IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALAEA

[JohnPhelan]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Purvinas should be immediately placed on a "no fly" list by both QF and VA.

This is the same guy who last week said he thought QF staff had manufactured the threats against Joyce and others as a tactic to make the union look bad. Memo Steve: you are already the master of that, so you don't need QF's help.

That whole suggestion also gives an interesting insight into Purvinas' character and the sorts of tactics that he apparently deems acceptable. Rather like the too-cute trick of calling a strike, then calling it off at the last minute so the disruption still occurs, but your members don't lose any money. If you're going to go on strike, at least have the guts to follow-through on the threat.

And Browski - this has got nothing to do with jobs going overseas - as Serfty points out, these LAME engineering jobs must be carried out on the ramp at Australian airports. Please think through these things logically, without just accepting the duplicitous and self-serving cough that spews out of Purvinas and his comrades-in-stupidity.

 

[samh004]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

I think even joking about so many people losing their jobs and livelihood is really off to be honest. And laughing about it... Sure thing...

No offence to those who think it's funny.



(I'm disappointed we are even giving this guy airtime. Yes I know by commenting I am too....)

Obviously I wouldn’t be happy or laughing about it, I fly them too, I don’t want them to fold, but I basically did exactly what he did, just from the opposite side.

 

[Robert K]

I think even joking about so many people losing their jobs and livelihood is really off to be honest. And laughing about it... Sure thing...

No offence to those who think it's funny.



(I'm disappointed we are even giving this guy airtime. Yes I know by commenting I am too....)

We need to give this guy more air time. The more people that gets exposed to the cough this idiot spiels, the sooner union members will see the light and fire him, the sooner this saga can be over.

 

[browski]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

It helped that they did not ask for as much as Qantas staff.
Why is it OK for this nob to threaten my holiday. Union reps like this are a thing of the past, stop blaming the employer because your demands are unreasonable, work on an outcome that is fully costed, reasonable and affordable or see your members jobs head OS.

1. He's trying to both protect you and further his union's position by alerting you to the likliehood that your flight will be disrupted.
Why would you go ahead and book QF when you have so many other safe options available. You would just be irresponsible to go ahead with a QF flight at the moment when you have full knowledge of pending industrial action. Your holiday is only threatened if you book QF. So don't.
2. Their jobs are heading overseas anyway. They have nothing to lose.

 

[browski]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

And Browski - this has got nothing to do with jobs going overseas - as Serfty points out, these LAME engineering jobs must be carried out on the ramp at Australian airports. Please think through these things logically, without just accepting the duplicitous and self-serving cough that spews out of Purvinas and his comrades-in-stupidity.

I'll just refer you to these articles. It's best you understand the full issues (that it is ONLY about a simple jobs issue) and not use inflamatory language, John. Otherwise you just come across as one of those lemmings who just accept the duplicitous and self-serving cough that spews out of AJ and his comrades-in-stupidity.

Qantas job cuts in review inflame tensions with unions | The Australian
Mr Joyce said about 1000 jobs would become redundant as a result of aircraft retirements, network changes and more efficient practices. The job losses would be in management, pilots, cabin crew and engineering, he said.

Politicians hit out at Qantas job cuts - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
"Well this isn't about an industrial issue... Qantas have made it clear; this is about what's occurring with global aviation," he said. (Albanese)

Qantas to slug flyers, sack staff, cut flights | The Australian
Mr Joyce could not guarantee that job cuts would not spread across the airline's wider workforce. Mr Joyce told The Australian that agreeing to the unions' bid to curtail the use of cheaper contract labour through award job security clauses would remove the company's flexibility to deal with fluctuations in the market.

 

[nlagalle]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

1. He's trying to both protect you and further his union's position by alerting you to the likliehood that your flight will be disrupted.
Why would you go ahead and book QF when you have so many other safe options available. You would just be irresponsible to go ahead with a QF flight at the moment when you have full knowledge of pending industrial action. Your holiday is only threatened if you book QF. So don't.
2. Their jobs are heading overseas anyway. They have nothing to lose.

So LAME's, baggage handlers and catering staff are heading overseas? Just how are they going to do this work from there?? Seriously stop believing the garbage being sprouted..

 

[tuapekastar]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

I was gobsmacked when I saw Mr Purvinas deliver those words (don't book on QF) on the news tonight. I'm not a big fan of either side in the current dispute(s), they're brawling like two infantile school children when all the while passengers (the people giving them an income) are suffering delays and cancellations, but the ALAEA is shooting itself in the foot, and while I haven't checked it does not seem there is much public sympathy for them.

Ultimately there is middle ground which can be found (QF staff seem to be on a very good wicket compared to competitors, can afford to give a little ground, QF the company can certainly give a little ground) but both sides need to be sensible. And there's the rub. They're not.

QF staff cannot have 'employment for life' or whatever is being asked for - it sounds ridiculous (much as I would like to have the same). At the same time QF cannot simply 'screw' it's staff into the ground.

I'm not a fan of people lobbing into companies and slashing costs (Al Dunlap anyone?) but changes need to occur and both sides need to seek out the appropriate common ground.

I fall (just) on the side of Qantas here (not that I particularly like AJ's general philosophy) but something has to give and work practises change over time.

And I acknowledge that my statements are fairly general and thus easy to make. :-|

 

[Awesom Andy]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Either the union or the management will drive the airline to the ground. The question is, who will get it done first.

In some overseas market, it seems that the Qantas name is so bad now that they might as well just abandon the market.

e.g. In Y, SIN (where I am based), if fares are of any guidance, Jetstar would clearly be the premium airline - most of my peers wouldn't touch Qantas with a 6-foot pole, no matter the price, but would be happy to fly on Jetstar if the price is reasonable. I also have friends who would much rather fly BA Y than QF Y, such is the poor perception of Qantas these days.

