Flights posting to AA and QF accounts

[Dave Noble]

I try to stay away from these discussions but there is only one issue that I can see and it is not QFs fault. It is greed. You can't have the cake and eat it too. Yes you can try but remember Murphy?

What are you on about? How is it his fault that the number was put in without his wish? QF agents doing things against peoples wishes are not the passengers fault. As stated

I think the QF number got in there because of my F upgrade request.

Dave

 

[JohnK]

What are you on about? How is it his fault that the number was put in without his wish? QF agents doing things against peoples wishes are not the passengers fault.

I think you know what I am on about.

Trying to credit flights to AA but playing around with upgrades or upgrade possibilities using QFF points or even utilising higher QFF status for seat allocation for certain flights. Trying to be smarter than the system occassionally backfires.

The solution is simple, credit to AA or credit to QF. Leave one FF number in the booking. Do not quote any other FF number. Don't blame the QF agents.

 

[Dave Noble]

The solution is simple, credit to AA or credit to QF. Leave one FF number in the booking. Do not quote any other FF number. Don't blame the QF agents.

OK then . Please, pray do tell how to request a points upgrade on a QF flight without quoting the account from which the points will be deducted from. It would be a useful trick

Dave

 

[SeaWolf]

It is greed. You can't have the cake and eat it too.

What rubbish. The airlines are a business, not some bloody charity. They're in this to maximise the money they get from their passengers, so I can't imagine how you can equate someone trying to maximise the benefits they get from the airline with greed.

If you feel so strongly about it I invite you to give up all you flyer memberships since it's obvious you're just using them to be greedy and get something for nothing.

 

[Dave Noble]

What rubbish. The airlines are a business, not some bloody charity. They're in this to maximise the money they get from their passengers, so I can't imagine how you can equate someone trying to maximise the benefits they get from the airline with greed.

Definately

If you feel so strongly about it I invite you to give up all you flyer memberships since it's obvious you're just using them to be greedy and get something for nothing.

Absolutely. Coming from someone so obsessed with status and doing flights just for that purpose, these sorts of comments were risible

Dave

 

[NM]

I see nothing wrong with trying to have flights post to an AA account and using QF FF points to upgrade a QF flight. In fact. I have done that on at least three occasions. I don't see anything greedy about that. I knew enough to get in early and tell the QF agent NOT to put my QFF number in the booking details, even though they wanted to do just that. She could not understand why I would not want it in there .

The issue Simon has hit is one of incompetence from the QF agent. He called to request an upgrade and the agent thought they were doing him a favour, but have caused him heartache instead.

 

[Keith009]

I see nothing wrong with trying to have flights post to an AA account and using QF FF points to upgrade a QF flight.

Can't see what's wrong with that either. If anything it's the limitations of QF's infrastructure which should be blamed. Airlines like SQ and NZ have a status field (FQTS) in addition to the mileage accrual field (FQTV) to cope with situations where someone might have status on that airline and want to take advantage of the privileges that their status brings (and rightly so) but wish to accumulate their miles elsewhere.

 

[simongr]

I think you know what I am on about.

Trying to credit flights to AA but playing around with upgrades or upgrade possibilities using QFF points or even utilising higher QFF status for seat allocation for certain flights. Trying to be smarter than the system occassionally backfires.

The solution is simple, credit to AA or credit to QF. Leave one FF number in the booking. Do not quote any other FF number. Don't blame the QF agents.

Historically before I had status with AA I did use my QF number to get better seat allocations. I have also made sure that my AA number was on the BP each time.

I am at fault I guess for using my QF number sometimes to get seat allocation. I have run the risk of flights posting to the wrong account and I am paying for that - I am not EXP so I do not have my upgrades for my JFK-NRT trip, I will not be able to access the F lounge in HKG.

I specifcally asked that my QF number NOT be put in my booking and checked multiple times on BA's MMB and CMT and each showed only my QF number. I did not want this confusion and I am the one being penalised.

I have earned my privileges on both airlines and if i want to use them I should. If needed whilst still gold I will request my extra baggage allowance even if flying on my AA number.

