are sort of expecting 1:1 conversion but has there been any clue (or precedents) showing that it may be less favourable ?

Stay with AA or "stock up" with USDM ???

Thanks

Someone previously provided a link of supporting evidence for 1:1 but am unsure where this is.

Some possible downside
1. While (reportedly) US will joing Oneworld from 1st November this is not very clear to date (i.e. its one largely unsubstantiated rumour). It is possible you may end up with points in US but not convereted for some time which you have limited ability to use on *A nor on AA as they haven't yet been migrated over. Ability to accumulated and redeem on *A from 1st November does not mean the same as US points become AA on that date.
2. Tickets redeemed for *A flights after conversion date where something goes wrong, *A airlines not likely to be sympathetic to solve.
3. Most current assumptions are we get some combo of existing US/AA conditions but a 3rd possibility has been raised of a revenue-based program. Potentially this could lead to e(existing) points devaluation.

Having said this I'm not actualy of the opinion that the transition will be this bad, more that the lack of clarity causes speculation.

On your last question, there is a third option which is do both and this is where I'm probably most aligned to.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Re: USDM Bonus Miles

Someone previously provided a link of supporting evidence for 1:1 but am unsure where this is.

Some possible downside
1. While (reportedly) US will joing Oneworld from 1st November this is not very clear to date (i.e. its one largely unsubstantiated rumour). It is possible you may end up with points in US but not convereted for some time which you have limited ability to use on *A nor on AA as they haven't yet been migrated over. Ability to accumulated and redeem on *A from 1st November does not mean the same as US points become AA on that date.
2. Tickets redeemed for *A flights after conversion date where something goes wrong, *A airlines not likely to be sympathetic to solve.
3. Most current assumptions are we get some combo of existing US/AA conditions but a 3rd possibility has been raised of a revenue-based program. Potentially this could lead to e(existing) points devaluation.

Having said this I'm not actualy of the opinion that the transition will be this bad, more that the lack of clarity causes speculation.

On your last question, there is a third option which is do both and this is where I'm probably most aligned to.

the link has been posted many times

as for point 2... if it is a schedule change it can be revalidated. if it is a cancellation it might become a bit more tricky if the operating carrier doesn't have multiple flights in a route.

for point 3... indeed speculation continues. I don't see however why delta would be seen as the industry leader... the new AA will need to compete with UA. UA has similar mileage levels as the current AA/USDM.

revenue based system? not sure how that will affect award redemptions. I can't see it will except that bonus miles based on status will be harder to come by (but awards cost the same).

hopefully more airlines will progress to a revenue based system. lounges are too full as it is and benefits are being eroded (in the case of qantas). while slightly OT... when as a first class ticket holder in the sydney lounge I'm told to 'go and get a menu yourself' and 'you need to go to the restaurant to place an order' then it's time to get rid of cheap status holders.

 

[legroom]

Re: USDM Bonus Miles

On your last question, there is a third option which is do both and this is where I'm probably most aligned to.

I share your inclination but wished to engage in some group-think first - just in case I had missed some twists somewhere.

 

[smit0847]

Re: USDM Bonus Miles

I think the best way to 'prepare' yourself for the merger is to try and set some long term travel goals/plans. Any travel for the next 12-18 months for me is either booked (I have just completed my first USDM trip, and have another 3 USDM/LM trips booked for the next 9 months), or I will be booking as soon as the flights come online to try and avoid the 'grey period' of changeover where we don't know what will be happening (which I predict will be the first half of 2014).

Ideally I would be stocking up on USDM points for the long-term goal of eventually using them for OW flights, probably in 2015 onwards. It's smart to get them now as USDM and wait for them to convert because there are far more restrictions on purchasing AA miles than there are on purchasing USDM. Unfortunately the only travel I have planned for 2015 is a US trip which I will use VA points. I certainly look forward to eventually booking OW redemptions through AA, as I particularly want to try CX J and F, however I just don't have the courage or spare $$ lying around to stock up on miles now that I have no intention of using for at least 18 months.

If you really want to stay with *A carriers, even plan trips for the next 11-12 months you can book now, or else invest in AV LM and/or hope another *A FF programs becomes like USDM.

 

[burmans]

Re: USDM Bonus Miles

or point 3... indeed speculation continues. I don't see however why delta would be seen as the industry leader... the new AA will need to compete with UA. UA has similar mileage levels as the current AA/USDM.

revenue based system? not sure how that will affect award redemptions. I can't see it will except that bonus miles based on status will be harder to come by (but awards cost the same).

hopefully more airlines will progress to a revenue based system. lounges are too full as it is and benefits are being eroded (in the case of qantas). while slightly OT... when as a first class ticket holder in the sydney lounge I'm told to 'go and get a menu yourself' and 'you need to go to the restaurant to place an order' then it's time to get rid of cheap status holders.

Yes, I was probably wrong to wrap up revenue based with changes to the program. I guess my point was that we don't really know much about the combined program and it doesn't necessarily match either of the existing programs. I guess the main options are

1. The best of the two programs
2. The worst of the programs
3. Some other combination (some good/some bad)
4. Something totally different - and here I'm just reflect what seems to be the common view that "enhancements" don't seem to often benefit the actual frequent flyers.

Personally while I see "enhancements" down the track during the honeymoon period of a merger there is usually a desire to keep your customers so am thinking things will be fairly benign, it certainly did not put me off buying some US miles speculatively last month (with as yet no definite purpose). To me there are some who are wildly optimistic about the (outcomes of the) merger, some wildly pessimistic and as usual the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

 

[Rallo]

Although the sweep will be 1.1 any thoughts that there will be a cap on points?

 

[Danger]

Although the sweep will be 1.1 any thoughts that there will be a cap on points?

I don't think that would conceivably possible. The US Air FF program will become defunct. All hell would break loose if US said 'We're moving house, but you can only take two boxes of belongings tops'.

 

[burmans]

I don't think that would conceivably possible. The US Air FF program will become defunct. All hell would break loose if US said 'We're moving house, but you can only take two boxes of belongings tops'.

As I noted somewhere else I don't think they will be wanting to scare too many customers during the honeymoon phase and this would be a great way to piss off some of your best customers.

 

[TheEmu]

Thought it might add a bit of color without too much labor .

Thought you may be trying to scandalize by playing favorites.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

US Air now have an IATCI agreement with QF so for an itinerary like SYD QF LAX US PHL you would get both boarding passes in SYD.

However this is only if all flights are booked in the same pnr. If separate pnrs, both airlines still have to be members of the OneWorld Alliance which US Air are not - yet.

 

[smit0847]

DOJ: November trial date in US Airways-American Airlines antitrust case would rush things, so let

If the merger goes ahead at all it may be delayed until at least March next year.

 

[bismarck]

US/AA and DOJ potentially in settlement talks around key divestitures which may allow the merger to proceed unimpeded.

U.S. seeking divestitures from American, US Airways - source | Reuters

 

[serfty]

US/AA and DOJ potentially in settlement talks around key divestitures which may allow the merger to proceed unimpeded.

U.S. seeking divestitures from American, US Airways - source | Reuters

I am thinking it's likely going to take more that slot divestitures to appease the DoJ.

 

[serfty]

I am thinking it's likely going to take more that slot divestitures to appease the DoJ.

Look like I was incorrect.:-|

I guess the divestiture of 138 (104 at slots at Washington Reagan National Airport and 34 at LaGuardia Airport in New York) as well as a yet to be determined (12+) number of gates and some related facilities was deemed sufficient.