Licence required to consume alcohol on Emirates?

[mannej]

Disturbing to say the least.

I keep thinking that I am missing out but then stories like these bring me back to reality.

No thanks....

Sorry John but I find the behaviour of those caught more disturbing than the charges against them.

 

[JohnK]

Sorry John but I find the behaviour of those caught more disturbing than the charges against them.

I do not for one minute condone that sort of behaviour.

They deserve what they get but liquor licences. Yes it may not be seriously enforced but then they have the right to do what they want when they want.

What about the Norwegian woman? Her fault, right?

 

[amaroo]

One of the reasons I will not transit the UAE.

I thought the same until I booked a return FASA to LHR.....

 

[drron]

I thought the same until I booked a return FASA to LHR.....

And now that there are no more FASAs...............

 

[NFF]

When in doubt, don't do it.

 

[amaroo]

And now that there are no more FASAs...............

I'll move back to favourites like SIN/BKK/HKG and depart LHR from T5.

 

[Jack_OC]

Interesting post on FT by a well respected member. It does not contradict anything herein and as in all such things UAE, if you aren't silly it should not be an issue; but it is interesting that it indicates consumption of alcohol is technically illegal in Dubai:

Originally Posted by B747-437B
Drinking alcohol in the UAE is illegal, period. However, non-Muslim residents (of some Emirates) may acquire an alcohol permit that permits them to purchase and transport alcohol for personal use (NOTE : the license does not specifically contradict the higher law against CONSUMPTION of alcohol, but dodges the issue by specifying purchase and transport only!).

It however remains illegal to consume alcohol in public (and technically, in private too), although this is obviously not enforced in isolation. The only people who get charged with alcohol offenses are those who draw attention to themselves for something else.

Non-residents cannot obtain alcohol permits, even though the law requires them to have one in order to purchase alcohol. Like most things in the UAE, it isn't a problem until it is a problem.

Dubai, Abu Dhabi and Sharjah issue permits for purchase and transport of alcohol, even though Sharjah does not issue permits to vendors for sale of alcohol within Sharjah (you can however buy alcohol at Sharjah Airport Duty Free when departing). Ajman, Umm al Quwain, Ras al Khaimah and Fujairah do not issue alcohol permits nor do they require them to purchase alcohol. However, consumption of the alcohol you purchase is still technically illegal due to the Federal law against consumption of alcohol.

I don't think it's correct that "Drinking alcohol in the UAE is illegal, period". I believe it is perfectly legal for visitors (i.e. non-UAE residents) to purchase and consume alcohol within licensed premises, without any form of permit. My understanding is that alcohol permits are only required by and available to UAE residents, and if they have one, it is legal for them to purchase and consume alcohol either within a licensed premises or at their private home. The following comes from the Lonely Planet:

THE UAE DEMYSTIFIED

You can’t buy alcohol? Partially true. When arriving by air, you can, as a non-Muslim visitor over 18, buy certain quantities of booze in the airport duty-free shop (see p 431 ). With the exception of ‘dry’ Sharjah, where alcohol and even sheesha smoking (using a waterpipe) is banned, you can also purchase alcohol in bars and clubs that are generally attached to four- and five-star hotels for on-site consumption. Expat residents can acquire an alcohol licence, which entitles them to a fixed monthly limit of alcohol available from alcohol stores. The only store where you can officially buy alcohol without a licence is at the Barracuda Beach Resort (p 401 ) in Umm al-Quwain.

And the Aussie government Smart Traveller website says this:

Laws on alcohol consumption and possession: You should respect UAE restrictions on the consumption and possession of alcohol. Limits on the duty free importation of liquor into the UAE are strictly enforced. Drinking or possession of alcohol for UAE residents without a UAE Ministry of Interior liquor licence is illegal and could result in arrest and imprisonment. Alcohol is sold in a limited number of designated stores and may only be purchased by liquor licence holders. These licences are only available to UAE residents and only permit the holder to purchase or consume alcohol in the Emirate that issued the licence (for example, a permit issued in Abu Dhabi is not valid in Dubai). The Emirate of Sharjah is dry and alcohol is strictly prohibited at all times. You should be aware that special alcohol rules apply throughout the UAE during the holy month of Ramadan.

Alcohol is served in bars and clubs at most major hotels but may only be consumed by hotel guests. Residents are not allowed to drink in hotels unless they hold a liquor licence. The legal age for alcohol consumption by licence holders in the UAE is 18 years of age, though a Ministry of Tourism by-law requires hotels to serve alcohol only to those over 21 years. Drinking in public or being intoxicated in a public place is illegal and offenders may be arrested. Foreigners have also been arrested on arrival in the UAE after becoming intoxicated on incoming aircraft or while in transit. Visitors to the UAE should also be aware of incidents arising from the use of taxis where passengers are intoxicated. Any dispute with the driver may result in the passengers being taken directly to the police station and charged with public intoxication.