RE the Oz round trip - I have made multiple posts regarding whether I wish to maintin my gold QF status. I will by that point have more than enough points on AA for my RTW trip so the only other thing I am interested in is whether I can maximise my chances of upgrades. I do not know why I am greedy for doing that.

 

[serfty]

... If anything it's the limitations of QF's infrastructure which should be blamed. Airlines like SQ and NZ have a status field (FQTS) in addition to the mileage accrual field (FQTV) to cope with situations where someone might have status on that airline and want to take advantage of the privileges that their status brings (and rightly so) but wish to accumulate their miles elsewhere.

Qantas DO as well; it's an industry standard with the booking system for PNR's. This can be used to put ones points to one FF program and use the status of another FF program for your travels.

Unfortunately, when trying to get this set up for booked flight segments/intineries many agents either;

• do not understand this,
• don't know how,
• think it's too difficult,
• simply get it wrong or
• think they know better and do it their way.

As a result, all to often it does not work as the traveller intended.

In the end it appears simpler to credit to the one program and use one status in that program for travel.

 

[serfty]

I try to stay away from these discussions but there is only one issue that I can see and it is not QFs fault. It is greed. You can't have the cake and eat it too. Yes you can try but remember Murphy? ...

JohnK, if you believe greed is the cause of Simon's problem, then IMHO, most regulars of this board, including you and myself, would be guilty of it.

Personally, I feel that there is nothing wrong with 'having you cake and eating it too' in the respect of Frequent Flyer Points/Miles and Frequent Flyer Status with the awards and perks that come with them.

I do not agree the word greed is appropriate to use in the context of this thread - it is too harsh a word.

In the respect of the OP, he is putting most points and Status to AA. To upgrade a Qantas flight you need to use Qantas FF Points and only Qantas FF Points. Ipso Facto, a Qantas FF number had to be associated with the booking.

In spite of specifically asking for his "QF number NOT be put in my booking" (I guess in the FQTV/FQTS fields) it somehow was. This was not the OP's fault.

 

[JohnK]

What rubbish.

If you say so. I have been reading stories on AFF and FT in the last couple of years of people getting burned with flights posting to wrong FF programs. QF agents do not need to know about the little tricks and games played by frequent flyers and be held responsible when something goes wrong.

If you feel so strongly about it I invite you to give up all you flyer memberships since it's obvious you're just using them to be greedy and get something for nothing.

What does this have to do with the discussion?

Absolutely. Coming from someone so obsessed with status and doing flights just for that purpose, these sorts of comments were risible

Attacking the individual again. You know absolutely nothing about me so no need for these type of remarks. I made a small comment in this thread which you escalated to mammoth proportions.

 

[JohnK]

I am at fault I guess for using my QF number sometimes to get seat allocation. I have run the risk of flights posting to the wrong account and I am paying for that - I am not EXP so I do not have my upgrades for my JFK-NRT trip, I will not be able to access the F lounge in HKG.

I didn't attack you or blame you in my original post. Playing around with FF numbers in bookings can occassionally backfire as has happened to you on this occassion. It may also temporarily cost you the higher status you are trying to achieve.

I know many people here love F lounges but having been in a few in the last couple of months they are nothing special. The SIN QF/BA F lounge is very ordinary, small and loud.

I specifcally asked that my QF number NOT be put in my booking and checked multiple times on BA's MMB and CMT and each showed only my QF number. I did not want this confusion and I am the one being penalised.

I feel sorry for you but you can hardly blame the QF agents to know exactly what you are trying to achieve. It is not part of their training program.

I have earned my privileges on both airlines and if i want to use them I should. If needed whilst still gold I will request my extra baggage allowance even if flying on my AA number.

And so you should. But just remember Murphy.

I do not agree the word greed is appropriate to use in the context of this thread - it is too harsh a word.

Agree it may be a little harsh. I have edited my original remark.

 

[Dave Noble]

If you say so. I have been reading stories on AFF and FT in the last couple of years of people getting burned with flights posting to wrong FF programs. QF agents do not need to know about the little tricks and games played by frequent flyers and be held responsible when something goes wrong.

