death of a ff member

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kerry

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Hi,

I am asking for help - a family friend died last year with over 400,000 qantas points. They were taken back when qantas were notified of his death. I know this is all in the rules.

We have been told that recently an australian TV program addressed this with qantas and after some convincing the points were given back to the family.

Does anybody know anything about this?

Would love to help my friend and her three children to have a much needed holiday with points.

Thanks
 
AMX001595_Travel-Insider_1100x260

N860CR

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After Channel 7 had their disgraceful Today Tonight "program" air a story on the issue, Qantas gave the person in question a free holiday to the Gold Coast, they didn't hand the points back.
 

serfty

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kerry said:
Hi,

I am asking for help - a family friend died last year with over 400,000 qantas points. They were taken back when qantas were notified of his death. I know this is all in the rules.
...
G'day Kerrie welcome to AFF. :)

While it would be nice to help your friend, with the program's T&Cs, a member's points become void when they die.

There is a thread on the issue you referred to here: Qantas story on Today Tonight last night?

As mentioned, they did not get the points reinstated; Qantas arranged flight for the family to the Gold Coast and accommodation (IIRC). It is unlikely Qantas will be so generous again.
 

Tiki

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If you have a lot of points or your family member does, I would advise you to leave your password available somewhere so if anything happens to the main FF member, the family can use the password to book flights. Better the family have them than the airline!
 

kerry

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thank you all for your input - didn't think it would be that easy.
The deceased had actually told his family ro do exactly what was suggested in this thead - but it was so quick (9 weeks) that that was forgotten by all until it was too late.
 

kerry

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ok - so just an out there thought. Do most people agree that it would be 'ok' to give details to family members so that if you die tomorrow your points 'that you have paid for and earnt' can be used by your family rather than being returned to aircraft carrier/qantas?
I still don't get why they/qantas take the points back when in fact the ff card holder has earnt them via paying for them it is not a reward scheme deal.
Kerry
 

Febs

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Tiki said:
the family can use the password to book flights.

Probably easier to do a family transfer (provided one hadn't been done in the previous 12 months) - instant and painless, and can be done online. :)

kerry said:
I still don't get why they/qantas take the points back

Because they can, and because it's in the T&C's. :(

Cheers,
- Febs.
 

dajop

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kerry said:
Do most people agree that it would be 'ok' to give details to family members so that if you die tomorrow your points 'that you have paid for and earnt' can be used by your family rather than being returned to aircraft carrier/qantas?

My partner has my details, and indeed uses the "my bookings" section to keep track of where & when I'm going places! I think it makes sense to give details to family members. Can't say it's OK as it is against the T&C ;)

Maybe for QF there's an opportunity for "insurance", say 5,000 pts per annum and the points will be preserved for a family member to use upon death.
 

oz_mark

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kerry said:
ok - so just an out there thought. Do most people agree that it would be 'ok' to give details to family members so that if you die tomorrow your points 'that you have paid for and earnt' can be used by your family rather than being returned to aircraft carrier/qantas?
I still don't get why they/qantas take the points back when in fact the ff card holder has earnt them via paying for them it is not a reward scheme deal.
Kerry

Membership belongs to an individual, not to a family. When that individual dies, then it no longer belongs to anyone. Qantas thus cancel the points.
 

acampbel

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oz_mark said:
Membership belongs to an individual, not to a family. When that individual dies, then it no longer belongs to anyone. Qantas thus cancel the points.

Using that logic, when I die the bank will cancel my account and take all my money.

Putting something in your T&Cs does not make it right ... just makes it easier to get away with it.


Cheers,

The Immortal Andrew (as far as QFF is concerned).

.
 

NM

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Febs said:
Probably easier to do a family transfer (provided one hadn't been done in the previous 12 months) - instant and painless, and can be done online. :)
But limited to 100K per year. So if the member had >100K points it will take a few years to complete the transfer process.
 

oz_mark

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acampbel said:
Using that logic, when I die the bank will cancel my account and take all my money.

