Melbourne to Sydney by overnight XPT train

Scarlett

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On average which is older, the NSW regional train fleet or ZLs aircraft fleet?
 

Melburnian1

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On average which is older, the NSW regional train fleet or ZLs aircraft fleet?

The former. Maintenance of any transport equipment is however the key. And in some ways, apart from that, older equipment/rollingstock has better seating: the XPTs have comfortable seats and sleeping berths, rather than those horrible slimline airline seats.

I don't condemn ZL for having what in airline terms are considered 'old planes' but unlike the XPT trains, there's no plan for ZL to replace its SAAB aircraft (as others have pointed out, there's not many options to replace them with).
 

Mattg

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The former. Maintenance of any transport equipment is however the key. And in some ways, apart from that, older equipment/rollingstock has better seating: the XPTs have comfortable seats and sleeping berths, rather than those horrible slimline airline seats.

I don't condemn ZL for having what in airline terms are considered 'old planes' but unlike the XPT trains, there's no plan for ZL to replace its SAAB aircraft (as others have pointed out, there's not many options to replace them with).

This is going way off topic, but I thought Rex were planning to acquire ATRs to eventually replace the Saabs.
 

moa999

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This is going way off topic, but I thought Rex were planning to acquire ATRs to eventually replace the Saabs.
Rex signed an MOU to look at fleet replacement options. No orders.

Meanwhile NSW has orders to replace every Regional and Intercity rail car.

NIFs already under tests, and Regional trains due from 2023.
 
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xr6er

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The Qld govt won't permit the NSWTrainLink XPT to arrive during sensible peak period hours in Brisbane (due to shared tracks in from the southern suburbs) so the timetable is unfortunately unattractive. At present it arrives Brisbane Roma St station at about 0400 hours: maybe good for an 0900 international flight connection but too early for business and leisure travellers, unless one also reserves an hotel room for 'the night before.'
I don't think there is any issue with the QLD government. It is actually impossible for the XPT and Brisbane trains to share tracks due to different gauges (the gap between the two rails). The XPT runs on 1435mm gauge and Brisbane trains run on 1067mm gauge.
I think the two issues are getting the train out of Sydney before their peak period and also turning the train back towards Sydney as a daytime service that doesn't get into Sydney too late at night. As far as I know the overnight SYD-BNE train and the daytime BNE-SYD train are the same metal. The daytime train departs BNE @ 0555 and arrives into SYD @ 2012.
 

Jacques Vert

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I don't think there is any issue with the QLD government. It is actually impossible for the XPT and Brisbane trains to share tracks due to different gauges (the gap between the two rails). The XPT runs on 1435mm gauge and Brisbane trains run on 1067mm gauge.
I think the two issues are getting the train out of Sydney before their peak period and also turning the train back towards Sydney as a daytime service that doesn't get into Sydney too late at night. As far as I know the overnight SYD-BNE train and the daytime BNE-SYD train are the same metal. The daytime train departs BNE @ 0555 and arrives into SYD @ 2012.
Here's the XPT at Roma Street showing the shared dual guage track.

1633208251058.jpeg
 

PineappleSkip

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It is actually impossible for the XPT and Brisbane trains to share tracks due to different gauges (the gap between the two rails). The XPT runs on 1435mm gauge and Brisbane trains run on 1067mm gauge.
Not only possible but common. The two lines share one of three rails, with two others for the narrow and standard gauge. There was dual gauge track across the Merivale Bridge since it was built, and south from Park Road as far as Bromelton near Beaudesert since QR converted the standard gauge for the narrow gauge third road. There are numerous other Australian examples in the Wikipedia entry.

@Melburnian1 is correct. The ridiculous timings into Brisbane - one hour more ridiculous in summer with daylight saving - are because the Merivale Bridge is a choke point and fully utilised. It has constrained the building of proposed new commuter lines. Haven’t seen anything about the impact of cross river rail on timings, as the XPT isn’t on Queensland’s radar like commuters are. CRR entrenches the dual gauge line as a commuter line by building platforms on it, but it will relieve pressure on Merivale Bridge. I’m hoping it would enable a middle of day arrival and departure at Roma Street.