Of course they are responsible. If a QF agent adds a FF number despite being told not to add it, then who else is responsible?

Dave

 

[serfty]

Thinking about this, maybe for upgrade requests Qantas do not use the FQTV or FQTS data.

It has been posted that it's the 'Status' of the requesting source of points being used for an upgrade that determines rank; it can be different from that of the actual passenger. So this information needs to be stored somewhere else, as in:

... oh wait here it is hiding down at the bottom of the itinerary...

It would be interesting what "Bottom of itinerary" means in this context.

Note that points were correctly allocated to AA for the first few flights, then the "rot set in". Maybe there's some sort of regular robotic scan of PNR's which tries to associate/align ff numbers in bookings, or perhaps a refreshing of PNR's across individual airlines booking systems..

I conject this software may either assume that FF numbers at the "Bottom of itinerary":

• are an inadequately trained agents way of changing FF number and hence trigger an automatic 'fix' or
• a way of converting data between these booking system that don't exactly co-relate.

 

[Mal]

I see this (mainly) as a Qantas issue.

Either:

a) Their software does weird things and doesn't correctly interpret FQTV/FQTS commands or swaps them around.
b) The staff are entering them incorrectly (staff training issue).

It's a risk you take when taking journeys that involve multiple FF cards and the status they ensue. Yet to have an issue when I've asked for my FF number to be removed, or changed to my AA one, but I'm sure I'll see the issue eventually.

 

[Keith009]

If it's an industry standard, the FQTS field seems to be rarely utilised except for the 2 airlines I've mentioned.

I suppose it's more a training issue. I've had enough woes as it is trying to get QF agents to enter my AA number correctly so I can only imagine the comedy with trying to get them to do anything else on top of that. Just got off the phone with one who insisted that he could only enter non-QF numbers into the 'comments' field...:evil:

 

[JohnK]

I suppose it's more a training issue.

I can just see the training course notes being revised with an extra bullet point.

• how to add and remove FF numbers so that 20 or so frequent flyers from FT and AFF do not get inconvenienced

To ensure that no one else is offended by my comment is there a tongue in cheek smilie?

 

[Keith009]

I can just see the training course notes being revised with an extra bullet point.

• how to add and remove FF numbers so that 20 or so frequent flyers from FT and AFF do not get inconvenienced

What is so uncommon about flying on QF with a non QF FF number? Plenty of tourists in Australia.

SQ didn't seem to have any problems with both FQTV and FQTS fields when I flew with them with both a LH M+M number for miles accrual and an SQ number for status. But it looks like even inserting a single non QF number for miles accrual (and nothing else but that - not even trying to do anything like points upgrade) seems to be a feat for QF agents to perform.

Tongue in cheek smiley - semi colon, followed by shift key pressed simultaneously with the number 0 key (assuming that's where your close bracket key is located).

 

[JohnK]

[/list]What is so uncommon about flying on QF with a non QF FF number? Plenty of tourists in Australia.

I booked 2 one way AA flights, ORD-LGA-TPA and TPA-MIA-DFW-ORD, on the AA website and did not provide my AA FF number. Once booking was confirmed I called AA in India and had my QF FF number inserted into the bookings. Very simple process.

But how many people have flights booked with AA using an AA FF number, then insert a QF FF number for the benefit of better seat allocation or chance to upgrade flight and then switch the FF number back to AA once upgrade has cleared. I don't think this is very common. I would not risk it.

Anyway I am not here to defend the airlines agents or scold anyone for attempting to gain the benefits associated with high class status on more than one FF program.

 

[Keith009]

I booked 2 one way AA flights, ORD-LGA-TPA and TPA-MIA-DFW-ORD, on the AA website and did not provide my AA FF number. Once booking was confirmed I called AA in India and had my QF FF number inserted into the bookings. Very simple process.

You've not done the reverse with QF then. I go through the same process when booking most QF flights - 1) book on qantas.com, 2) leave FF field blank, 3) ring up QF to put in AA number. Repeat step 3 for up to thrice at times.

My point was that if as simple a task as inserting a non QF number is so difficult to do correctly, I am not surprised that they'd fumble majorly with anything more.