Newbie Question - Are points programs worth it?

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Nat the cat

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Jul 7, 2009
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Sorry if this has been covered off before, but I joined this forum hoping to get ... I don't know some really easy tips to get cheap flights and stuff :? I know that sounds silly, but I didn't really think that there would be so many acronymns and complexity to the schemes.So a simple question (I hope it is) : a) Are the point schemes worth it b) If they are what's the best oneSorry if I sound like a novice, but I am :)
 
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Simple answer - it depends on how much you travel and what you intend to get out of the programs. What are your travel patterns so far and what do you intend to do in the near future?


I was in a pretty similar situation to you when I first started lurking here - believe me, this is the place to find out how best to make use of these programs. But again, it depends entirely on what your particular plans are. :)
 
Simple answer - it depends on how much you travel and what you intend to get out of the programs. What are your travel patterns so far and what do you intend to do in the near future?


I was in a pretty similar situation to you when I first started lurking here - believe me, this is the place to find out how best to make use of these programs. But again, it depends entirely on what your particular plans are. :)

I travel about 4 times a year from Sydney to the goldie to see my Mom and maybe an OS trip every 2 years when I can afford it :)
 
Flying so little you need to consider other sources of points - such as credit cards. If you have big card spend then FF schemes work. If yiou have low card spend and low travel then buy the cheapest flights that fit your requirements.
 
Nat the cat,

The only person who can answer your question is you :!:

If you pick a program that's appropriate for you and you can earn enough points to be useful then the answer is yes. Many people stick with QF as they have the CC links fairly well tied up as well as being a local and 'trusted' brand.

DJ also have a good product but without as many CC's linked.

That being said you need something that suits you and is easy for you to use.
 
Thanks for all the replies :) I think something tied to credit cards makes sense as I can put utilities and the like on there. Will have a look around and see if I can get my head around it.
 
Thanks for all the replies :) I think something tied to credit cards makes sense as I can put utilities and the like on there. Will have a look around and see if I can get my head around it.
Nat the cat,

There is a lot of info on this forum about 'The Best Credit Card.'
 
Not sure of the details but the Woolworths card offers free QFF membership - look to minimise your annual fees.
It's not worth using your points for domestic travel as the market is so competitive.
(I hate Woolworths owning everything - support small business! - hope this doesn't breach the forum rules.)
 
In a word, yes, provided you fly frequently (as the name suggests).

Flying so little I'd suggest simply find the cheap flights and stick with them rather than get a FF card. The amount you'll save by not playing the game would be fairly high. (Because in a way it dictates what you do, I now hate flying on airlines where I don't earn QFF points, so I'll usually take the QF option even if it's not the cheapest)

Whilst yes you can get points with wollies (and other places) it's usually $1 = 1 point, considering that even a basic upgrade from discount Y (eccon) on the shortest sectors which they offer J (Business) costs 8000 points you'd need to spend $8000 before you could look at using an upgrade on a cheap flight.

Compare that to say a red-e-deal flight from say CBR - MEL which costs $89 and yet nets 1000 points (minimum points gurentee) using charge cards and earning points without flying can take quite some time and cost a lot of money.
 
I travel about 4 times a year from Sydney to the goldie to see my Mom and maybe an OS trip every 2 years when I can afford it :)

If you fly solely economy, then your existing flying pattern won't do much good for your points balance regardless of who your program is with.

If you fly 'cheap' business / first tickets, then a single overseas trip once every two years can be converted (if price is similar) to a multi-continent itinerary and you could get some decent points plus some elite status - and if you time it right, multiple years of that status.

We all know just because that someone is looking for "cheap flights" or "when they can afford it" doesn't necessarily mean its purely economy flights that they're after ;)

Otherwise, find ways on earning points alternatively, like credit cards etc.
 
To follow on from Alan, our recent DONE4 from Korea would have set us back about $6500pp plus as low as $1500ish for positioning flights, so say $8000pp.

That may seem like a lot straight up, but that alone would achieve the following:


  • A round the world business class trip (except for one or two economy class positioning flights) with up to 15 stopovers that can be split over a year, and a side trip to Korea;
  • Achieving at least One World Sapphire (or even One World Emerald) status, providing access to One World business class (or first for Emerald) lounges, as well as bonus frequent flyer points and other benefits;
  • Earning about 120,000 miles on AA or 120,000 points on Qantas (due to some additional loyalty bonuses), which can be significant depending on how you value/redeem your points - for example, because we intend to use our AA points for return business class flights, our value is about 7c/mile (so about $8,400 in kind) and similarly for QF up to 4c/mile (roughly $4,800). This depends entirely on how you choose to use the points, as other methods of redemption - eg some domestic flights - makes the value of the points far lower.

For us, this made exceptional sense given it aligned with our plans anyway - and we picked up many of the tips and tricks on how to maximise the benefits from here and Flyertalk.

I was thinking about your situation last night when a similar points earning opportunity arose - we had dinner with family at a local restaurant that we go to all the time and had only recently discovered was part of the QFF scheme. So my wife put down her FF card, and for a $160 meal she will get 480 points, plus another 240 points for using her credit card - so 720 points for doing nothing different, which you may value (depending on your chosen redemption) between $7 to $30.

So with your four return flights from SYD-OOL, you may want to try to book the cheapest Qantas Red e-Deals on a credit card that earns at least $1=1 point. Some of them offer an extra point per dollar for booking directly through Qantas. Say it costs $90 each way (just guessing here), and you earn a minimum on 1000 points and 10 status credits each way. Your normal domestic flying will get you may get up to 9440 points a year - which will get you a one-way ticket to OOL, or about $90 worth.

On top of that, every five an a half years you will get 5000 bonus loyalty points based on the status credits you would have earned - say an extra 900 points a year.

