Experience with Australian border controls leaving the country

[flydoc]

I dunno - maybe there is more to this than is reported - but it does seem heavy handed and unfair

'Cruel and unfair': Retired nurse denied COVID-19 travel exemption to care for dying sister

Given only weeks or months to live, Gail Baker's dying wish is for her sister to travel from New Zealand to care for her toward the end of her life. But red tape is preventing her from doing so.

www.abc.net.au

Now approved to travel

Dying wish granted, woman allowed to fly to Australia to care for sister

Gail Baker's dying wish has been granted, with her sister allowed a travel exemption to fly to Australia from New Zealand to care for her in her final days.

www.abc.net.au

 

[p--and--t]

So many years of watching too many US movies and TV shows has many Australians confused thinking they somehow have "rights" enshrined in law. There is no bill of rights, no second amendment and all that stuff we hear nightly with an American accent.

In AU we have a complex interleaved series of laws and declarations that produce the fabric of our border controls both from a customs and immigration/emigration perspective.

While there are underlying published "right to freedom of movement" principles, governments may at any time pass laws and directives to vary those underlying principles.

Right to freedom of movement

The following guidance is designed to assist Commonwealth public officials involved in developing legislation, policy or programs. They have not been prepared for the purposes of informing administrative decision-making.

www.ag.gov.au

The fed gov has and does not infrequently pass laws that limit movement.

Examples include under terrorist legislation defining countries you may not travel to without permission, the ATO and Centrelink can forbid you leaving if you have a debt, the family court can forbid you and/or your kids from leaving, any court can seize your passport or issue orders to prevent you leaving if you are suspected of committing a crime. Child trafficking. Suspected human slavery. Bio-security. Pandemics. There are heaps of examples.

 

[N860CR]

You would probably be surprised then to learn before covid it would happen in an airport in Australia on almost a daily basis.

There is a massive difference between stopping an individual when the relevant authorities have grounds and stopping the movement of every innocent citizen.

 

[FreddyFattler]

Because we then have to deal with the numpties who just want to go away for a holiday and then want to return.

It's not a holiday, it's a humanitarian mission to Thailand to support the impoverished women of Isaan!

 

[drron]

And although the Government can pass a law against visiting Syria and have indeed arrested people for trying to do so many have still gone to Syria whilst that law was in place.

On a different note we have been able to get a Kiwi back to Tasmania.unfortynately his father died 12 hours before his arrival.

and to day a woman and her 2 young children are on their way to Tasmania for the same reason.Of course no WA flights connect to the LST service so they will arrive tomorrow sadly almost certainly being too late.

Though in both cases able to be here for the funeral.

 

[Tusho]

Ok, so after applying again for an exemption, we have finally been granted on to leave the country. I attached:
- Flight tickets
- Rental contract (official naati translation) overseas
- Quote and working order from the movers
- Passports (dual citizens)
- Marriage & Birth certificates

Processing time: 1.5 weeks. Departure date: 21st of May.

My advice if someone needs to plan ahead, book a refundable (or flexible to change dates) ticket that's a few days away. Apply, once granted change the tickets to whenever you want to fly. In that way you will have certainty.

 

[Blanchy]

Ok, so after applying again for an exemption, we have finally been granted on to leave the country. I attached:
- Flight tickets
- Rental contract (official naati translation) overseas
- Quote and working order from the movers
- Passports (dual citizens)
- Marriage & Birth certificates

Processing time: 1.5 weeks. Departure date: 21st of May.

My advice if someone needs to plan ahead, book a refundable (or flexible to change dates) ticket that's a few days away. Apply, once granted change the tickets to whenever you want to fly. In that way you will have certainty.

So it doesn't matter if you do not have the specified flight number on the exemption? It can be a totally different one?

 

[Tusho]

The way I understood this, yes. Here what home affairs had to say about it:
"You do not need to re-apply for permission to depart if your flight details change, unless the departure airport changes."

 

[Flashback]

Sometime when a border issa closed then you cannot entah

 

[glasszon]

The way I understood this, yes. Here what home affairs had to say about it:
"You do not need to re-apply for permission to depart if your flight details change, unless the departure airport changes."

I might be a bit too cautious but I wouldn't recommend anyone to book a flight purely to seek an exemption with the view of changing the flight dates further down the line. I think that clause is in place as they understand flights get cancelled all the time so they don't want people to reapply if the airline moved the flight by a day.

