JQ35 between Syd-Mel Gone this Saturday! - Any Clues?

[harvyk]

Emoticons (I thought) were designed to add emotion, not meaning.

A good writer should be able to convey meaning without the use of emoticons. If a reader can't work out the use of humour the writer hasn't done a good job. It is the job of the writer to remove ambiguity (if they wish to) through text. If something is not funny, or could be considered inappropriate, adding a ':mrgreen:' doesn't necessarily fix the skills of the writer.

But writing skills are a broader issue.

The use of emoticons may have value where space is limited - for example text messages.

Since this is going way OT anyway, conveying true meaning inside 500 characters of internet post written in response in 30 seconds is hard. Most people don't have a strong understanding of the English language (including me, despite only ever speaking English). Since most people's communication is verbal, most of the meaning behind that communication is non-verbal (eg tone of voice, body language), as such emoticons or "codes" like "JK" are a good way of injecting a small amount of this non-verbal communication back in in a quick and easily understood manner.

The problem is that no matter how elegant you think you are in your posts, there will be people who just don't understand the meaning, won't be in on the jokes, or will take something as an insult where no insult was intended, just because the emotions behind the writing are just not present.

So as someone who loves these things -> , I'll continue to use them, if nothing else in the hope that people will understand my emotional thinking as much as the words I've used in the hope that my true meaning might actually shine through.

 

[straitman]

We all know why the OP's JQ35 got cancelled but lying about the reason for the flight cancellation is sailing a little close to the wind in my opinion. Would only take one inconvenienced smart cough lawyer with a point to prove for this to get fairly messy for JQ, especially if they had to present evidence of their "engineering issue" and explain how the aircraft flew empty and operated the next MEL-DPS service as per schedule...

Sorry this would not stick.

Aircraft serviceability can often be quite subjective. Anything from how worn a tyre is to.....
All that's required is that someone looks, decides 'it's' out of limits. By the time someone else decides it's OK it is to late to include the SL freight into the equation.

 

[medhead]

My understanding is that JQ are charged per entry.

I recall being told at one of the special qantas lunches that JQ refuse to pay for lounge use and hence Qantas bears the cost.

Emoticons (I thought) were designed to add emotion, not meaning.

A good writer should be able to convey meaning without the use of emoticons. If a reader can't work out the use of humour the writer hasn't done a good job. It is the job of the writer to remove ambiguity (if they wish to) through text. If something is not funny, or could be considered inappropriate, adding a ':mrgreen:' doesn't necessarily fix the skills of the writer.

But writing skills are a broader issue.

The use of emoticons may have value where space is limited - for example text messages.

How about interpretation then. They supply the non-verbal cues of speaking to someone.

For example I recently met someone who caught me attacking their portal in Ingress. About the second thing I said to him was "B@stard". He laughed and I laughed, why because my true meaning in using that word was understood by non verbal cues.

Now if I just wrote that same word on AFF, with nothing else, I'm pretty sure the meaning would be lost.

Anyway, this is all explained very well below.

Since this is going way OT anyway, conveying true meaning inside 500 characters of internet post written in response in 30 seconds is hard. Most people don't have a strong understanding of the English language (including me, despite only ever speaking English). Since most people's communication is verbal, most of the meaning behind that communication is non-verbal (eg tone of voice, body language), as such emoticons or "codes" like "JK" are a good way of injecting a small amount of this non-verbal communication back in in a quick and easily understood manner.

The problem is that no matter how elegant you think you are in your posts, there will be people who just don't understand the meaning, won't be in on the jokes, or will take something as an insult where no insult was intended, just because the emotions behind the writing are just not present.

So as someone who loves these things -> , I'll continue to use them, if nothing else in the hope that people will understand my emotional thinking as much as the words I've used in the hope that my true meaning might actually shine through.

 

[straitman]

Well, looks like I will never be posting here again, no wonder theres so many lurkers.

Make a joke about class action, with a clear smiley and get flamed.

I believe you are reading the responses wrong.

Most responses also have smilies so maybe you could have missed them just as others may have missed yours. (I did)

Having said that the people who you see as flaming you are also entitled to an opinion. If you ever feel they are going too far then I invite you to use the report post function and let the mod team have a look.