Putting something in your T&Cs does not make it right ... just makes it easier to get away with it.

Can't say I see it this way. For one thing they don't take the points back, they cancel them - money doesn't get cancelled.

The alternative for QF would be to put your points (with no monetary value) into the estate. The account would then get frozen while it was decided what to do with them. Seems like an administrative pain.
 

ColinP

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What I don't understand about the cancellation of membership and forfeiture of points is ----- If a member dies, how does Qantas know about it unless someone tells them? (and why would you?)
I'm sure they don't monitor the death notices in the newspapers.

NM pointed out that if the deceased had a large points balance it would take quite a few years to do a family transfer but there's nothing to stop surviving family members booking award flights for themselves. (As suggested by Tiki)

As I see it the solution is simple. If a family member dies, don't tell Qantas. I can't see that it would be high on your priority list at such a distressing time anyhow.
 

turbo

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acampbel said:
Using that logic, when I die the bank will cancel my account and take all my money.

Putting something in your T&Cs does not make it right ... just makes it easier to get away with it.


Cheers,

The Immortal Andrew (as far as QFF is concerned).

.

Well said, no offence to oz_mark, but as with a bank, the points (or deposits held) are a liability to them and should be reported as such in their accounts, entities can't just exempt themselves of liability because the earner passed away.

They should be recognised as an asset of the estate as they represented a future econonic benefit for the use of the earner, and hence the estate.

But as you say, it's not right just because its in the T&C's, just easier to get away with so long as no one whinges too loudly.
 

Reggie

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ColinP said:
As I see it the solution is simple. If a family member dies, don't tell Qantas. I can't see that it would be high on your priority list at such a distressing time anyhow.

Thats exactly what my mates mother did when her husband passed away. There was over 500K points in the account and she continued to use them for herself and her children and their partners. The account was being used so the points didn't expire. Qantas never worked it out
 

NM

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Hmm, I wonder if QF did a scan of all their member's account looking for possible deceased persons, they would be likely to think I died about the time I reached Lifetime Gold status. Since then I have not had any earned points but have had several points redemptions. As you can imagine, to reach LTG means I had few periods of inactivity from an earning perspective. All that suddenly stopped with only some points burning activity since.
 
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Reggie

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NM said:
Hmm, I wonder if QF did a scan of all their member's account looking for possible deceased persons, they would be likely to think I died about the time I reached Lifetime Gold status. Since then I have not had any earned points but have had several points redemptions. As you can imagine, to reach LTG means I had few periods of inactivity from an earning perspective. All that suddenly stopped with only some points burning activity since.

Now you mention it NM, I was starting to wonder if this was really you the last few months, or if your wife had taken over your alias to continue the role of moderator.:D
 

NM

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Reggie said:
Now you mention it NM, I was starting to wonder if this was really you the last few months, or if your wife had taken over your alias to continue the role of moderator.:D
She knows all my passwords .... except for the bank account :p .
 

Reggie

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NM said:
She knows all my passwords .... except for the bank account :p .

Mine knows none of them because she isn't interested, but after this thread I told her what my QFF password is and told her to not say a word to Qantas.
 

JohnK

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ColinP said:
If a member dies, how does Qantas know about it unless someone tells them? (and why would you?)
I'm sure they don't monitor the death notices in the newspapers.
Not wanting to arouse too much suspicion or encouragement and continue to discuss something as serious as this on a public forum, I wouldn't inform anyone of anything and continue to transfer points after death until all FF points were transferred. Now if this happened to take 20 years and I got away it then tough luck!

ColinP said:
As I see it the solution is simple. If a family member dies, don't tell Qantas. I can't see that it would be high on your priority list at such a distressing time anyhow.
Unless it was beneficial to them, I could not understand why anyone in their right mind would inform an airline that someone has died.

Call me honest John!
 
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