It won't be pleasant arguing with the ABF if they felt you have gamed the system by booking a flight that you have no intention of taking and deny you boarding on the day.

 

[Tusho]

I might be a bit too cautious but I wouldn't recommend anyone to book a flight purely to seek an exemption with the view of changing the flight dates further down the line. I think that clause is in place as they understand flights get cancelled all the time so they don't want people to reapply if the airline moved the flight by a day.

It won't be pleasant arguing with the ABF if they felt you have gamed the system by booking a flight that you have no intention of taking and deny you boarding on the day.

I agree on that. However, when asking Home Affairs on how I could speed up the process as I don't want to be in a position where I cancel my lease to move, then find out I get rejected and don't have a home she said I have to wait. She also said I can change my flight once granted approval. When then asking her whether the only choice I have to be sure is to book a flight in 3-4 days, get a confirmation (as they prioritise based on departure date) and then change my flight, she said that is correct. It depends on your risk profile, I guess. But this process that was established is far from perfect and therefore warrants for you to create your own loopholes, in my opinion.

 

[CaptJCool]

. But this process that was established is far from perfect and therefore warrants for you to create your own loopholes, in my opinion.

Dial 1-800-LOOP-HOLE

 

[Gremlin]

To be fair, it’s a policy that has been put together in haste for obvious reasons. I’m not surprised that there have been some issues.

 

[davistev]

Our family had plans to move back to the USA , but we are dual citizens and therefore feel "stuck" in Australia due to the travel ban. We are currently renting a house so we can provide our rental contract ended and we own our house in the USA. We are unable to provide new job contracts in the USA as I do not need to work straight away. We will not be moving anything to the USA.

I think we may not be granted an exemption to leave. Anyone else in a similiar situation and what was the outcome?

 

[Mousey]

Our family had plans to move back to the USA , but we are dual citizens and therefore feel "stuck" in Australia due to the travel ban. We are currently renting a house so we can provide our rental contract ended and we own our house in the USA. We are unable to provide new job contracts in the USA as I do not need to work straight away. We will not be moving anything to the USA.

I think we may not be granted an exemption to leave. Anyone else in a similiar situation and what was the outcome?

I am not in a similar situation, but just a suggestion - perhaps if you have any evidence of these prior plans - like any text messages discussing it, or if you can get notarised statements from friends/family that you had discussed this intent, it could help? Providing evidence of everything you state, is the key - so if you don't need to work straight away, that's a reasonable proposition, if you can back it up with a certain balance in your bank account. Think like a lawyer! You will not be moving anything to USA? Then show photographs of your house content in USA which has everything you need. Etc.

 

[PineappleSkip]

Davstrev, I thnk you are right, you have a weak case. It’s clear that they are not paying much regard to “I’m gunnna” evdence without some independent corroboration. I think this is pretty compelling.

We will not be moving anything to the USA.

Yeah, but they would want independent evidence that you are moving. You could go to a TA, dummy up a OW booking, and put your claim up based on that, but I would be disinclined to put any money down.

cheers skip

 

[N860CR]

you have a weak case

Incredible that we’d even be using terms like this for wanting to leave the country! Really scary precedent

 

[Pushka]

Incredible that we’d even be using terms like this for wanting to leave the country! Really scary precedent

Yes. When the Do Not Travel alert went on it never occurred to me that this prevented travel out of the country. I thought you could still travel but at your own risk completely.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Yes. When the Do Not Travel alert went on it never occurred to me that this prevented travel out of the country. I thought you could still travel but at your own risk completely.

That's a good question. I'm not sure the two are necessarily related? 'Do not travel' is an advice, issued by smartraveller. You can still travel when the advice is in place, but at your own risk. The ban on travel is separate: the Biosecurity (Human Biosecurity Emergency) (Human Coronavirus with Pandemic Potential) (Overseas Travel Ban Emergency Requirements) Determination 2020 and made under the Biosecurity Act 2015.

 

[Pushka]

That's a good question. I'm not sure the two are necessarily related? 'Do not travel' is an advice, issued by smartraveller. You can still travel when the advice is in place, but at your own risk. The ban on travel is separate: the Biosecurity (Human Biosecurity Emergency) (Human Coronavirus with Pandemic Potential) (Overseas Travel Ban Emergency Requirements) Determination 2020 and made under the Biosecurity Act 2015.

Ah. Thankyou. That explains it.