There are also two quotes within the Gulf News story referred to in the loyaltylobby post linked by the OP that are consistent with the above and appear to confirm that it is not illegal to consume alcohol per se (with my emphasis):

Advocate Khalid A. Wahab of Al Midfa & Associates said: “Dubai has a special law on alcohol with 11 articles issued in 1972. Someone who has consumed alcohol in a permitted area can be arrested outside of that area if he is found to be drunk and disorderly. The law applies even if the person holds a valid ‘purchasing’ alcohol licence. While an alcohol licence enables you to purchase alcohol, it does not allow you to drink it in public places or get drunk.”

Musthafa Zafeer O.V, managing partner at Musthafa and Almana International Lawyers and Consultants, said: “Article 2.2 of the UAE’s Code of Conduct stipulates that alcohol consumption should be confined to designated areas like licenced restaurants etc. Article 2.4 says alcohol can be bought from specialised stores only by non-Muslims holding a liquor licence

All of the above is also consistent with my experience of Abu Dhabi - there was no issue whatsoever with drinking in my hotel, which had an array of bars and restaurants. In fact we were actively encouraged by the waiter to have a bottle of wine with lunch! I realise that just because I was able to do it, it doesn't necessarily mean it was legal, but I would expect the Australian government's official advice to travellers to mention if it was illegal to drink alcohol, if that was in fact the case.

A few things occurred to me about this story: (1) was the British engineer a UAE resident? If so, then technically he would need a licence to drink anywhere in the UAE; (2) is it possible that either or both of these men were actually charged with being intoxicated and/or other alcohol related offences, as opposed to being charged for not having a licence?; (3) were either or both of them consuming their own alcohol on the plane? What leads me to ask that is the following quote in the Gulf News story from Fly Dubai: "You are not allowed to consume alcohol aboard an aircraft (whether purchased as duty free from us or someone else or otherwise obtained) unless it has been served to you by us".

BTW, even in many Western countries it's illegal to drink in public and/or to be intoxicated in public, and I think it's illegal in most places to drink your own alcohol on board. And without question, groping people/generally behaving like a lout on a plane is likely to get you in trouble no matter what the airline/country.

 

[serfty]

I don't think it's correct that "Drinking alcohol in the UAE is illegal, period". ...

The reality is that overriding UAE regulation does prohibit the consumption of alcohol within the entire UAE and individual emirates don't legislate in contradiction of this.

However, the what some emirates do is provide official guidelines or Codes of Conduct which if followed should ensure a peaceful stay while allowing business to make a quide.

e.g. Dubai Code of Conduct

Note this is not regulation, but guideline. They do officially regulate the purchase and transport of alcohol.

There's another fuller article on the genesis of this topic here:

In-flight drinking could land you in jail | GulfNews.com

Note that visitors are ineligible to obtain the purchase and transport permits that the articles reference.

 

[Jack_OC]

The reality is that overriding UAE regulation does prohibit the consumption of alcohol within the entire UAE and individual emirates don't legislate in contradiction of this.

One of the quotes I posted above refers to articles in the UAE Code of Conduct, not that of an individual emirate. Can you post a link to a source that confirms there is an overriding UAE regulation prohibiting alcohol consumption throughout the country?

There's another fuller article on the genesis of this topic here:

In-flight drinking could land you in jail | GulfNews.com

Isn't that the same article that I posted quotes from above?!


My view remains that I would expect the Australian govt's official advice to mention if "Drinking alcohol in the UAE is illegal, period", but it doesn't - in fact it goes out of its way to mention the circumstances under which drinking alcohol in the UAE is allowed. Even if it was just "technically" illegal, i.e. if the law was not generally enforced, I would still expect the govt's advice to make that clear.

And here's a link to another story, with a quote from another lawyer, which specifically says "Under local law, alcohol consumption is only permitted in designated areas such as bars attached to hotels. Tourists and residents can drink in these locations without holding a licence to buy alcohol."


Before my visit to Abu Dhabi, I made a point of looking into this as I wanted to make sure I didn't fall foul of the local laws, and everything I read (including the sources I quoted from above) seemed to confirm that it is legal for non-residents to purchase and consume alcohol in designated places without a permit. Nothing I came across suggested it was illegal to drink alcohol throughout the country, technically or otherwise. I'm not a lawyer, let alone an expert in UAE law, so I'm open to the possibility that all of the information I read could be wrong, but if so, there must be credible sources out there to support the contention that it is actually illegal to drink alcohol anywhere in the UAE.

