Denied seat recline on long haul

[Deleted member]

Vegetarians are always fussy people

I can't believe that, I am sure if you go to dinner at the home of a vegetarian they will prepare a nice juicy rare steak for you and some tofu burgers for themselves ......


It is I, Leclerc !

 

[Deleted member]

I have always been in the habit of asking the pax behind me if I am okay to recline (or at least notifying them of my intentions). This hasn't been an issue before, however, I was recently denied that request by the pax behind me and I was at a loss as to what to do. I have always felt that it is polite to notify the person behind of your intentions but this experience has made me reconsider that.

QF108. Meal service is over and trays have long been cleared. I've been watching IFE for a good 30 minutes and decide its time to doze off. I turn around and see that pax behind me is working on her laptop. I kindly inform her that "I am just going to put my seat back a little". She responds curtly with "No, I am still working". And that was that. Never have I had my request denied before (and I only ever recline on mid-long haul). A number of responses flicked through my head: I could just sleep without reclining and avoid confrontation, I could go ahead with the recline, or I could ram the seat back and recline all the way in response to her (what I considered) rudeness. In the end, I am not one for unnecessary confrontation, so I decided not to recline. In hindsight, I probably should have reclined. I already didn't like this pax as she had harassed the crew multiple times for a vegetarian meal when she had not requested one. (They ended up providing her with one from the J cabin).

What would you do?

I just recline, but then , since I got older and wiser ( and discovered the joys of J) I don't have that issue anymore


It is I, Leclerc !

 

[JohnK]

All the evidence suggests this is providing comfort, and ~100% of passengers doing this on a long haul flight would seem to back that up

And I have yet to see that on my flights. I think the number is closer to ~50% and if it gets higher it is due to the cascade effect.

Must make a point to check closely on my next long haul flight.

 

[Blinky]

Unless I am sitting in J, nobody can recline in front of me. It's not that I'm a tool about it, it's just not physically possible given that when sitting in a normal QF/VA/JQ Y seat, my knees are squarely lodged against the seat in front of me. The person in front usually tries, then gives up.

On the few occasions they persist, I politely say "Excuse me, unfortunately I've got long legs and my knees are right up against the back of the seat. Please stop trying to crush my legs," and that usually sorts them out.

Only one time have the other pax gotten obstreperous and then I simply ignored them, pinged the CA and said "The gentleman in front insists on continually trying to recline his seat, which won't work because of the length of my legs. Can you either move them or move me? Or tell them to stop trying to crush my legs," and the CA told the person to stop being disruptive and pointed out that the flight was only BNE-SYD and surely they could remain upright for 45 minutes in the air.

I'm sorry, but I simply don't believe that you can't lower you knees, particularly if you reclined your seat. So I put you in the childishly antagonistic class as well. I personally wouldn't make an issue on a short haul flight, but on long haul I would insist on my right to recline, and would also suggest that if you didn't like it you could have booked an exit row seat, or sat up the front.

 

[Pushka]

I can deal with people reclining their seats. That, while potentially uncomfortable for me, is their right. What I hate are those who use the head rest of my seat as their lever, so that the head rest disappears and then bounces back to hit me in the head. And then they grab it again.

PS. I don't usually recline for day flights less than four hours. I have had a disc removed from my back and know that sitting upright causes more issues than at an angle. Sitting generally causes more issues for your back than any other position.

 

[amaroo]

I can deal with people reclining their seats. That, while potentially uncomfortable for me, is their right. What I hate are those who use the head rest of my seat as their lever, so that the head rest disappears and then bounces back to hit me in the head. And then they grab it again.

Seems AFF is populated with a few members that wouldn't hesitate to inflict a whiplash manoeuvre on an unsuspecting passenger.

 

[JohnK]

What I hate are those who use the head rest of my seat as their lever, so that the head rest disappears and then bounces back to hit me in the head.

And you think that action is intentional to inflict pain on you?

