Rubbish article: Health Authorities Apparently Lied About Wearing Masks. [Incorrect]

[tgh]

Science tends to opine that the virus airborne is likely /mostly hitchhiking on something.. like an aerosol from a cough or a sneeze.
N95 masks work well in such an environment.. as long as they are correctly used.
Surgical masks only stop direct hits or fluid splatter..they fail with aerosols because they have lots of open spaces for the aerosols to be drawn in.
The relatively high infection rate of medical workers may be eventually pinned to surgical masks.
As it spins out , infection paths seem more likely from surfaces than aerosols adding weight to the no mask arguments.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

The Slate article says,
"In other words, one company’s mask, if properly fitted, might filter out 92 percent of coronaviruses, while another might catch only 50 percent. "

In a low virus density environment, that's pretty good protection compared to nothing.
Regards,
Renato

Not exactly - that was highlighting the disparity between the effectiveness of masks.

The text you are overlooking is at the end of the article:

To efficiently protect yourself from coronaviruses, you would need to wear a full-faced mask with a high-efficiency particle air filter. But such HEPA filter masks cause what Grinshpun calls “quite a discomfort” in short order.​

​

​

 

[pauly7]

Thank you very much AFF moderators for proactively classing this as rubbish, incorrect and to be taken with a pinch of salt. I probably would have said a bucket of salt but you know

This thread comes close second in terms of quality to the ‘AFF members are going to die’ thread in my books, but at least not as fatalistic!

This ‘debate’ has already been put to bed many times in the other thread.

Doesn’t need to be repeated.

If people feel happy about having a mask that could have been better utilised by a healthcare professional then I hope it’s worth it

 

[RooFlyer]

If people feel happy about having a mask that could have been better utilised by a healthcare professional then I hope it’s worth it

I don't know who that comment is directed to. I'm not aware that anyone here has said or intimated they are "happy" to have a mask that could be used by a health professional. Perhaps you can point the finger? Or just stirring the pot?

For my own part, I have said above that I got my masks at Bunnings in late January. Also that health professionals are welcome to have my unused supply (but I doubt they would be wanted). The masks I have used - apparently to the exclusion of a healthcare professional, by your logic - was when I was returning home from overseas (Paris), possibly a carrier. I hope that was OK by you and the indignant others on this thread.

 

[theblank]

And if you do - please pass it on to Health Authorities and tell them to stop buying masks.

I already told you why Health professionals need to wear masks. They understand this too.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

And if you do - please pass it on to Health Authorities and tell them to stop buying masks.
Regards,
Renato

You should be ashamed of your posts. They are to be blunt a disgrace.

There are many reasons why health workers need BETTER than the general public and also why the general public does not need a to wear a N95 mask if they are out and about.

Just one is if like my daughter you are a nurse treating CV 19 patients, and she is, the various invasive processes such as intubation can cause true aerosol transmission of CV 19. Especially as they have to touch the person and may have extended contact. This is why it is so high risk for our medical workers.

So unless on your shopping trips you are shoving tubes down your fellow shoppers throats you are not at risk compared to if you just had of maintained your distance. And your mask will not help you prevent how Joe-public is catching Covid 19.

The consensus of medical advice at present is that for the-public that transmission by droplets on objects which are then touched and brought to the mouth or nose is the main transmission path.

As to buying masks on ebay etc at inflated prices it is known that the sources of these is often not appropriate. ie they have been stolen and so yes you are denying masks going to where they should be and if not to Australian Medical Workers then to a medical worker in another country. Your posts are disrespectful to the medical workers around the world putting themselves in true harms way where the common theme is a shortage of all manner of medical supplies from PPE to ventilators.

 

[esseeeayeenn]

I don't want to leap into the bubbling cauldron of controversy about the effectiveness of masks.
However I do think it is important that health advice is given without any trace of spin whatsoever.
There is a legitimate argument that priority should be given to health workers as there is a limited supply of masks.
The argument should be put clearly in those terms. And no others.
When you give even slightly misleading advice, even with the best of intentions, you risk losing your authority.
That would have catastrophic consequences for all of us.
Although right now the topic of our government's authority is more of a cesspit than a cauldron ...

 

[tgh]

Lto… with respect…

This afternoon I had a look about for N95/P2 respirators.
I found a number of Industrial suppliers offering them in bulk packs for immediate delivery.
There is some other problem.. but it is not availability (in small lots at least)
Shooting the messengers may be therapeutic.. but ultimately it is likely counterproductive

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Lto… with respect…

This afternoon I had a look about for N95/P2 respirators.
I found a number of Industrial suppliers offering them in bulk packs for immediate delivery.
There is some other problem.. but it is not availability (in small lots at least)
Shooting the messengers may be therapeutic.. but ultimately it is likely counterproductive

I have not looked, but I would not be surprised if some people/businesses are seeking to profiteer by selling masks at inflated prices.

Even n the USA, 3M had to take Target to task over the inappropriate selling of 3M masks.