 

[eastwest101]

Sorry this would not stick. 

Aircraft serviceability can often be quite subjective. Anything from how worn a tyre is to.....
All that's required is that someone looks, decides 'it's' out of limits. By the time someone else decides it's OK it is to late to include the SL freight into the equation.

Understand all of that - but in this case the OP was informed of the engineering issue a few days before the planned flight on the 9th August. The email from JQ explains/obsfuates the issue by talking about "engineering requirements" - if this is the case then we should be seeing either a grounded B787 now or alternately a 787 not flying into SYD and not being ferried to MEL empty and not operating the next flight as per normal schedule. I am happy to take bets, that on the day in question, that is exactly what will happen, therefore its an economic decision not to operate, ergo the reasons provided by JQ are possibly misleading because they have given advance notification that they do not intend to operate the JQ35 service.

Yes I know the FLounge access is a 'loophole' that gets some people bent out of shape but the potentially misleading excuse provided is coming close to switch and bait, thats all I was trying to say. Considering that JQ have 787 Dreamliner marketing and sales pitches all over their web site then they should not be surprised if people make bookings planned on 787 aircraft!

I know its stretching credulity but if this is not stepped on, then theoretically say QF could advertise & offer every single flight in its entire network as A380 services, and send out apologetic email notifications that due to engineering issues their actual service will be operated by a B737 or say Dash 8..

Again - my issue is not aircraft breaking down or sustitution, we all know they happen, or even cancellations due to light loads, its how honestly the cancellations are explained to the customer that interests me.

 

[TomVexille]

I guess if you (or your partner) have never experienced the F lounge, fair enough. It is a nice experience.
However, I don't think it is worth booking a trip to AUK for or from the International Terminal just to experience the F lounge.

QF or JQ have flights to Alakanuk? :shock:

 

[harvyk]

Understand all of that - but in this case the OP was informed of the engineering issue a few days before the planned flight on the 9th August. The email from JQ explains/obsfuates the issue by talking about "engineering requirements" - if this is the case then we should be seeing either a grounded B787 now or alternately a 787 not flying into SYD and not being ferried to MEL empty and not operating the next flight as per normal schedule. I am happy to take bets, that on the day in question, that is exactly what will happen, therefore its an economic decision not to operate, ergo the reasons provided by JQ are possibly misleading because they have given advance notification that they do not intend to operate the JQ35 service.

I'm pretty sure the following covers them

(a) Jetstar does not guarantee it will be able to carry you and your Baggage in accordance with the scheduled date and time of the flights specified. Schedules may change without notice for a range of reasons including but not limited to bad weather, air traffic control delays, strikes, technical disruptions and late inbound aircraft. Flight times do not form part of your contract of carriage with us.

Provided that JQ35 is typically operated as a B787 and provided that you can typically book onto JQ35 and fly a B787 (like I have done), then I can't see it as a bait and switch. It would need to be the vast majority of flights having the equipment changed before bait and switch could come into play.

Again - my issue is not aircraft breaking down or sustitution, we all know they happen, or even cancellations due to light loads, its how honestly the cancellations are explained to the customer that interests me.

Agreed, but as a challange to you, find me some large companies who are always 100% truthful in their communications when things don't go to plan. IME talking down problems, sugar coating or just plain out lying (but not enough that legal action happens) no doubt done by marketing and vetted by the lawyers tends to be standard operation.

 

[DC3]

So, the situation is not "JQ35 between Syd-Mel Gone forever", or is it?

 

[harvyk]

So, the situation is not "JQ35 between Syd-Mel Gone forever", or is it?

According to the dummy booking I just did it's still there...

 

[Dmac6345]

QF or JQ have flights to Alakanuk? :shock:

Whoops! Fixed

 

[eastwest101]

I'm pretty sure the following covers them

(a) Jetstar does not guarantee it will be able to carry you and your Baggage in accordance with the scheduled date and time of the flights specified. Schedules may change without notice for a range of reasons including but not limited to bad weather, air traffic control delays, strikes, technical disruptions and late inbound aircraft. Flight times do not form part of your contract of carriage with us.

