Flight attendants call for carry-on baggage standards

[UP4014]

Nice to say to the cabin crew to enforce it, but you risk a dummy spitting passenger in the middle of loading.

perhaps some management types could come down and stand at the gate at random and enforce it there on behalf of the cabin crew.

matt

 

[The Rok]

For starters, HL checking should be done at Check In. Wether it be online, at a kiosk, or check in counter it should be blatantly clear in bold what your HL limits are and that they will be enforced!

Then, have HL inspected for suitability prior to security screening! Finally, before boarding, check again.

What baffles me is why airlines wait until pax are ON THE PLANE before moaning about HL!

 

[seanpodge]

The airlines (management, not frontline staff) haven't helped in this area by having luggage fees and then having different rules for carry on. They really need to standardise the the bag dimension and weight rules between airlines and probably increase the weight limit to a more realistic number (I'd say 10 kgs would be fair). They also need to have some external security, at least at the start, to handle people who go over and subsequently go off. Having the same people checking luggage who then have to serve the irate passenger who got their bag relegated to the hold inside a small metal tube for several hours is not a recipe for success. Wether this is done by having big burly blokes at the gate when bags get knocked back or having the check done away from the gate is an issue for the airlines. I noticed at Pargue airport, where LCCs like Ryanair are major players, they actually had bag gauges at the x-ray machines. Basically if your bag didn't fit, back to the check in counter with it. Seemed like a good place to do it since people would be less likely to pull out the tough guy act at an x-ray officer with a few gun toting police officers standing behind him/her.

The standardisation issue is one where the union can really help since they have members in all the airlines (as far as I understand).

Or is it more a case of a union whinging because of extra work THEIR members have to do because THEIR members fail to implement/enforce rules laid down by the airline!

How much influence do you think the frontline staff had in setting the rules they have to enforce? Certainly not as much as the CEO of accounting who will never have to put up with an irate passenger going off at them during boarding because their five trunks of lead samples don't quite fit in the limits while the nearest security guard is 500m away and on smoko.

Unsafe manual lifting is a major cause of workplace injuries, some of which can cause permanent disability and permanent unemployment. So as long as you're willing to pay in full appropriate compensation for such an injury (lost income for x number of years/decades, super, medical fees, refitting of their home, compensation for loss of enjoyment of life, et cetera) just for a bit of "customer service", then I'd say that this is more than just a union whinge.

Workplace safety is not a whinge. In the case of airlines, it can be the difference between the plane landing on the runway and landing in the runway.

I'm not sure if the cabin baggage situation in Europe mirrors that of here as well as the USA.

I'd say that in Australia, it's probably closer to Europe than the US. Full service carriers still allow checked in baggage for free whereas . Checked in baggage fees in Australia are still a lot more reasonable than in the US (except I think Southwest).

*A silver get a real benefit here in that their first checked in bag is free on US Airways and United domestic flights. Saved my at least $50 on my trip in May.

 

[medhead]

here's a thought..there wouldnt be the need to ENFORCE the rules IF PAX DIDNT CONSTANTLY FLOUT THE RULES IN THE FIRST PLACE..(which are in place for a reason and are all clearly set out on airline websites) how about taking responsibilty for your own actions!! :shock: (rant over)!!

What came first, the chicken or the egg?

What you seem to be missing is that people flout the rules because they aren't enforced. Think of it this way, everyone turns up in compliance with the rules, except one person. They get away with it because no one visibly pulls them up. Next flight one of the other passengers who saw them get away with the rules needs to bring one extra little thing on board (last minute gift from a relative or something like that) then you have 2 people on the flight who've ignored the rules and got away with it. It's not long before the entire flight is ignoring the rules, because the staff are not pulling them up; the staff are letting them get away with it.

 

[Archphoto]

The art of stacking carry-on would help an awful lot as well - how much space does a handbag need? I travel with 2 bags, and if at all possible, I'll stack the smaller one on top of the larger one. And if that won't work, it goes under the seat in front of me (annoying, but my choice to have 2 bags).

Of course, some of those "rollerboard" bags are the same size as my suitcase in the hold - the mind boggles as to how anything that size gets past the boarding gate??

