Fat flyers

[rechoboam]

I don't know if anyone saw the celebrity who died in a light plane crash in the US or Caribbean, he entourage of 3 or 4 each weighted 300 pounds or so, I wondered if that contributed.

Has never happened to me but if I only had half a seat on a long flight and there was no other option I would ask to be offloaded

 

[kempvet]

Can remember one of the air crash investigation episodes, small commercial passenger plane in the USA, the weight was not distributed properly and when the wheels were raised, up went the nose of the plane and down she came into the airport hanger killing all those on board. There was a fundamental issue with something about the stability of the plane anyway, has flown a few flights since inspection, but it was just this flight where the weight issue tipped the balance literally.

One of the investigators looked into the passenger weight issues, actually called the doctors of all the people who perished and found that on average they were 20 pounds heavier than the estimates used for the passenger weight for the flight. If the people were actually weighed, the plane would have been overloaded and not able to fly unless some passengers or baggage were taken off.

 

[nickykim]

Brings back memories doing admin work in light aviation in remote FNQ delivering supplies to outstations. Everybody on the scales, all luggage on the scales, all supplies on the scales, sit around while pilot works out seats and loading. We did seem to fly a lot of heavy luggage containing "wet clothes" carried by the locals.

 

[simongr]

It is an interesting issue and I am surprised that we haven't had the normal rants that we have when this topic is discussed.

One interesting point is that a lot of the experiences here are from people who sit towards the front of the back of the bus - and it is surprising how many of the larger types seem also to be at the front of the back of the bus - I would have thought that if you were large then you would look towards the back of the back of the bus to find more chance of a spare seat next to you.

I do think that obesity is a major issue that I don't think we are tackling and socially it is being deemed to be acceptable to be large and to comment on weight that is generally (not universally I know given I take thyroid replacement pills and have lost 5kg since taking them) controllable is somehow offensive but fat people are not victims of fate.

 

[Oneworldplus2]

Can remember one of the air crash investigation episodes, small commercial passenger plane in the USA, the weight was not distributed properly and when the wheels were raised, up went the nose of the plane and down she came into the airport hanger killing all those on board. There was a fundamental issue with something about the stability of the plane anyway, has flown a few flights since inspection, but it was just this flight where the weight issue tipped the balance literally.

One of the investigators looked into the passenger weight issues, actually called the doctors of all the people who perished and found that on average they were 20 pounds heavier than the estimates used for the passenger weight for the flight. If the people were actually weighed, the plane would have been overloaded and not able to fly unless some passengers or baggage were taken off.

I think that was this one -
Air Midwest Flight 5481 operating as US Airways Express Flight 5481

2 that stand out for me
Alaska Airlines Flight 261
The Gimli Glider - Air Canada Flight 143

 

[samh004]

I haven’t yet had the displeasure of someone overflowing into my seat, but feel the airline should police this a bit more. It’s not a case of discrimination if you honestly can’t fit into your seat, and I do believe it’s heading towards a compensation scenario for other passengers that buy a set space and have it intruded on by someone else.

The troubling thing is that with the average size of people on the rise, eventually airlines will have to increase seat size so they’re not discriminating. This sounds good in theory, until you realise it will probably mean less seats and increased prices. Maybe this is a long way off, hopefully.

I don't see why airlines could not offer this facility & charge people for a seat in the name of "personal comfort" for whatever reason whether they be large in stature, claustrophobic or for whatever the reason may be. With fare structures the way they are now ie domestically everyone pays the same fare & no discount for kids the cost of the "personal comfort" seat should be the same price as what the pax is paying for their seat.

Internationally it could be the same price as the applicable child fare if children pay 67% or 75% of the airfare.

They do offer comfort seats, at least Qantas does. I have two bookings currently, out of 5, where I’ll have a comfort seat. The main seat is regular cost, while the comfort seat is the same as the regular seat, minus taxes. You can only book this over the phone and the phone assistance fee is waived.

It’s quite a good deal domestically, not sure about internationally though.

The ticket ends up being booked for:

first-name last-name
Exst last-name

 

[juddles]

....One interesting point is that a lot of the experiences here are from people who sit towards the front of the back of the bus....