 

[serfty]

There are some references.

Can I drink in the UAE?

Dubai’s alcohol laws – Expat - My Telegraph

Anyhoo, legality does not relate to practice here - the "Technically" is the reality - drink discretely and don't be publicly inebriated and one should be fine.

 

[Jack_OC]

There are some references.

Can I drink in the UAE?

Dubai’s alcohol laws – Expat - My Telegraph

Anyhoo, legality does not relate to practice here - the "Technically" is the reality - drink discretely and don't be publicly inebriated and one should be fine.

Sorry, but none of this convinces me that alcohol consumption is illegal throughout the UAE. Your previous statement "The reality is that overriding UAE regulation does prohibit the consumption of alcohol within the entire UAE and individual emirates don't legislate in contradiction of this" implied that you had direct knowledge of the relevant regulation, so I was really looking for a link to that, and/or a link to an official source of info that explains it.

While the first link you posted does indeed state that alcohol is technically illegal in the UAE, it's written by a journalist based in Australia, and it provides no source to back up that statement.

The second link (from The (UK) Telegraph) doesn't say alcohol consumption is illegal. It just states that tourists technically need a licence to consume alcohol. In any case, I'm not sure if The Telegraph has got its facts right, as this story is actually a re-hash of the same article in Arabian Business that I linked to in my last post, and what The Telegraph says is quite different to the original article. As I mentioned previously, the original article states "Tourists and residents can drink in these locations without holding a licence to buy alcohol." The way I read it is, the lawyer is just worried that tourists might run into problems once they leave the hotel bar, and also feels they should be allowed to get licences so they can buy booze from bottle shops.

 

[serfty]

Sorry, but none of this convinces me that alcohol consumption is illegal throughout the UAE. Your previous statement "The reality is that overriding UAE regulation does prohibit the consumption of alcohol within the entire UAE and individual emirates don't legislate in contradiction of this" implied that you had direct knowledge of the relevant regulation, so I was really looking for a link to that, and/or a link to an official source of info that explains it. ...

You are welcome to think what you wish - it makes no difference to what actually happens in Dubai.

The FT member I quoted is well respected and I am inclined to believe them.

 

[Jack_OC]

You are welcome to think what you wish - it makes no difference to what actually happens in Dubai.

The FT member I quoted is well respected and I am inclined to believe them.

Fair enough, each to their own, but I've heard that even well respected members of frequent flyer forums sometimes get things slightly wrong

 

[drron]

There is this article-

Someone who has consumed alcohol in a permitted area can be arrested outside of that area if for whatever reason this fact is brought to the attention of the police, or they are found to be drunk and disorderly in a public area. This usually occurs when bar-goers are involved in a car accident – irrespective of whether they were driving or not – or even when they seek the help of the authorities after having consumed alcohol. The law still applies even if the person arrested holds a valid ‘purchasing’ alcohol licence: it is best to remember that while an alcohol licence enables you to purchase alcohol, it does not allow you to drink it in public places or to be drunk in public areas.

UAE law explained - The Knowledge Features - TimeOutDubai.com

So although you can drink in a bar if you are then in a public place afterwards and the police know you have consumed alcohol you can be arrested.That seems to imply that the consumption of the alcohol is illegal.
In the case of the Norwegian woman quoted by me before she notified the police several hours after drinking so I doubt she was "drunk".

Then there is people taking medication.This must be declared-

The following items must be declared by the passenger to the Customs officials
on arrival and non declaration may be treated as smuggling which is an offence
punishable by law.
7.


Medicines of all kinds even if for personal use.

Also narcotics and psychotropic drugs are banned.So in the past this has included drugs such as Codeine(Panadeine) and antidepressants.

Medicines For Personal Use



Passengers (resident and non resident) can bring into the country a maximum of
three month supply of medicine, for their personal use and an original prescription
must be enclosed (stamped and signed by official embassy of UAE in the country
of origin, with details of the patient, description of disease ...etc) of registered
medical practitioner. All the medications should be in original packaging and not
expired. No psychotropic medicines are allowed without prior approval from the
Ministry of Health (www.moh.gov.ae) even for personal use, in small quantity and/
or with prescription. Seizure of such medicines will be punishable under law.

http://www.dubaicustoms.gov.ae/en/eServices/ServicesForTravellers/Documents/TravelersGuide09En.pdf

So these facts are taken from the Dubai customs website.
PS-The codeine incident-
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/southern_counties/4500665.stm
A British woman who spent eight weeks in a Dubai prison after codeine was found in her urine has been released. Tracy Wilkinson, 44, from Balcombe, West Sussex, tested positive for codeine, which is banned in Dubai but was legally prescribed by her UK GP.