How do you propose a 71 year old get out of a premium economy window seat with the seat in front fully reclined? Must make sure that everyone on the aircraft is inconvenienced so the recliner can have a comfortable flight exercising their right of a comfortable flight.

I keep saying it all about me, me, me, me and me again attitude. Keep convincing yourselves that you are right but you could not be further from reality.

And medhead please rejoin debate because these recliners do not make any sense....

 

[MEL_Traveller]

And you think that action is intentional to inflict pain on you?

How do you propose a 71 year old get out of a premium economy window seat with the seat in front fully reclined? Must make sure that everyone on the aircraft is inconvenienced so the recliner can have a comfortable flight exercising their right of a comfortable flight.

I keep saying it all about me, me, me, me and me again attitude. Keep convincing yourselves that you are right but you could not be further from reality.

And medhead please rejoin debate because these recliners do not make any sense....

you ask how we propose a 71 year old get out from a window seat when the person in front is reclined? I would imagine it would be the same way my 77 (yes nearly 80) year old mother got out from her window seat in premium economy when the person in front was reclined. the person next to my mother stood in the aisle, my mother, using the back of her seat then the back of her neighbour's seat, moved across into the aisle. and the same in reverse.

that's how I would propose it's done.

my mother puts her seat in the upright position when she leaves the seat in case the person behind her wants to take the advantage of the extra space to also hop out into the aisle or do whatever else they might want to do.

on return my mother reclines her seat and goes back to sleep.

if my (now supposedly 'aged and in need of some sort of special assistance because she is older than 71') mother can do it, so can a 71 year old.

 

[Mal Ware]

Unless I am sitting in J, nobody can recline in front of me. It's not that I'm a tool about it, it's just not physically possible given that when sitting in a normal QF/VA/JQ Y seat, my knees are squarely lodged against the seat in front of me. The person in front usually tries, then gives up.

On the few occasions they persist, I politely say "Excuse me, unfortunately I've got long legs and my knees are right up against the back of the seat. Please stop trying to crush my legs," and that usually sorts them out.

Only one time have the other pax gotten obstreperous and then I simply ignored them, pinged the CA and said "The gentleman in front insists on continually trying to recline his seat, which won't work because of the length of my legs. Can you either move them or move me? Or tell them to stop trying to crush my legs," and the CA told the person to stop being disruptive and pointed out that the flight was only BNE-SYD and surely they could remain upright for 45 minutes in the air.

I wasn't going to post anymore in this thread, but when I read this HONEST post, I decided I would.

What you described is pretty much my situation as well, sitting upright in a normal seat my knees are either almost touching or touching the seat in front, if a person reclines it goes directly onto my knees.

I don't know how these people around over 6"2 and above can say they dont mind people reclining on them, either they are contortionists or not exactly sure how tall they are.

Good to see the FA used common sense in your example above. That person is probably still grumbling about it.

 

[straitman]

I don't know how these people around over 6"2 and above can say they dont mind people reclining on them, either they are contortionists or not exactly sure how tall they are.

The answer to that is easy and has been pointed out a number of times. It all depends upon which part of the body is tall. If the hips to the knees is very long then there is a problem. If it is short then not such a big deal. For example my two sisters are both the same height but their waist height is quite different. One has long legs and a shorter body and the other the reverse.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I wasn't going to post anymore in this thread, but when I read this HONEST post, I decided I would.

What you described is pretty much my situation as well, sitting upright in a normal seat my knees are either almost touching or touching the seat in front, if a person reclines it goes directly onto my knees.

I don't know how these people around over 6"2 and above can say they dont mind people reclining on them, either they are contortionists or not exactly sure how tall they are.

Good to see the FA used common sense in your example above. That person is probably still grumbling about it.

We don't have the details of which airline this was, but if it was QF or DJ then the cabin attendant acted inappropriately and is not in a position to unilaterally alter the advertised and paid-for product. Both QF and DJ promote seat recline as part of their seat specification.