As someone who hates statistics (not sure why - I just do) I have an urge to always look for alterntive explanations for patterns. Perhaps this congregation of complaints from the front of the back is because (a) Right at the front (J or F) seat space is not such an issue. (b) It is far more likely that members on this forum have done enough flying that, even in Y, they are nearer the front of the back than the back of the back.
Just an abstract wandering thought....

 

[simongr]

I agree juddles - my point being more that I am surprised about the number of larger pax that are also sat at the front.

 

[juddles]

I do actually agree with you. I would think that ¨usually¨ any vacant seats are going to be at the back so a checkin person would see the obvious and could quietly and without offending give a seat back there.

 

[Pushka]

One issue with that is boarding the elderly, and those in a wheelchair, and as Jetstar (In New Zealand) can attest, you don't want to upset those in wheelchairs.

That's a good point. On a recent flight a lady in a wheelchair was boarded before everyone else. She was sitting in the aisle. My seat was the window seat. She could not move at all and she was rather large. I had to climb up on to the seat and step onto the middle seat to get to my seat. Without cracking my head on the overhead lockers. Staff just looked on. Thank god I didnt need a loo break. How on earth, can that be deemed safe?

 

[ozmille]

That's a good point. On a recent flight a lady in a wheelchair was boarded before everyone else. She was sitting in the aisle. My seat was the window seat. She could not move at all and she was rather large. I had to climb up on to the seat and step onto the middle seat to get to my seat. Without cracking my head on the overhead lockers. Staff just looked on. Thank god I didnt need a loo break. How on earth, can that be deemed safe?

That is very bizar. Things might have changed (don't think so but you never know) but I used to work at Special Assistance at BRU airport years ago and wheelchair pax were only allowed to get seats at the window for safety reasons. They would be blocking your way to the emergency exist in case of an emergency.

 

[Archphoto]

That is very bizar. Things might have changed (don't think so but you never know) but I used to work at Special Assistance at BRU airport years ago and wheelchair pax were only allowed to get seats at the window for safety reasons. They would be blocking your way to the emergency exist in case of an emergency.

I remember being told this once as well - and have noted that they always seem to be in the window seat when I've flown (a lot of international over the past 7 years), but can't recall if it's the same domestically - maybe because I'm trying hard to catch up on the lost sleep due to flying out of ADL.

 

[serfty]

Domestic Oz, I have only ever seen wheelchair economy PAX in aisle seats with lift up armrests.

Posted on a wing and a prayer ...

 

[Ansett]

Have been looking at various websites and most seem to have people of reduced mobility located on Aisle seats. My understanding was that Aisle seats were allocated so that the passenger can easily be sliden in to the seat by lifting the armrests.

 

[Archphoto]

Hmmm, not sure I'd want to be stuck next to someone who couldn't get out of that aisle seat in a hurry because they couldn't walk. . . . . . . .

 

[ozbeachbabe]

Can remember one of the air crash investigation episodes, small commercial passenger plane in the USA, the weight was not distributed properly and when the wheels were raised, up went the nose of the plane and down she came into the airport hanger killing all those on board. There was a fundamental issue with something about the stability of the plane anyway, has flown a few flights since inspection, but it was just this flight where the weight issue tipped the balance literally.

One of the investigators looked into the passenger weight issues, actually called the doctors of all the people who perished and found that on average they were 20 pounds heavier than the estimates used for the passenger weight for the flight. If the people were actually weighed, the plane would have been overloaded and not able to fly unless some passengers or baggage were taken off.

People who's actual weight was in excess of the standard average weight coupled with extra weight of hand luggage. I remember seeing that episode & remember that the maintenance was outsourced & the required checks weren't done on the rigging of the elevator control cables thereby not giving the pilot full control of the elevator which was biased in a noseup attitude.

Like any air crash it's usually down to several factors & despite the plane having flown several sectors prior to the crash, this time it was full flight & despite the pilot's paperwork being correct & the flight appearing it was 'in trim' it wasn't & the centre of gravity was out due to the extra passenger weights. This together with the elevator problem resulted in a fatal crash killing all on board.

