How much does immigration know about your trips overseas?

[clifford]

Sorry about that Kooky.

Must admit I've had the odd run in with Australian Customs. They treat eveyone as if they are a criminal. Even US customs/immigration is better.

I was once selected for special treatment by a foul-tempered moron at 6 am at KSA, because I had done a round-the world trip in 14 days (had a good reason to do it, and it wasn't in any way suspicious).

Anyway, after about half an hour of checking everything, including the contents of my wallet, underpants, etc, this moron found precisely nothing (much to his annoyance).

I then told him I was extremely displeased with his arrogant and rude manner and would be writing to his superiors. Got a very apolgetic letter back from the regional director for NSW, and now I never have a problem with Customs in Australia.

Pays to stand up for your rights (at the appropriate time). Helps if you also know how the system works (I was a senior federal public servant for over 30 years).

 

[RTWFF]

Reality check

A friend of mine did some IT work recently for Immigration. Their biggest problem is that everything is checked via your passport number, and with persons of dual citizenship they have to match up people who arrive and depart on different passports. It's why all this talk of Big Brother Is Watching You via super computers is so ludicrous. Anyone who's tried to do data matching knows that they have to be able to correlate several different pieces of information exactly. For those who are paranoid (or value their privacy) there are several simple ways of confusing Big Brother
1 If you have dual citizenship make sure the name on both passports is not exactly the same
2 When giving your phone numbers unless you really, really want that person to contact you, transpose some digits (or make one up)
3 Wherever possible, don't give your full name - "J Smith" is harder to track down than "John Smith" which is in turn harder than "John Murgatroyd Smith"
4 Remember that computers are doing this data matching and most simply aren't programmed to do "fuzzy" matching (which is what humans are good at) so the more confusion you can throw into the mix the better

And if you think the terrorists don't already know all of the above ...

Frankly I never, ever put my actual intended address on any Immigration form. I understand all the arguments about terminal dandruff breaking out among the passengers and the authorities having to contact you, but the risk is so remote (about as remote as you having to operate the emergency door in the case of a crash landing) that I'm prepared to take my chances

Governments do not have a "right" to know just because they want to know. Just because a question is asked seeking personal data it does not need to be answered - or at least answered truthfully

As for the forceful body search involving "cavities" - I've speculated what might happen if the victim subsequently filed a rape charge

 

[thadocta]

I had a run-in with authorities (forget if it was customs or immigration) at SYD one night when I flew MEL-SYD on an INT flight, and it was a status run - so down that afternoon, back same night. No baggage, no nothing.

Ended up with a strip search (no body cavity search, thank god), they could not comprehend the reason for the straight-down-and-back trip to MEL.

(Of course, three hours in the MEL INT QP did not exactly equip me for the ordeal).

Aussie authorities, can be quite good, but they have their moments. Agree though, UK is the best (but then I always arrive in the UK on my UK passport, which surely helps).

Dave

 

[NM]

Just keep in mind that making a false declaration on an immigration or customs for (even inserting a fake address) could be an offence in most countries.

And it is a requirement when entering and leaving Australia, that anyone with an Australian passport must use their Australian passport, even if they also hold a passport from another country.

 

[oz_mark]

Re: Reality check

As for the forceful body search involving "cavities" - I've speculated what might happen if the victim subsequently filed a rape charge

If the appropriate approvals have been gained for conducting the search, I am not sure a rape charge would stand up.

 

[RTWFF]

Just keep in mind that making a false declaration on an immigration or customs for (even inserting a fake address) could be an offence in most countries. And it is a requirement when entering and leaving Australia, that anyone with an Australian passport must use their Australian passport, even if they also hold a passport from another country.

I should say the address is never fake, it's just not where I'm going to be. After all, I didn't have a booking, m'lud, and when I turned up there were no rooms available at the price within my budget. As for the rule that Australians must enter on an Australian passport, it's unenforceable

 

[one9]

Re: Reality check

If the appropriate approvals have been gained for conducting the search, I am not sure a rape charge would stand up.

\

Unless the appropriate approvals were never fully legally sound.

Pity that Australia does not have a broad constitution to cover the rights of individual Australians.

But then again, the US has such a constitution, and it doesn't seem to give US citizens great rights.

 

[clifford]

Re: Reality check

\
But then again, the US has such a constitution, and it doesn't seem to give US citizens great rights.

That's where you're wrong, my friend. The US constitution and the courts generally do get there in the end (unlike good ol' Little Johnny's Oz).

Just look at what is happening with Guantanamo Bay ...

 

[thadocta]

Re: Reality check

That's where you're wrong, my friend. The US constitution and the courts generally do get there in the end (unlike good ol' Little Johnny's Oz).