And as others have said, some of those bags start at 3-4kg empty! My camera roller is 3kg empty, with the gear (don't ask!!) but it is a hell of a lot smaller in size, than some of the bags that get brought on board. Admirably, the manufacturer has managed to make their latest model just over 1.7kg, but that is still quite heavy.

 

[drivatruk]

less stowed luggage = less paid baggage handlers = savings. They haven't put on extra cabin crew to stow the bags that used to be in the hold..

 

[JessicaTam]

The airlines (management, not frontline staff) haven't helped in this area by having luggage fees and then having different rules for carry on. They really need to standardise the the bag dimension and weight rules between airlines and probably increase the weight limit to a more realistic number (I'd say 10 kgs would be fair). They also need to have some external security, at least at the start, to handle people who go over and subsequently go off. Having the same people checking luggage who then have to serve the irate passenger who got their bag relegated to the hold inside a small metal tube for several hours is not a recipe for success. Wether this is done by having big burly blokes at the gate when bags get knocked back or having the check done away from the gate is an issue for the airlines. I noticed at Pargue airport, where LCCs like Ryanair are major players, they actually had bag gauges at the x-ray machines. Basically if your bag didn't fit, back to the check in counter with it. Seemed like a good place to do it since people would be less likely to pull out the tough guy act at an x-ray officer with a few gun toting police officers standing behind him/her.
...

This is where standardisation would be necessary, as QF allow 7kg and JQ 10kg. Also my roll-aboard is fine for QFi but too big for QFd unless I am connecting to an international flight. It would become a bit much if a size check at the security point meant also interpreting the different rules. If it was one size fits all, then this could work.

 

[Happy Trails]

When FAs complain about carry-on baggage the words pot, kettle and black spring to mind.

 

[serfty]

Well I'm going to have to look at economical packing. Mrs Blinky and I are going to Europe for two months starting next March, and while our Business Class long haul allowances are huge, the connecting flights we have to do are anything but, and have very costly excess baggage charges.

See this thread: http://www.australianfrequentflyer..../great-hand-luggage-only-challenge-10900.html

This is where standardisation would be necessary, as QF allow 7kg and JQ 10kg. Also my roll-aboard is fine for QFi but too big for QFd unless I am connecting to an international flight. It would become a bit much if a size check at the security point meant also interpreting the different rules. If it was one size fits all, then this could work.

JQ used to allow only 7kg, but upped that to 10kg when they introduced paid checked luggage.

Don't BA have unrestricted carry-on (but *you* have to lift it into the overhead compartment yourself without the assistance of a flight attendant)? Or am I dreaming?

They used to have such a rule, but now restrict it to 23kg. (British Airways - Hand baggage)

 

[Mal]

Don't BA have unrestricted carry-on (but *you* have to lift it into the overhead compartment yourself without the assistance of a flight attendant)? Or am I dreaming?

Used to be unrestricted but now capped at 23kg. And yes they make it quite clear that you have to deal with it

... and Serfty beat me to the post!

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[Mal Ware]

I used to hate hand luggage and would always check my bags, I was therefore very fast to board and de-plane, I took up no extra space and got on and off as quick as I could.

It didn't take long to realize I was being a chump, I ended up waiting for ages anyway, only to see those who loaded up carry-on breeze through the airport to a taxi while I had to wait for bags.
So rather than try and beat them, I joined them and now only have carry-on.

I would not be upset if they banned all carry-on minus a purse or plastic bag with a book in it.

The boarding and alighting would be much faster for everyone, but of course this won't happen as mentioned earlier, they save money on baggage handlers and the poor hosties have to do a lot of the packing.

 

[anat0l]

Used to be unrestricted but now capped at 23kg. And yes they make it quite clear that you have to deal with it

As in do you mean you must be able to lift it?

What happens if you can't? I suppose Grandma can't expect to bring a big bag and expect someone to stow it for her?

 

[Mal]

As in do you mean you must be able to lift it?

What happens if you can't?

Haven't seen it happen but BA staff apparently won't help. Your bags are your responsibility. If you can't handle it then into the belly it goes.

... and that's the way it should be.

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[anat0l]

Haven't seen it happen but BA staff apparently won't help. Your bags are your responsibility. If you can't handle it then into the belly it goes.

... and that's the way it should be.

I agree with this (although an exception may have to be made for the disabled and the elderly).

