RewardPay Alternatives

[B2Bpay.com.au]

Sure thing ..... but it won’t look that attractive at 2.4% (same with RP), any inside knowledge on a new fee structure to counter the Amex change?

By the way .... impressive that you’re doing a Q&A on a long weekend.

Thanks @amaroo all part of the service!
No fees changes to report - there’s certainly a lot of debate. Whatever happens, we’re confident that B2Bpay will continue to be the most rewarding way to pay bills with full card points and Qantas Points on top.

 

[travelnutjohn]

ok can someone clarify, Ive never used these type of services due to cost, and as im not a business consumer

is it correcto assume that the huge chunk of the customers of these types of services charging 2-3% + gst in fees, are those that have amex and get double points or similar and so to them its worth the fees paid? especially when paying billers that dont accept amex

if my assumltion above is correct, with the changes of amex program basically halving the value of these points,
wouldnt for all of these people its not going to be worth paying the 2-3% for halve the points, so essentially these sorts of companies are going to collapse post april 2019?

 

[Bell21]

TR, your assumptions are pretty well spot-on, except for I can't comment on the likely future of these companies post mid-April of course - I use RP extensively, but my intent is to stop the minute the clock strikes midnight on 15 April, unless they reconfigure their commercial proposition.

However, there are other providers out there (name escapes me currently, but I believe has already been referenced in this thread) that are MC and V-oriented and have considerably lower usage fees, which will become viable post April (and in fact, are viable now, except that currently, AMEX generates better points multiples)

 

[amaroo]

ok can someone clarify, Ive never used these type of services due to cost, and as im not a business consumer

is it correcto assume that the huge chunk of the customers of these types of services charging 2-3% + gst in fees, are those that have amex and get double points or similar and so to them its worth the fees paid? especially when paying billers that dont accept amex

if my assumltion above is correct, with the changes of amex program basically halving the value of these points,
wouldnt for all of these people its not going to be worth paying the 2-3% for halve the points, so essentially these sorts of companies are going to collapse post april 2019?

Correct.... IMHO.

I started using RP last Aug and have/will have pumped around $2m through (4m Ascent Premium points) by the time of the deadline.

I will most certainly cease using RP a week before the deadline unless they put out a substantially reduced offer.

 

[Bell21]

That's an impressive number of AMEX points to generate in 8 or so months! I'm very interested to see how RP and similar providers respond to the mid-April devaluation - it probably depends on what other revenue streams they have, although I don't know many companies that are happy to just willingly lose business...

 

[mrtupperware]

ok can someone clarify, Ive never used these type of services due to cost, and as im not a business consumer

is it correcto assume that the huge chunk of the customers of these types of services charging 2-3% + gst in fees, are those that have amex and get double points or similar and so to them its worth the fees paid? especially when paying billers that dont accept amex

if my assumltion above is correct, with the changes of amex program basically halving the value of these points,
wouldnt for all of these people its not going to be worth paying the 2-3% for halve the points, so essentially these sorts of companies are going to collapse post april 2019?

Correct. With the right card combo, knowing how to redeem points and the fee they currently charge it makes a good proposition.

My "cost per point" post 15 April is going to halve, with the devaluation across a few airlines, and amex already saying they are charging less fees, these platforms (RP, B2B and PL) need to basically halve or more their fees otherwise there won't be any reason to use them.

I'm a medium - heavy RP user (about $1.5m of payments so far), and planning on dropping it post April unless their fees will change

 

[Saltywings]

Ferni's method is significantly superior with respect to surcharge - I've probably saved over 30k from the difference alone. Will pump through another 1.2-1.4m or so prior to April 15 and I guess it's time to smash the dragon going forward (unless better rates can be negotiated).

Hitting myself only getting into the points game in earnest in late 2016...all those years of paying the needful...without points earn *shock horror*

 

[Bell21]

Hmm, well for me, it's only since late 2017, but I'm taking a glass half-full perspective - at least, I had 12+ months before the upcoming devaluation!

Sorry, what is ferni's method?

 

[Saltywings]

Hmm, well for me, it's only since late 2017, but I'm taking a glass half-full perspective - at least, I had 12+ months before the upcoming devaluation!

Sorry, what is ferni's method?

