P1 Fail

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I've been following this with interest and tend to agree with different points from - what has turned into - various entrenched directions; or at least can sympathize with them.

However - whatever one's point of view (or even whether as a non-P1 I'm not allowed one!,) - isn't the one fundamental issue here that there is an unhappy P1: ergo a P1 Team fail?

Regards,

BD
 
Of course this is a case of DYKWIA....he is a top tier WP1 and should be treated as such. In the small world of QF he is top of the status food chain - so much so that QF added WP1 to recognise the status above regular WP flyers so that they could go the extra mile and provide amazing service and benefits (as the marketing would have you believe).

Actually he's not the top of the status food chain. Your CL P1 is top of the passenger tree. I wonder where company officers come in the pecking order also, plus other random VVIP's of an unusual nature (such as Oprah etc).

How dare a WP1 pipe up and state he is unhappy about something regarding QF handling of his issue - tall poppy eh? Why so much fuss? Put up with it!

I haven't read anyone having an issue with the OP making his unhappiness known - both with QF and here. Sure, people can question the "validity"(for want of a better word) of the cause for complaint-that's a whole other matter - but I think nobody has an issue with this being brought to the attention of people. At least I don't have an issue.

Red Roo posted that the SST will follow up with the OP. Now since he is (I presume) in the USA right now maybe that has not happened yet, or maybe it has, but that's between him and QF. I am not sure what they can do to make one happy after the horse has bolted (so to speak) but clearly QF recognises they have upset an important customer and will do their best to make it right. At the very least you can be *SURE* his QF profile is adorned with "NO 747 Y SEAT EVER!" or words to that effect :)
 
I haven't read anyone having an issue with the OP making his unhappiness known - both with QF and here. Sure, people can question the "validity"(for want of a better word) of the cause for complaint-that's a whole other matter - but I think nobody has an issue with this being brought to the attention of people. At least I don't have an issue.

No I don't think anyone has an issue. The whole point of AFF is so discussions like this can be hashed out on all sides.

It's just that some people get a bit sooky when they are disagreed with...
 
Know what you're talking about before making definitive statements.

I find this comment somewhat offensive.

The only "definitive" statement I made was "QF do not." in reference to the avertising of the 380 service specifically. In relation to the earlier screen shot of the flights. Nowhere on that schedule page does it "advertise" 380 service. Yes, you mention that QF has an A380 page dedicated to the aircraft, product and schedule. I just went looking for it trying to find the obvious place it may be advertised. Home page? nope... I tried "Fly" and then "Onboard"? nope. I tried "Fly" and then "Seat Maps" nope.. in the end I gave up and did a search and found it
Qantas A380 | Schedule | Features | Qantas

yes, it's under "About Qantas" "Our Company" and "Our Fleet" - not exactly hilighted.. but I digress as a very minor point.

Yes, this page does indeed list the schedules:

[h=2]How do I book the Qantas A380?[/h] Get the overview of where we fly our A380s or view more detailed flight information on our timetables. Note that all flights are subject to last minute change of aircraft.

BetweenFlight No.Status
Sydney < > Dubai < > LondonQF1 / QF2All Flights
Melbourne < > Dubai < > LondonQF9 / QF10All Flights
Sydney < > Los AngelesQF11 / QF12All Flights
Melbourne < > Los AngelesQF93 / QF94All Flights
Sydney < > Dallas/Fort WorthQF7 / QF8All Flights
Sydney < > Hong Kong
QF127 / QF128On selected flights, during peak seasons

All of this though is only relevant (in my opinion, NOT a definite statement :p ) in respect of why you booked the A380 on that particular flight. AS QF itself notes (and you have mentioned earlier in the thread) "Note that all flights are subject to last minute change of aircraft."

This is what you were victim of.
 
... "Note that all flights are subject to last minute change of aircraft."

This is what you were victim of.
Yes, a "victim of". However, being P1 they would expect a far more pro-active service in relation to being a "victim" than that which was actually received ...

... there is the P1 fail.
 
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I find this comment somewhat offensive.

The only "definitive" statement I made was "QF do not." in reference to the avertising of the 380 service specifically. In relation to the earlier screen shot of the flights. Nowhere on that schedule page does it "advertise" 380 service. Yes, you mention that QF has an A380 page dedicated to the aircraft, product and schedule. I just went looking for it trying to find the obvious place it may be advertised. Home page? nope... I tried "Fly" and then "Onboard"? nope. I tried "Fly" and then "Seat Maps" nope.. in the end I gave up and did a search and found it
Qantas A380 | Schedule | Features | Qantas

yes, it's under "About Qantas" "Our Company" and "Our Fleet" - not exactly hilighted.. but I digress as a very minor point.

Yes, this page does indeed list the schedules:



All of this though is only relevant (in my opinion, NOT a definite statement :p ) in respect of why you booked the A380 on that particular flight. AS QF itself notes (and you have mentioned earlier in the thread) "Note that all flights are subject to last minute change of aircraft."