If you fly an overseas sector once every two years, say to Asia, you may earn another 4500 in points for flying plus about 2000 for buying with QF, so another 6500 every two years.

So, for example, at the end of six years you may have up to 90,000 points, which is enough for a return economy trip to Tokyo, a return premium economy ticket to Hong Kong or Bangkok, or a one-way business ticket to Tokyo - so from to $1200-3000 in kind, or about $200-500 a year - by not changing your travel plans at all, or considering what you might earn from other spending on your credit card.

[EDIT - Of course, you may get cheaper flights from another airline / have to offset credit card fees, which is always a factor, so this naturally assumes that all of that is in order and that the QF flights are at least competitive with your alternate options.]

Sorry if I've gone on too much here or said something that may not entirely be useful/accurate, I'm sure one of the more senior members will set me straight - but the gist is, you can definitely make it work for you if it complements your currently planned activities, but don't be surprised if a side-effect is that your travel plans magically appear to increase. :)
 
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How I get points. I don't fly a lot but I do have two points-awarding credit cards. I didn't get much with those when they were domestic expenditure only. For the last few years I've been putting $10,000 a month business expenses on them -- and that mounts up quickly. I'll be off to the US next year flying premium economy - with plenty of points for the next trip. Had few days in Perth in June too. (Actually, don't get me started on that. I 'paid' Qantas points but the return flight was Jetstar -- no points discount and no breakfast and it left an hour late. Not happy. I will never fly Jetstar again.)

A few years ago a work colleague came back from a holiday in Broome and mentioned most of the other holidayers seemed to be tradesmen and their partners who flew and stayed there in points.
 
OMG!!!

Those responses are amazing

Thanks so much everyone, I think that I will look at what regular spending I do that will earn me points and see if I can't get some work expenses on my credit card :)
 
As others have said, it depends on your circumstances. Though I'm a travel junkie, I don't actually get to fly that much ( dream and read about it more than actually doing it!). Most years I fly, at best, two or three trips a year. I lost all my slowly accumulated Ansett points when they collapsed; just as I'd earned enough to do a decent trip. :(

I later joined Qantas FF. Transferred a bunch of Commonwealth Visa points but now have a direct earn credit card with another bank. As I commute a long distance for work each day, I don't get to a bank very often so it suits me to put most of my expenses on credit card (transferring money across to pay it off each fortnight - I refuse to pay interest), and consequently I've racked up a modest amount of points each month. I've had a few interstate Award flights and a very enjoyable Business class trip to Darwin a few years ago. Essentially, I'd be using the credit card anyway so the odd Award flight now and then is a nice bonus. My flights are leisure so I can be a bit flexible about times and dates, and by being flexible, I haven't had any probs getting an Award flight that at least partially suited me. Plan in advance, be flexible and don't expect the world.
 
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a shame Qantas don't fly to the gold coast

Good point. That probably has some impact as you'd have to buy Jetflex fares which are probably over twice as dear. Not sure if you get the extra $1/point when booking JQ either, even on the QF site.

But still, some of the benefit remains, if you investigate what's available and apply it to your current situation. :)
 
So with your four return flights from SYD-OOL, you may want to try to book the cheapest Qantas Red e-Deals on a credit card that earns at least $1=1 point. Some of them offer an extra point per dollar for booking directly through Qantas. Say it costs $90 each way (just guessing here), and you earn a minimum on 1000 points and 10 status credits each way. Your normal domestic flying will get you may get up to 9440 points a year - which will get you a one-way ticket to OOL, or about $90 worth.

However with QF you have to pay an extra fee to pay by CC, and so the maths of this example are not correct where one is paying the cost from one's own pocket.


I am a great collector of FF/CC points but there can be costs in collecting points.

Yearly fees (these can often be avoided or reduced).
Surcharges or booking fees.
So one has to factor in these too.

And though I do not do it, some run balances that they are paying interest on thinking that they are in front by getting FF points whereas the true cost after interest would actually have many behind, rather than in front.
 
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Whilst yes you can get points with wollies (and other places) it's usually $1 = 1 point, considering that even a basic upgrade from discount Y (eccon) on the shortest sectors which they offer J (Business) costs 8000 points you'd need to spend $8000 before you could look at using an upgrade on a cheap flight.

Compare that to say a red-e-deal flight from say CBR - MEL which costs $89 and yet nets 1000 points (minimum points guarantee) using charge cards and earning points without flying can take quite some time and cost a lot of money.

But it is not an either/or situation in this case...as he can do both.

And indeed unless you fly a great deal...for most of us what is best is to accumulate points from every cost-effective source.

So you grab the flight points, points from Woolworths (and eventually BigW, Caltex, DSE), Hotels, Car hire, Credit Crads and other sources that you can.

This accumumaltion all adds up and is particularly necessary if you are looking to build balances so that one can redeem for multiple tckets at once.


If your yearly accumulation becomes high enough one can then consider "optimising" ones earn and burn by use of multiple FF accounts and credit cards (taking advantage of promo rates).

For example my last car-hire went to BMI worth 1700 points wheres to QF it would have only earnt 255 points.

My last stay at a Novotel took advantage of a double points rate and so will earn at 6 points per $. At other times I might have chosen to awrd to KF intread.

My current CC spend is mainly on a KF Amex earning 3 points per $.
The few months prior it was on Amex at 1.25 witha bonus 0.5...and the months prior to that on Earth Amex at 3 points per $ again.

Depending where and in what class you wish to fly different FF programs can have better burn rates, availabilty etc.


So all in all it really pays to run the numbers over your spending and flying patterns and what you might wish to redeem for.

This will allow you to optimise what is best for you. The answer will vary for each of us.
 
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