Have a gander at the ATO thread - it's the talk of the last 5 pages.

 

[mrtupperware]

Ferni's method is significantly superior with respect to surcharge - I've probably saved over 30k from the difference alone. Will pump through another 1.2-1.4m or so prior to April 15 and I guess it's time to smash the dragon going forward (unless better rates can be negotiated).

Hitting myself only getting into the points game in earnest in late 2016...all those years of paying the needful...without points earn *shock horror*

@Saltywings what's "ferni's method"?

 

[Saltywings]

@Saltywings what's "ferni's method"?

See above.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

That's an impressive number of AMEX points to generate in 8 or so months! I'm very interested to see how RP and similar providers respond to the mid-April devaluation - it probably depends on what other revenue streams they have, although I don't know many companies that are happy to just willingly lose business...

Though history is littered with companies/ services/ products being made redundant. Popped into a Blockbuster Video Store of late?

If Amex does not reduce their fees by about half then the numbers just do not stack up. Now for RP etc it is disastrous, but with Amex keeping their fees high is obviously beneficial to them.

 

[albyd]

I'm thinking Amex's changes may well be to reflect the cuts they've had to implement thus far so another round of cuts by Amex may lead to a further cut in the rewards program to compensate for the reduced amount of funding available for points. In which case, it might not be possible to cut fees to RP, et al. I hope I'm wrong as these 'Payment Facilitators' will have been a huge area of growth for Amex.

 

[kpc]

I had lunch with a famous AFFer last Sunday....the restaurant charged 1.5% to use any credit card so i paid with my Amex Explorer as I earnt 2 points per $....I wouldn't be so happy paying 1.5% surcharge with my Amex when i will only be earning 1 point per $!! Generally, at this stage, i've not noticed any lowering of the higher surcharges charged for using an Amex!....so my Dragon may be smashed more moving forwards....but unfortunately I don't have a very high credit limit on this card!!

 

[Saltywings]

I had lunch with a famous AFFer last Sunday....the restaurant charged 1.5% to use any credit card so i paid with my Amex Explorer as I earnt 2 points per $....I wouldn't be so happy paying 1.5% surcharge with my Amex when i will only be earning 1 point per $!! Generally, at this stage, i've not noticed any lowering of the higher surcharges charged for using an Amex!....so my Dragon may be smashed more moving forwards....but unfortunately I don't have a very high credit limit on this card!!

You and me both. Hence I have my wildly aspirational theory that they may, over time in the medium term reduce surcharges to more acceptable levels. Otherwise they'll be hit by a pretty big reduction in Amex usage - unless they're banking on the masses that don't care about points either way and would tap tap tap regardless of earn.

 

[Bell21]

Have a gander at the ATO thread - it's the talk of the last 5 pages.

Thanks very much!

 

[Bell21]

Though history is littered with companies/ services/ products being made redundant. Popped into a Blockbuster Video Store of late?

If Amex does not reduce their fees by about half then the numbers just do not stack up. Now for RP etc it is disastrous, but with Amex keeping their fees high is obviously beneficial to them.

The RP situation is a bit different though to Blockbuster etc - at a given time, a whole lot of customers who use RP to generate points are very likely to simply stop using RP simultaneously - most companies would find that unpalatable, esp. if predicted in advance, but RP probably has either alternative strategies, alternative revenue streams, or possibly they can weather the loss etc - it will be interesting to see what they do, if anything

Agree re the numbers not stacking up.

 

[albyd]

It’s possible that there is a cohort of customers who don’t care as much about the rewards points but the ability to use their Amex line of credit to be able to pay as many suppliers as possible and see the cost as a cost of doing business.

There will be a significant amount of volume which is associated with points accumulation at the ‘right price’ which will no longer be viable.

So not 100% but will hurt them.

 

[Bell21]

That sounds about right.

 

[tlam]

Ferni's method is significantly superior with respect to surcharge - I've probably saved over 30k from the difference alone. Will pump through another 1.2-1.4m or so prior to April 15 and I guess it's time to smash the dragon going forward (unless better rates can be negotiated).

Hitting myself only getting into the points game in earnest in late 2016...all those years of paying the needful...without points earn *shock horror*

I am one of the first asking ferni to pm me the method but never got a response. If you know, could you please pm me? Thanks