This is what you were victim of.

Until the recent website upgrade it was prominently on the main drop-down menu under Fly (it had its own dedicated sub-heading - you didn't have to go looking for it).

They also had a picture banner ad/box on the rotating ad display that linked to it as well.

Granted - it appears to be less prominent now.

BUT - again, it is the only aircraft in the fleet with a specific page, specifically advertising it and its schedules, with a big heading of how to book the A380.

(And no - I wasn't a victim of QF exercising its T&C rights to substitute aircraft, it was the lack of provision of the advertised P1 service benefit).

But - agree with most of your other points.
 
it was the lack of provision of the advertised P1 service benefit

My understanding is that the promise reads "They will personally manage any flight changes or re-routes and provide support to help minimise any inconvenience.".

Your flight didn't change and it was not re-routed. It was a simple change of aircraft, something which happens all the time and is not one of the situations P1 promises to monitor for you.
 
Just to add a little perspective to this I would quite often receive a call from the P1 team to double check that my seat allocation was OK on the domestic 737 Y flight I was taking because my selection of 4A or 4F didn't match the aisle preference in my profile.

I think there is a little more to P1 than the publicly published benefits.
 
BUT - again, it is the only aircraft in the fleet with a specific page, specifically advertising it and its schedules, with a big heading of how to book the A380.

Unfortunately that is not quite correct - each of the Jet types in the fleet have a dedicated page, not just the 380. Each do differ in detail, but I would guess it is relatively new.

01440638680.jpeg

Qantas Fleet Information
 
My understanding is that the promise reads "They will personally manage any flight changes or re-routes and provide support to help minimise any inconvenience.".

Your flight didn't change and it was not re-routed. It was a simple change of aircraft, something which happens all the time and is not one of the situations P1 promises to monitor for you.

That's your opinion.

By your own admission you don't fly Y so are not familiar with whether there is a difference between the products.

That's kind of a pretty major point wouldn't you agree?

You are correct though - that they don't seem to be monitoring it. This thread wouldn't exist if they were ð
 
Just to add a little perspective to this I would quite often receive a call from the P1 team to double check that my seat allocation was OK on the domestic 737 Y flight I was taking because my selection of 4A or 4F didn't match the aisle preference in my profile.

I think there is a little more to P1 than the publicly published benefits.

That's great service. Now the question is, would you consider it to be a fail if P1 didn't call you when you were allocated a window?
 
OK after the last day or two of posts on this issue and trying to take the emotion out of it (because some of it, fair dinkum, has my eyes rolling - all 4 of them) I want to distill the FACTS as I understand them.

The contention that the 744 Y product is inferior to the A380 Y product is more an issue of that the OP had originally selected A380 upper deck BULKHEAD seat, which is a specific seat and I definitely agree that a bulkhead seat is somewhat different to a regular Y seat on any aircraft. Upper deck on the 380 vs lower on the 747.. yes Y is so much smaller on the 380 upstairs and that would be a much nicer experience for sure but in the eyes of most (not the OP perhaps) a bulkhead in Y on the 744 is probably pretty similar to a bulkhead in Y on the 380. Yes?

Seems to me the core of the issue (totally WITHOUT trying to speak for or on behalf of anyone else, but just as I read it) is:

- an aircraft sub meant the pax lost their preassigned bulkhead seat
- the pax noted the a/c change of his own accord before the P1 SST were made aware of it through internal processes
- the pax, at first, emailed the SST to enquire if all was OK with the flight. With the info they had to hand *at that time* they replied yes, still a 380.
- some time later, pax phoned SST noting the change and seat change. SST were still not aware, but once onto it helped the pax to make "the best of bad choices" to move to row 43. (and pax was later upgraded to Premium Economy)
- near as I can tell 43 on the (3 class) 744 is a bulkhead row too, but downstairs (my experience of QF 744 Y is very limited so I am reading the seat map)

now, from my reading of all the OP's posts on the thread I am not certain if he was offered a move to, for example, QF93 via MEL or another day, or if that schedule even worked for him, once he contacted the SST.

The "fail" here seems to be in 2 main places:

1. the late, unscheduled, aircraft sub was made and QF's internal processes did not work seemlessly and thus SST had no visibility of the sub until the pax himself informed them.
2. That the way it was handled post SST being informed was not acceptable to the pax, but he made do with the best of bad situation and flew the flight, with the helpful intevention of QF SYD F / lounge staff helping to resolve the issue with a courtesy upgrade.

As much as I read all the issues raised about if the SST should have known to call proactively that the pax would be upset with a sub of a/c, or that a block was put in, then taken away, then put in again (etc) and all that I submit that as an irrop all the normal "rules" tend to go out the door despite best intentions. For example, the seat block is a courtesy and not a definied entitlement. In a situation like this when the aircraft is subbed and pax are displaced and agents are looking for seats, then blocks will almost certainly go away under airport control. Or, with the SST not being proactive is because they seemingly didn't know about the issue until informed.