 

[tgh]

So it is cost that is putting the front line troops at risk.. not supply ?

 

[kyle]

So it is cost that is putting the front line troops at risk.. not supply ?

Don't think it's supply as there's plenty to send over from HK.

Returning the favour: Hongkongers send masks to friends and family overseas

As panic over coronavirus pandemic spreads, shelves around the world are being emptied of protective gear, while in Hong Kong the shortage has eased as local production ramps up.

www.scmp.com

 

[lovetravellingoz]

So it is cost that is putting the front line troops at risk.. not supply ?

So your argument is that the hospitals should willing pay more so that overall they can do less? Plus consider the volumes that are required.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Don't think it's supply as there's plenty to send over from HK.

Look yes more masks will hopefully be manufactured, and our various authorities have stated that they are now sourcing more of them and that more are own the way. Yes hopefully the Chinese factories will soon be roaring.

But right here and now if you know some health workers please have a chat. Many do not yet have adequate stocks.

 

[RooFlyer]

But right here and now if you know some health workers please have a chat. Many do not yet have adequate stocks.

I'll call my GP's surgery tomorrow and offer my spare masks and post the reply here.

 

[RooFlyer]

When you give even slightly misleading advice, even with the best of intentions, you risk losing your authority.
That would have catastrophic consequences for all of us.

I'm not disputing the gist of your argument, but "misleading" according to whom, is an issue. Just about every decision or policy in this thing is contestable with undoubted experts disagreeing, from close / don't close schools and so on.

If the policy makers listen and act on to those who end up being correct, then they are just doing their jobs. If their advice turns out not to be the best answer, then they are lethal criminals. The State leaders are getting advice from their experts which is sometimes at variance to the advice being given to the federal leaders. i don't think there is any way, when things are changing on such massive scales, daily, for anyone to know what the 'right' answers are - only in retrospect.

Even at the end of the health crisis, there will be finger pointing and blaming about the consequences of decisions made in the heat of the crisis.

Who'd be a politician?

 

[esseeeayeenn]

Masks become less effective and become breeding grounds the longer they are warn as they get damp from breathing.

This is relevant to bacteria, but not to viruses.
Viruses are not alive and cannot breed. They do not have all the genetic information they need to replicate.
They need to insert themselves into a host and force it to replicate them.
So they cannot breed in a mask.

 

[dajop]

This is relevant to bacteria, but not to viruses.
Viruses are not alive and cannot breed. They do not have all the genetic information they need to replicate.
They need to insert themselves into a host and force it to replicate them.
So they cannot breed in a mask.

Makes sense. But of course if there are some harmful bacteria around (which is almost certainly more relevant to medical contexts), you don't want that either. Would always want to minimise any sort of infection that could weaken the immune system, but especially right now.

 

[drron]

Though although viruses don't breed on a mask if you are wearing one all day it is very likely the numbers will increase when someone else coughs or sneezes near you.The surgical masks are for limited use E G seeing 1 patient then discarded.

 

[Renato1]

Thank you very much AFF moderators for proactively classing this as rubbish, incorrect and to be taken with a pinch of salt. I probably would have said a bucket of salt but you know

This thread comes close second in terms of quality to the ‘AFF members are going to die’ thread in my books, but at least not as fatalistic!

This ‘debate’ has already been put to bed many times in the other thread.

Doesn’t need to be repeated.

If people feel happy about having a mask that could have been better utilised by a healthcare professional then I hope it’s worth it

I see that you are a proponent of the ignorance is bliss philosophy of life.
Regards,
Renato

 

[Renato1]

You should be ashamed of your posts. They are to be blunt a disgrace.

There are many reasons why health workers need BETTER than the general public and also why the general public does not need a to wear a N95 mask if they are out and about.

Just one is if like my daughter you are a nurse treating CV 19 patients, and she is, the various invasive processes such as intubation can cause true aerosol transmission of CV 19. Especially as they have to touch the person and may have extended contact. This is why it is so high risk for our medical workers.

So unless on your shopping trips you are shoving tubes down your fellow shoppers throats you are not at risk compared to if you just had of maintained your distance. And your mask will not help you prevent how Joe-public is catching Covid 19.

The consensus of medical advice at present is that for the-public that transmission by droplets on objects which are then touched and brought to the mouth or nose is the main transmission path.

As to buying masks on ebay etc at inflated prices it is known that the sources of these is often not appropriate. ie they have been stolen and so yes you are denying masks going to where they should be and if not to Australian Medical Workers then to a medical worker in another country. Your posts are disrespectful to the medical workers around the world putting themselves in true harms way where the common theme is a shortage of all manner of medical supplies from PPE to ventilators.

I'm happy for you to put forward a reasoned discussion as to why my posting a Redditt piece from the NEW YORK TIMES is a disgrace.

May I suggest you contact the New York Times and tell them they are a disgrace, if you feel so strongly about it.
Regards,
Renato