I am sure there have been numerous discussions about T&Cs and Conditions of Carriage do not supercede or exempt businesses from complying with the consumer laws.

Provided that JQ35 is typically operated as a B787 and provided that you can typically book onto JQ35 and fly a B787 (like I have done), then I can't see it as a bait and switch. It would need to be the vast majority of flights having the equipment changed before bait and switch could come into play.

Given that JQ35 is 'scheduled' for Tues and Sat I just checked the Jetstar source and out of a scheduled 9 flights (5 tuesdays and 4 saturdays) in July 2014, I found that JQ35 actually operated on 4 occasions. So thats a 44% success rate for operating JQ35 from SYD-MEL. If I promise to deliver a service to a customer and perform the service as advertised 44% of the time and provide a lesser service 56% of the time would a court/reasonable person consider that a satisfactory discharge of the service?

Agreed, but as a challange to you, find me some large companies who are always 100% truthful in their communications when things don't go to plan. IME talking down problems, sugar coating or just plain out lying (but not enough that legal action happens) no doubt done by marketing and vetted by the lawyers tends to be standard operation.

Not having a go at you - I can see what you are saying, but that would be a pretty weak defence for JQ to offer because they would be admitting that they lie, as do, other corporations <insert here>

The standard operating procedure seems to be - advertise JQ35 SYD-MEL, due to weak demand the 'scheduled flight' often does not get a lot of takers, so to save costs, JQ then transfer customers to a domestic JQ alternative with the added bonus of also helping JQd out if its a quiet day. I would argue that this is becoming routine and/or planned practice. i.e. its not a plan B if its happening in the majority of occasions, by definition it is now your plan A

And the intent is irrelevant if the information and explanation for the failure to provide the marketed service is a lie/misleading.

Loving these emoticons too harvyk

 

[infinity]

I am sorry to hear that you missed the JQ35. I did it last Saturday and the F lounge was a treat!

If you price matched with Tiger, hopefully you didnt spend too much for your domestic experience down.

I have done JQ18 as well and never had a cancelation on that, so good luck if you go

Please see my other post about an early check in for next time ( not sure it will work for your JQ18 though??)

JQ35 early check in

 

[casanovawa]

Could you just get a couple of fully flexibles to NZ and then once in, cancel the flight???

Wouldn't help with then having to get over to the domestic terminal to catch your replacement flight down to Mel...

 

[amaroo]

Could you just get a couple of fully flexibles to NZ and then once in, cancel the flight???

Wouldn't help with then having to get over to the domestic terminal to catch your replacement flight down to Mel...

LOL maybe someone here can challenge the Chinese and Germans in ripping off airlines Man uses first-class plane ticket to eat free for a year | New York Post and Man Eats His Way Through Lufthansa Lounge Without Ever Lufting Off - Bloomberg

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

Wouldnt dare use the crew or APEC card holders line at MELi arrivals, even with D sticker on BP.
Maybe some one else can try.

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

I too at one time thought Auckland was AUK.
Was reminded on here or Flyertalk its AKL for Auckland.

 

[blackcat20]

Wouldnt dare use the crew or APEC card holders line at MELi arrivals, even with D sticker on BP.
Maybe some one else can try.

Its specifically marked as being for D pax.

 

[TomVexille]

Wouldnt dare use the crew or APEC card holders line at MELi arrivals, even with D sticker on BP.
Maybe some one else can try.

Just did the other day. It specifies D passengers.

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

Ok, will give it a try.
My next JQ10 is late Sep.
Fingers crossed they dont/wont do to me what they did to the OP.
I wont be able to use F lounge, though for SYDi dep, as I am not P1/P, not even a QF PS (yet).

 

[RickyT84]

Seems like the SYD-MEL leg of JQ35 was cancelled today due to the fact that the MEL-DPS leg was operated by an A332 in lieu of the usual 787. This means that there was no need to ferry/position the aircraft down from SYD.

Coincidentally, VH-VKA has not been in service since 5 August 2014 (and the aircraft is still in MEL). Maybe this is the 'engineering issue' that JQ was referring to in the OP's post?