.

 

[BAM1748]

Disturbing to say the least.

I keep thinking that I am missing out but then stories like these bring me back to reality.

No thanks....

There are many interesting things there, but I'm a drinking bloke who enjoys being single, having a girlfriend come on holidays with me and cares nothing about religion. They look all nice and shiny but there are problems underneath.

These locations just don't suit my lifestyle so I prefer elsewhere with the same values as I have. :mrgreen:

Matt
PS, good on others for going though.

 

[Jack_OC]

Drron, not sure if you read my previous posts, but I know there are restrictions on alcohol consumption and that it's illegal under some circumstances. My point is simply that I don't think it's correct that "Drinking alcohol in the UAE is illegal, period".

The article that you quoted - like several other sources that I mentioned - refers to the fact that there are "permitted areas" for alcohol consumption. If there are permitted areas where alcohol can be consumed, then alcohol consumption is not prohibited throughout the country. More specifically, numerous sources (including the traveller's advice issued by the Aussie, US and UK governments) state that tourists are allowed to drink in hotel bars. As I said before, if that was actually illegal, and it was just a case of authorities turning a blind eye most of the time, I really would expect the Aussie government et al to make that clear, rather than simply saying it's allowed.

It definitely seems to be risky venturing outside of the permitted areas after consuming alcohol, but I think the people who are arrested under those circumstances are being picked up under the public intoxication laws rather than consumption of alcohol laws. You might well be right that the people in some of these reports weren't actually drunk - i.e. they were not in a state that an average Westerner would consider drunk - but I suspect the problem is that the term "drunk" is very subjective. BTW, the Aussie govt does mention this problem in its advice:

Drinking in public or being intoxicated in a public place is illegal and offenders may be arrested. Foreigners have also been arrested on arrival in the UAE after becoming intoxicated on incoming aircraft or while in transit. Visitors to the UAE should also be aware of incidents arising from the use of taxis where passengers are intoxicated. Any dispute with the driver may result in the passengers being taken directly to the police station and charged with public intoxication.

It sounds like it's best not to leave your hotel for the remainder of the evening if you have a few drinks (but that's not really a problem in Abu Dhabi, as IME there is very little to do outside of the hotels, especially at night - maybe more of an issue in Dubai?).

 

[drron]

We are all splitting hairs but it does say for example that if you are in a car accident your blood alcohol needs to be zero otherwise you are considered intoxicated.That to me sounds like a total ban on alcohol,unless you stay where you have been drinking.
Of course if a muslim it is totally prohibited to drink alcohol in the UAE-under law just not religious teaching.
Same for medicines-the woman arrested for having codeine did not have any tablets in her possession.She was pulled up due to a passport problem.Had to submit a urine test.Codeine was found so off to jail she went.

 

[Jack_OC]

We are all splitting hairs but it does say for example that if you are in a car accident your blood alcohol needs to be zero otherwise you are considered intoxicated.That to me sounds like a total ban on alcohol,unless you stay where you have been drinking.

Unless I've missed something, the BAC limit of zero applies to drivers, not passengers. That applies to professional drivers in Australia too by the way. I can't imagine why any visitor to the UAE would find it hard to avoid alcohol completely if they plan to drive.

On a more general note, as I said it does seem a bit risky to go out and about after having a few drinks in the UAE. But it really isn't splitting hairs to draw a distinction between that and a total country-wide ban on alcohol consumption. My only UAE experience has been in Abu Dhabi, and it really wasn't the kind of place where you went out on the town (there was nowhere to go other than hotel restaurants and bars). As such, dinner and drinks in the hotel, followed by bed, was all that was ever going to happen anyway. If I found out that I was actually breaking the law by doing that, I'd be a little concerned about doing it again, but I don't think I was.

 

[drron]

It does also apply to passengers.You would have to be unlucky as someone has to tell the police you have been drinking.
In Dubai for example if you go to the Burj for afternoon tea and have a champagne or two you may end up in trouble getting back to your hotel.
But from the Jumeirah hotels they recommend this service and give you a 10% discount.
The Driver | Personal Chauffeur Dubai
Discretion guaranteed.

 

[Pushka]

We certainly had no issues being offered alcohol on our recent Emirates flight and last night at the IC club the host asked us what we would like to drink and with a large smile stated "The Bar is now open". It was 8pm and Ramadan.