cheers skip
 

openseat

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I don't think there is any issue with the QLD government. It is actually impossible for the XPT and Brisbane trains to share tracks due to different gauges (the gap between the two rails). The XPT runs on 1435mm gauge and Brisbane trains run on 1067mm gauge.
I think the two issues are getting the train out of Sydney before their peak period and also turning the train back towards Sydney as a daytime service that doesn't get into Sydney too late at night. As far as I know the overnight SYD-BNE train and the daytime BNE-SYD train are the same metal. The daytime train departs BNE @ 0555 and arrives into SYD @ 2012.
The track from Roma Street to Salisbury (? - I think) is dual gauge. So in fact they do share tracks. Thus the XPT is subject to restrictions placed on it by Queensland Rail as it has to slot in between the suburban rail traffic. A major part of the problem is the Merivale Bridge (from South Brisbane to Roma Street across the Brisbane River) only being two tracks. Maybe the building of the cross river rail tunnel will alleviate the situation and allow for a more sane departure time.
 

Mattg

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I’m hoping it would enable a middle of day arrival and departure at Roma Street.

A middle of the day departure from Roma Street would mean arriving in Sydney around 2am. Personally I'd be happy enough if they just pushed the schedule back by 1-2 hours, meaning a ~6am arrival in Brisbane instead of 3.53am in the summer and a 7am departure.
 

xr6er

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Not only possible but common. The two lines share one of three rails, with two others for the narrow and standard gauge. There was dual gauge track across the Merivale Bridge since it was built, and south from Park Road as far as Bromelton near Beaudesert since QR converted the standard gauge for the narrow gauge third road. There are numerous other Australian examples in the Wikipedia entry.

@Melburnian1 is correct. The ridiculous timings into Brisbane - one hour more ridiculous in summer with daylight saving - are because the Merivale Bridge is a choke point and fully utilised. It has constrained the building of proposed new commuter lines. Haven’t seen anything about the impact of cross river rail on timings, as the XPT isn’t on Queensland’s radar like commuters are. CRR entrenches the dual gauge line as a commuter line by building platforms on it, but it will relieve pressure on Merivale Bridge. I’m hoping it would enable a middle of day arrival and departure at Roma Street.


cheers skip

Well it shows how long since I have caught a train in Brisbane. Last time I caught a train in that direction it was dual gauge from Roma St across the river to South Brisbane and then the two gauges became separate tracks after that. I suppose it makes sense to give peak period trains more priority as they carry a lot more people.
 

Jacques Vert

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Perhaps they should go back to terminating at Soufh Brisbane. I'd prefer to arrive in South Brisbane in the middle of the day rather than Roma street at 0400ish.
 
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openseat

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Not only possible but common. The two lines share one of three rails, with two others for the narrow and standard gauge. There was dual gauge track across the Merivale Bridge since it was built, and south from Park Road as far as Bromelton near Beaudesert since QR converted the standard gauge for the narrow gauge third road. There are numerous other Australian examples in the Wikipedia entry.

@Melburnian1 is correct. The ridiculous timings into Brisbane - one hour more ridiculous in summer with daylight saving - are because the Merivale Bridge is a choke point and fully utilised. It has constrained the building of proposed new commuter lines. Haven’t seen anything about the impact of cross river rail on timings, as the XPT isn’t on Queensland’s radar like commuters are. CRR entrenches the dual gauge line as a commuter line by building platforms on it, but it will relieve pressure on Merivale Bridge. I’m hoping it would enable a middle of day arrival and departure at Roma Street.


cheers skip
Apologies, I didn't see your post and I doubled up. I think I had opened the page in the morning and got about to answering it over a coffee.
 

PineappleSkip

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No need to apologise for agreement :)
Last time I caught a train in that direction it was dual gauge from Roma St across the river to South Brisbane
Last time I caught a train from Brisbane to Sydney it left from the old South Brisbane! The silly timings have dissuaded me since then.

Cheers skip
 

Melburnian1

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A middle of the day departure from Roma Street would mean arriving in Sydney around 2am. Personally I'd be happy enough if they just pushed the schedule back by 1-2 hours, meaning a ~6am arrival in Brisbane instead of 3.53am in the summer and a 7am departure.

Unfortunately not possible, as that would mean an 0700 departure from Roma St that would be in the 'weekday peak period' as defined by Queensland Rail.
 

Melburnian1

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Incorrect. Road coach operates between Albury and Melbourne.

It hasn't for months.

The XPTs between Sydney and Melbourne will resume operating (for passengers) from about 14 November southbound and 15 November northbound. Like the airlines with pilots/first officers, NSW TrainLink has to recertify its drivers as none will have been south of Albury for months.
 
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