That said, I flew a BA flight before (LHR-FRA) where the FAs were actively playing a bit of overhead bin Tetris before closing up. They did fit everything in eventually, but I definitely know that they had to actively lift and shove some cases to make all fit.

Of course, this was 2009 and things may have changed, but also in the end FAs will be compelled to ensure an on time departure, so standing there like a bossy boots expecting a pax to cooperate with you with respect to their bag will probably achieve nothing except an earful from flights management when you debrief off duty later.

 

[seanpodge]

Haven't seen it happen but BA staff apparently won't help. Your bags are your responsibility. If you can't handle it then into the belly it goes.

... and that's the way it should be.

Agreed. Although I would probably exclude people with physical disabilities that notify the airline beforehand.

 

[stewiejp]

I'd like to think if there was a little old lady struggling with an overhead locker and bag someone would jump in and give her a hand, be it a passenger or staff.

Last time I flew from MEL there were people checking/weighing/measuring carry on luggage at the beginning of the secure area (just before immigration). This seemed to work for my JQ flight. It seems every time I check in (and this has happened for well over half my international flights, especially out of MEL, but also Europe, Asia and the US), the person directly in front of me has a drawn out argument, often "not understanding" the language, about what needs to and doesn't need to be checked in. The end result is more often than not they say, ok I'll take it back to the car - and then proceed to board the plane with it, saying the check in staff said it was ok.

Got to feel for the staff, as they deal with morons daily, but admit they and the airlines have created this situation.

 

[dfcatch]

here's a thought..there wouldnt be the need to ENFORCE the rules IF PAX DIDNT CONSTANTLY FLOUT THE RULES IN THE FIRST PLACE..(which are in place for a reason and are all clearly set out on airline websites) how about taking responsibilty for your own actions!! :shock: (rant over)!!

Restrictions, reduced allowances and baggage charges have all enticed/incentivized pax to maximize their carry-on.

Simple cause and effect.

If you want to minimize hand luggage, then you need to remove basic checked baggage fees and up the free checked allowances back to where they used to be. Of course now that airlines have forced pax to change their conditioned behavior - it's harder to change back.

Oh - and standardize it at 45in and 10kg and then enforce it strictly.


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[anat0l]

If you want to minimise hand luggage, then you need to remove basic checked baggage fees and up the free checked allowances back to where they used to be. Of course now that airlines have forced pax to change their conditioned behavior - it's harder to change back.

As I said, giving back checked allowance for free and upping it "back" to 32kg will not help. There are a ton of HLO road warriors on QF who did that even though they always had free checked baggage allowance - how do you seek to change their behaviour?

But as you said, the airlines are now in a difficult situation, since they can't get out of this situation. Maybe they should start encouraging weightlifting gym classes for the FAs and baggage handlers?

Oh - and standardize it at 45in and 10kg and then enforce it strictly.

I'd agree with this, and keep it very strict. Ryanair are great at enforcing this, even at the gate. None of this "free items" confusion. The only thing is that even though you can tell ladies that you can't have a separate handbag, you may have to make exceptions for those who have medical reasons or are have infants. Mind you, Ryanair treat a garment bag (even if it just contains the garment itself) or your iPad or book that you couldn't fit in your bag as an additional item and will charge you for it, unless you can fit it all in one bag. Also, I'd reckon that the airport retailers (especially duty free) will lobby hard against draconian cabin baggage procedures, as inevitably people will shop much, much less if they cannot carry it onboard later, for fear of breaking the size or weight restrictions.

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[amaroo]

This passenger calls for crew's to cease placing their carry-on luggage in prime located bins!

I've been disappointed to see bins above my F, J & front row (y only flights) seats stuffed with crew tagged bags......no need for the crew to leave the plane first therefore, they should be located well away from the front.

 

[TirEoghain]

This passenger calls for crew's to cease placing their carry-on luggage in prime located bins!

I've been disappointed to see bins above my F, J & front row (y only flights) seats stuffed with crew tagged bags......no need for the crew to leave the plane first therefore, they should be located well away from the front.

This is something that really pisses me off! More times I have used priority boarding, and still had difficulty stowing my bag becasue of the crew bags, portable IFE bags etc. This is largely compounded if the plane happens to have a life raft stowed there too!