Just look at what is happening with Guantanamo Bay ...

As you say, they get there in the end - what happens to all the years lost in the meantime? Plenty of people released after spending years on death row, with little or no compensation

 

[ethernet]

Wrong Question.

But there was a comment from ex DFATer not to worry about it.

Previous quarantine offenses, and being a smart-cough or troublesome will not be in your interests. Being helpful, and having ALL food/customs items in one open bag ready to go - seems to be a big plus.

The right question is how do they 'score' you - as mostly everyone is pre-cleared before you arrive - or flagged for special attention. They do this by (primitive) data matching, or random chance or police tip-off. They do not want to waste money on false positives - so for legit people nothing to worry about.

What goes into this data matching engine. Well the Privacy commissioner has about 0.02 per Australian to print mundane details, but the loopholes exist.
The possibility of someone detained - leaving because of
a) parking fines
b) tax matters
c) Child care payments
d) flunky arrest warrant ... is a concern.

If traveling to United States, there was something printed in Europe that the sent bank account and credit card details and biometric data - which made the Euro's outraged that the outsourced company did something stupid.

Which boils down to if you have a big disposable income, respectable job or clutch of kids, everyone wants to be your friend. Green opens doors.

If you set off the drug sniff test, look like a smelly tramp, beard, grey shoes, low on cash, and from the golden triangle or .nl - expect to be hassled.

Those who requiore clearance or vetting - well they ask for photocopies of your passport and more. No privacy - unless you are an absent minded person who scores lots of business 'freebies' - until time catches up.

 

[markis10]

What goes into this data matching engine. Well the Privacy commissioner has about 0.02 per Australian to print mundane details, but the loopholes exist.
The possibility of someone detained - leaving because of
a) parking fines
b) tax matters
c) Child care payments
d) flunky arrest warrant ... is a concern..

How about adding:

e) revives a three year and a half year old thread on FF

 

[albatross710]

Although I recommend never bringing back and declaring coffee in your baggage, I learned that lesson a few years back, it seems it is often used to mask drugs!

I travel regularly and am a collector of coffee. Roasted coffee has never been an issue for me either ground or as beans.

I did have some sample green (unroasted) beans confiscated by Customs on the basis that they felt they could see some evidence of previous bug activity on the surface of the bean. I had been directed to a customs isle that had a microscope. Rather than argue the toss, I forfeited the 100 grams of coffee and made my exit.

 

[Gold Member]

How about adding:

e) revives a three year and a half year old thread on FF

LOL, my thoughts eggzackery!

 

[hazel]

Re: Reality check

As for the forceful body search involving "cavities" - I've speculated what might happen if the victim subsequently filed a rape charge

In Aus [& I presume a lot of other places] Customs cannot do a cavity search. The AFP & State Police under the Customs Act can ask a passenger, at a customs barrier, if they will consent to a body cavity search. If the passenger does not consent the Police or Customs can apply for a court order to do one. Needs to be done by a medical practitioner. I think X-ray is the preferred option.

 

[drron]

Well I missed this thread first time around. Was in Alaska with no internet access at the time. An interesting read. A few points-

We always have soap and coffee-havent bought either for years
LOTFAP - Yes it was a pain for the first few years after 9/11-SSSS every time. Nothing for the last 3 years until flying ORD-NRT a few weeks ago. But how times have changed. Had my passport out, TSA looks at it - "sorry mate we cant hold an Aussie up" and rejoined mrsdrron in seconds.
UK Immigration - glad some of you like it.Just dont wear a knee brace.only place in the world i have been taken into a room and told to strip to my undies.
Canada - now there are fellows who need lessons in what constitutes a smile

 

[russianrob]

I'm another to have pleasant experiences with UK Immigration and shockers with LAX.
PER and SVO are probably up there at No; 2 and 3 for worst (SVO ranking lower due to the fact I'm not blind yet )

 

[medhead]

Re: Reality check

In Aus [& I presume a lot of other places] Customs cannot do a cavity search. The AFP & State Police under the Customs Act can ask a passenger, at a customs barrier, if they will consent to a body cavity search. If the passenger does not consent the Police or Customs can apply for a court order to do one. Needs to be done by a medical practitioner. I think X-ray is the preferred option.

On "borderline security" (one useful thing from those 5 pages) it is ultrasound that is used. Which makes sense as that will pick up less dense things, unlike x-ray.

The other comment in here was about the soap (and food in general), it was speculated that these are identified by x-ray because of density. This is not really the case, the machines analyse the reflected x-rays and are able to determine if organic matter is presented