JQ does not (referring only to comfort through 'adjustable headrests'). If a tall passenger is on JQ they are there at their own peril! Seat pitch is advertised 'from' 28' (which would be knee crushing for just about anyone unless you start to employ ultra slimline seats such as those used by LH for example).

It's not so much a case of very tall people 'not minding' when the person in front of us reclines. It is a case of living with the choice we have made to fly in economy and accepting that if the person in front reclines we need to deal with that. After all - if it's only a 45 minute flight right?

 

[sumthinfornuthin]

I agree that people have the right to recline their seats as far as they want, just as the person in the row behind has the right to put their hand on the back of the headrest to support themselves as they climb over the sleeping person next to them, trying not to wake them up.

if the fully reclined PAX in front gets woken up...then tough, obviously the airlines provide these fully reclined seat/headrests to aid people when they need to get out.

The people behind can do it so it must be okay....right ??

 

[11sjw]

I

I don't know how these people around over 6"2 and above can say they dont mind people reclining on them, either they are contortionists or not exactly sure how tall they are.

I hit the 6'2" mark on the number. I haven't had a problem on QF PER-East Coast trips although I copped it on the head once when leaning forward to pick up a pen . Even with a small laptop I can still work when a seat is reclined, it used to be a problem with the 15" clunker I used to use but the new 13" Ultrabooks are great.

Jetstar is another story. My knees touch the seat in front as soon as I sit down however QF I have an inch or two spare which usually accommodates the recline.

 

[mannej]

I think at 28inches, the majority of people don't fit into JQ seats.

 

[Justchecking]

To the OP, you were informing her, not asking her permission. Regardless of what she said I would have reclined anyway. You've done her the courtesy most people never bother with, good on you for being a nice neighbour.

 

[Justchecking]

What is it with vegetarians?!? They (okay not all, but al lot) would have to be some of the most annoying people ever.

I have to admit the only person I ever had a serious confrontation with was a vegetarian. She was all put out because the food place I worked in did not cater to her 'special needs' and demanded we change our menu in the future..... I've long considered that protein deficiency makes people irritable and mean. Besides isnt it more fashionable these days to be gluten intolerant when seeking attention?

 

[Daver6]

How do you propose a 71 year old get out of a premium economy window seat with the seat in front fully reclined? Must make sure that everyone on the aircraft is inconvenienced so the recliner can have a comfortable flight exercising their right of a comfortable flight.

Perhaps book an aisle seat so it isn't an issue in the first place?

 

[Justchecking]

I've never understood people who insist that reclining a seat is somehow wrong or can only be done on flights over a certain number of hours, on a full moon after the autumn equinox. I mean seriously, it's like trying to ban someone from using the toilet because it's only a 1hr flight and in your opinion they 'should' be able to hold onto it. If you want to control what the rest of the cabin does you'd better charter your own flight.

While we're at it, I'd like it if no-one ever sat next to me on a train, I never had to overhear anyone else's phone conversations when in public ever again and the whole world changed it's axis just because. There's a difference between what we can reasonably expect and what we just have to accept. I am never bothered by anyone reclining their seat.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

If you want to control what the rest of the cabin does you'd better charter your own flight.

nail on the head!! this is about control! And not having someone else do something to you over which you don't have control.

 

[Trashy]

I've never understood people who insist that reclining a seat is somehow wrong or can only be done on flights over a certain number of hours, on a full moon after the autumn equinox. I mean seriously, it's like trying to ban someone from using the toilet because it's only a 1hr flight and in your opinion they 'should' be able to hold it.

I've never understood how people fail to recognise that by reclining you're significantly impacting on the personal space of the person behind you, and therefore reclining without at least some consideration for your fellow passengers is the height of rudeness.

Whether someone needs to go to the bathroom has no impact on anyone else (short of them staying in there the whole flight, in which case I pity them) and by comparing the two you may as well be comparing apples and oranges. You're trying to use reductio ad absurdum logic, which is just as ridiculous as the comparison you drew