I don't know if anyone saw the celebrity who died in a light plane crash in the US or Caribbean, he entourage of 3 or 4 each weighted 300 pounds or so, I wondered if that contributed.

Has never happened to me but if I only had half a seat on a long flight and there was no other option I would ask to be offloaded

That was the singer Aaliyah who was killed in a plane crash in The Bahamas in 2001.

Aaliyah plane was overloaded by hundreds of pounds - CNN

Brings back memories doing admin work in light aviation in remote FNQ delivering supplies to outstations. Everybody on the scales, all luggage on the scales, all supplies on the scales, sit around while pilot works out seats and loading. We did seem to fly a lot of heavy luggage containing "wet clothes" carried by the locals.

"Wet clothes" = "dry community"??? :shock:

That's a good point. On a recent flight a lady in a wheelchair was boarded before everyone else. She was sitting in the aisle. My seat was the window seat. She could not move at all and she was rather large. I had to climb up on to the seat and step onto the middle seat to get to my seat. Without cracking my head on the overhead lockers. Staff just looked on. Thank god I didnt need a loo break. How on earth, can that be deemed safe?

Just about all domestic pax requiring WCHR assistance are seated in the aisle to make it easier to get into & out of the seat. Some opt to sit in the window as long as they can move themsleves across unassisted. It does raise the safety question for the person in the window as it would prevent them getting out in an emergency. The only solution would be to block the window & middle seat (eg on a 737) & have nobody sit there if the person in the wheelchair is not able to move across to the window ie has to sit in the aisle.

That is very bizar. Things might have changed (don't think so but you never know) but I used to work at Special Assistance at BRU airport years ago and wheelchair pax were only allowed to get seats at the window for safety reasons. They would be blocking your way to the emergency exist in case of an emergency.

View attachment 6592

Have been looking at various websites and most seem to have people of reduced mobility located on Aisle seats. My understanding was that Aisle seats were allocated so that the passenger can easily be sliden in to the seat by lifting the armrests.

Definitely a case of YMMV.

 

[UP4014]

Hmmm, not sure I'd want to be stuck next to someone who couldn't get out of that aisle seat in a hurry because they couldn't walk. . . . . . . .

Yes, would have its drawbacks.

If the aircraft door is still open I would get off if no other seat is offered up for me. (easy decision if you're travelling alone)

Matt

 

[Julesmac]

People who's actual weight was in excess of the standard average weight coupled with extra weight of hand luggage. I remember seeing that episode & remember that the maintenance was outsourced & the required checks weren't done on the rigging of the elevator control cables thereby not giving the pilot full control of the elevator which was biased in a noseup attitude.

Like any air crash it's usually down to several factors & despite the plane having flown several sectors prior to the crash, this time it was full flight & despite the pilot's paperwork being correct & the flight appearing it was 'in trim' it wasn't & the centre of gravity was out due to the extra passenger weights. This together with the elevator problem resulted in a fatal crash killing all on board.



That was the singer Aaliyah who was killed in a plane crash in The Bahamas in 2001.

Aaliyah plane was overloaded by hundreds of pounds - CNN



"Wet clothes" = "dry community"??? :shock:



Just about all domestic pax requiring WCHR assistance are seated in the aisle to make it easier to get into & out of the seat. Some opt to sit in the window as long as they can move themsleves across unassisted. It does raise the safety question for the person in the window as it would prevent them getting out in an emergency. The only solution would be to block the window & middle seat (eg on a 737) & have nobody sit there if the person in the wheelchair is not able to move across to the window ie has to sit in the aisle.





Definitely a case of YMMV.

Isn't the issue of the window pax not able to get out past a disabled person in the aisle seat, in the event of an emergency, apply equally to a pax being unable get over a fatty to exit? And how on Earth does one manage on an international flight for loo breaks?

 

[Ansett]

I agree this does seem rather difficult but then if they are located in window seats imagine the effort when they needed to go to the loo

Alos what does YMMV mean. Please excuse my ignorance.

I agree if sat next to a passanger of reduced mobility I would want to be moved to.

 

[kempvet]

Air Midwest Flight 5481 operating as US Airways Express Flight 5481

Yes, this is the episode that I was talking about, where the pax weights were actually 20 lbs over the industry estimated weights