In J, despite the recent drop in services with SQ, my (other group of) peers still would not consider QF at all. They are, however, happy to try out BA, or the middle eastern airlines if they are heading to Europe (and don't have SQ status miles to maintain).

Overall, while I don't have a large sample size, nobody would be willing to fly on QF, with the exception of those who only consider price - QF is often cheaper than JQ to south-east AU, even ignoring luggage allowances and meals.

 

[Fantic125]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Couple of points from my perspective;

"The Management"
Qantas is no different to any any other business (or Bank). A Company is in business to make money. Shareholders invest in a company to make money. The primary goal of any Chairperson of a company is to make money to satisfy the shareholders and increase the investment of the company. If a company does not make money, the shareholders will take their money out of that company and invest it in one that will.

"The Union"
The purpose of a Union is to represent the collective voice of the workers within a particular industry to avoid individual exploitation of workers by unscrupulous companies. The 'shareholders' of a Union are the workers that diligently pay their union fees, and expect the Union management to take the (collective) best interests to heart in negotiating employment conditions.

Both "sides" are trying to achieve the maximum gain to satisfy their stakeholders and IMHO are making the dispute/negotiation more and more public which will only devalue the Qantas brand and drive people away.

Lose/lose for all concerned.

 

[VHOEJ]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

The thing about the union that irks me - they fail to accept that as time goes on, we can improve the way we do things. They seem stuck in the 70's and 80's way of thinking - as technology improves, there are more efficent ways of doing things.

 

[notzac]

I'm struggling to work out which group are being more short sighted - the Union or QF Management. Pretty sad really

 

[ejb]

The thing about the union that irks me - they fail to accept that as time goes on, we can improve the way we do things. They seem stuck in the 70's and 80's way of thinking - as technology improves, there are more efficent ways of doing things.

So true.

The TWU talking about jobs going overseas is stupid. How can bags be handled overseas.

QF have a responsibility to stay in business and the unions should be helping not helping other airlines.

If they don't like their jobs thy can quit and work elsewhere.

ejb


Sent from my iPhone so please ignore auto corrects!

 

[Mal]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

As I indicated earlier, Qantas is winning the press battle. Take for example this "Sunrise" article:

Turbulent times for Qantas - Sunrise - Yahoo!7 TV

"Why are they striking when they are the highest paid in the world" type comments. ALAEA has lost the battle. Now let's see how much self-injury they cause.

 

[simongr]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

It should be remembered that Qantas management has publicly declared that thousands of these jobs are in the process of being culled. These jobs are then going to foreign workers. If Qantas goes down, it won't affect the workers, since in effect, they've already been sacked.

Hmm - they said 1,000 not 1,000s - there is a subtle if important difference there. Using thousands is inflamatory and incorrect.

Also what about people who have already booked on QF months ago. Many families book overseas trips many months in advance and don't have a choice now. Many people may not have a choice (corporate contracts) so what do they do? They will experience delays and cancellations and when contract renewal time comes QF wont be at the front.

Yes this is useful information to allow people to make judgements about which airline to fly. To me though this just smacks of bully boy threatening tactics. Personally I will fly QF to spite these people and if I experience delays I will send the union a bill for my lost time/costs incurred - just because you tell someone you are going to screw them it doesnt make it better!

 

[ozmille]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

This reminds me so much of Sabena going bankrupt some years ago with strikes up to the very end. I was lucky I could just continue working under the curator but a lot of people lost their jobs.

 

[Limewood]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Do the union members have a secret ballot for strike action? or asked for a show of hands?.

I take it the union organisers get paid their salary strike or not.

I can't believe this union is trying its utmost to inconvenience the public (let alone Q) like this.

 

[oz_mark]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

I'm struggling to work out which group are being more short sighted - the Union or QF Management. Pretty sad really

This current situation is going to be difficult to resolve, as the ego's on both sides are getting in the way of negotiating a way forward. At this point it is difficult for either side to back down from their positions, so I would not think it is going to happen soon.

Anyhoo, as someone affected by the strikes yesterday, I did have a think about who I should be booking should I wish to travel in the near future. Haven't really answered it for myself, but I will be more wary of booking Qantas.

 

[serfty]

I've got a DFW flight in a few weeks that I booked in January. Keeping a VERY close eye on things.

 

[browski]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Hmm - they said 1,000 not 1,000s - there is a subtle if important difference there. Using thousands is inflamatory and incorrect.

They said 1000 so far. But you're right, 1000 jobs going OS is acceptable; I think 1200 job losses is the threshold for when it becomes inappropriate; but maybe you can clarify as to what that figure is?

Personally I will fly QF to spite these people and if I experience delays I will send the union a bill for my lost time/costs incurred - just because you tell someone you are going to screw them it doesnt make it better!

"These people" won't be spited; but you will be delayed. When you are sitting in the airport all alone,bored and angry, just remember not to look across at the VA flights (and best not look in a mirror either).

 

[markis10]

Re: IF you're planning on flying in the lead up to Christmas, don't fly Qantas. - ALA

Well JQ customers have had a big win Friday if they like to pack a lot:

JETSTAR says it's disappointed check-in workers are taking industrial action on Friday in their "no weigh day". The Australian Services Union (ASU) announced today that the Qantas-owned carrier's check-in staff will waive excess baggage fees for 24 hours in protest at stalled workplace agreement negotiations.
"Jetstar is disappointed by this action and is continuing to focus on ongoing discussions with the ASU to finalise a fair and reasonable agreement for the benefit of its employees and sustainability of the business," a Jetstar statement said.

Read more: Jetstar disappointed by industrial action | News.com.au
​