So the core here, for me (and I know, I am NOT the OP) is:

- bulkhead Y seat moved to normal Y seat is unacceptable (I agree)
- follow up once aware from SST to a P1 pax given there may have only been a small number on board was, apparently, poor (though it is unclear what may or may not have taken place behind the scenes).

I'm only making this post to try and clear through some of the extra stuff and try and distil the issues as best I can. I'm NOT trying to step on anyone's feet or offend anyone (most specially the OP!) and am happy to be corrected (politely, please).

I've been in a number of irrops situations on a number of different airlines. Some handle them quite well, others have been shocking, and I bet you some airlines, depending on the specific situation, can handle one really well and terribly at another time.

And yes, I've flown QF transpac quite a number of times, but luckily have not had an aircraft sub such as this affect me. touch wood :)

PERSONAL OPINION ONLY: If it were me in this situation I would *hope* for an equivalent seat to the one I had booked be available (eg: bulkhead for bulkhead, exit for exit). However I'd also understand the priority of the airline is to keep to the schedule and get as many pax booked on that flight there as soon as possible and sometimes Stuff happens. I'd also hope as a P1 that if possible an upgraded seat (be it, for example, bulkhead to exit row, or to a higher CoS) be made available, but I'd hardly expect it given the situation. I think flexibility and understanding in unusual and unplanned situations can go a long way - on both sides of the equation. My 2 cents only.
 
That's your opinion.

Which part of that is "my opinion"?

Your flight times did not change.
Your destination or routing did not change.
P1 do not promise to manage change of equipment situations to suit your own personal preferences.

None of these statements are merely opinion.
 
That's great service. Now the question is, would you consider it to be a fail if P1 didn't call you when you were allocated a window?

I select my own seats I would beat myself up over it, particularly if I had selected a middle seat for myself. I probably wouldn't talk to myself for a month If I had done that. :p

In the OP's case I would expect the P1 team to be all over seat selection if there was a change of aircraft like he experienced. I couldn't give a stuff whether it is a 747 or an A380 but would be less than happy if my carefully selected emergency exit or bulkhead seat had morphed into a middle seat near the back of the aircraft.
 
My understanding is that the promise reads "They will personally manage any flight changes or re-routes and provide support to help minimise any inconvenience.".

Your flight didn't change and it was not re-routed. It was a simple change of aircraft, something which happens all the time and is not one of the situations P1 promises to monitor for you.

The aircraft change means that the OPs seat creases to exist. I consider that to be a change and an inconvenience. Especially since he said that he picked that particular flight and day because a certain seat was available.
 
The aircraft change means that the OPs seat creases to exist. I consider that to be a change and an inconvenience. Especially since he said that he picked that particular flight and day because a certain seat was available.

And once they were aware that the sub had occured (yes, it had to be for dfcatch to inform them of this, which is a "fail") they then worked with him to find him a, as best I can tell, comparable seat on the flight he was booked on.
 
RichardMEL...

Great post. Good for anyone coming late to the thread.

Forgetting the minutiae, your summation is pretty good.

- easiest way I compare cabins to people when they ask me about 380 vs 747.... I simply explain that "the 380 has several seats (including most of the upstairs cabin) that are primo seats, that if you're in them, it makes flying Y over a 13-17 hr flight reasonably acceptable; whereas the 747 has none, with an exit row being probably the best option".

- core issue, I don't expect much from P1 (never got an invite to any special events for example), but i do expect them to perform their core advertised job - managing disruptions proactively.

Core point of contention - seems to me to be about whether an aircraft swap constitutes a disruption.

I'll be blunt and direct at this point - everyone is entitled to their opinion and to disagree or call me precious (just don't call me French).

BUT - if you're going to argue that "it's not a disruption", unless you fly Y TRANSPAC regularly, and have flown both 747 and 380 Y, then I consider your opinion to be an unqualified one.

If you want to debate what P1 should or shouldn't do - by all means.

But again - if you're not a P1, your opinion is an unqualified one.

I have opinions about CL matters, but as I'm not one, my opinion isn't qualified either.
 
Are you P1? Do you regularly fly TPAC? On QF?

No I'm not a WP1 in Y on QF TPAC. I'm the man on the Clapham omnibus.

P1 had no access to the new seat map, and couldn't do anything until such time......They offered to let me know as soon as the flight officially got changed to a 747

So if I've got this right, you informed the SST about the aircraft change, which wasn't even officially confirmed at that stage. Yet your complaint is that they hadn't proactively contacted you about something that hadn't officially happened yet and which they didn't know about?
 
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Which part of that is "my opinion"?

Your flight times did not change.
Your destination or routing did not change.
P1 do not promise to manage change of equipment situations to suit your own personal preferences.

None of these statements are merely opinion.

That you don't consider that specific aircraft swap to be a disruption - that's your opinion.

As I've evidenced - an A380 swap is not comparable to any other aircraft swap (eg. 330 to 737).
 
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