Business class - worth the points?

[Masonic Phantom]

Hi all

I have been fortunate to have travelled is a number of times including a 140000 Qantas point redemption around the world last year.

However there is one thing I have not done and that is fly business class internationally. A lot of people on the forums rave on about how you can get a seat that normally costs several thousand dollars by using points or upgrading.

However from my perspective it means outlaying double the number of points for a trip to say Paris. I could either have 2 economy tickets to Paris or just 1 business class seat.

Putting aside the fact that business class seats are normally very expensive is it really worth double the point usage to get a business class seat? If so, why?

That aside does having a business class seat reduce the risk of dvt?

Cheers Peter

.

Click Bate!!

 

[Junes]

I think I have this sorted: the bed is good but not for the $$$. Talking Qantas International (to Europe a couple of times a year) I alway book (pay for) PE, I reinstated Qantas Club late last year which ensures lounge access, priority checking etc, baggage allowance, and I maintain Silver status. And apply for a points Business upgrade when that suits me. Qantas PE is comfortable and the cabin crew are invariably courteous and thoughtful (unlike other airlines' PE that I've sampled). Business is icing on the cake. Am very uncomfortable with the term 'cattle class' comrades, but yes on longhaul it's horrible.

 

[foggy]

This question has prompted me to calculate how much $ value in gift cards I could have exchanged for if I opted to pay for an economy ticket and used my points redeeming giftcards instead.

with westpac altitude syd - sin -pvg return on business (krisflyer) i am paying around $1200 worth of gift cards
with AMEX ascent syd - sin -pvg return on business (krisflyer) i am paying around $700.

And we usually travel as a family of 5. Damn it is making feel like I should fly direct in Y instead..

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I think I have this sorted: the bed is good but not for the $$$. Talking Qantas International (to Europe a couple of times a year) I alway book (pay for) PE, I reinstated Qantas Club late last year which ensures lounge access, priority checking etc, baggage allowance, and I maintain Silver status. And apply for a points Business upgrade when that suits me. Qantas PE is comfortable and the cabin crew are invariably courteous and thoughtful (unlike other airlines' PE that I've sampled). Business is icing on the cake. Am very uncomfortable with the term 'cattle class' comrades, but yes on longhaul it's horrible.

What is your average price for PE return?

 

[daft009]

For me personally, premium economy hits the sweet spot for anything over 5-6hrs.
I used PE to travel to Germany this year and it was great. actually slept on the flight, food (book the cook on SQ) was good.

For lounges I used priority pass and had a couple of showers after arriving so I could go straight to my meetings and then on the return before boarding on the way back.

For a 4-5hr flight I shall stick to economy for now

 

[Denali]

I begrudge using points for domestic for the east coast but its either that or sit in Y and honestly, we do not want to sit in Y again.

Last night I blew about 60K points for Sydney/Melb/Hobart flights, plus a couple of the $129 Virgin Money vouchers (didnt think I was going to get to use them).

We did SYD>LAX a few years ago in PE with VA and I preferred it over the old J seats, which I hated with a passion. Going to LAX again in March in the new flats. I found the new VA J seats a bit squishy (comparing it to SQ J) but its still better than anything in Y so not complaining!

 

[burmans]

What is your average price for PE return?

Very good question, as it sets a benchmark for what you are prepared to pay. In my experience use of the ways to get points I've learnt from AFF and FT have meant I've travelled business for less than the price of a PE (paid) ticket and in some cases not much more than a Y ticket. So for me, absolutely worth it but it does depend on your average cost of those points.

 

[coco50]

Very good question, as it sets a benchmark for what you are prepared to pay. In my experience use of the ways to get points I've learnt from AFF and FT have meant I've travelled business for less than the price of a PE (paid) ticket and in some cases not much more than a Y ticket. So for me, absolutely worth it but it does depend on your average cost of those points.

I am prepared to pay for business with a requested upgrade to F (if available) for comfort reasons. If I can get a tax deduction for the price, so much the better. It's great being a sole trader author because it's easier to justify travel as a tax deductible expense and it keeps the government's hands off my hard-earned royalties

 

[MEL_Traveller]

For me personally, premium economy hits the sweet spot for anything over 5-6hrs.
I used PE to travel to Germany this year and it was great. actually slept on the flight, food (book the cook on SQ) was good.

For lounges I used priority pass and had a couple of showers after arriving so I could go straight to my meetings and then on the return before boarding on the way back.

For a 4-5hr flight I shall stick to economy for now

I have the same question... how much did you pay for your PE return?

 

[landl]

I agree - once you fly J it's extremely hard to go back. Definitely would not waste points on J or Y Domestic. Also not for straight return overseas. IMO best value is in OW RTW. Halfway through booking my 2nd x 2 atm. All points from credit cards.

 

[NZflygirl]

I am actually trying to find the cheapest most comfortable way to fly mainly so if we had to buy tickets last minute I know who to use. My partner hates paying for anything above Y but also doesn't like being squished. Paying for exit seats is cheaper than paying for PE or J.

I don't mind NZ's 2 seaters down the back of the plane on the 777 or upgrading to PE esp the 789 cabin. They have a one up process you can use.
Trying Scoot biz soon and I suspect that will trump SQ Y and PE for me. I read you can pay to upgrade also for not much. SYD/MEL flights up are day anyway. But I'm flying the red eye just to challenge it.
I think Y on EK was ok which really relates back to the fact the A380s are the way to go if flying Y. About to try QRs A380 upper deck Y in May which I suspect will be a winner.
A330 2-4-2 seating is pretty good for jumping out over people (I'm a window flyer).
And EY I think are great for paying to upgrade the long haul leg for nowhere near the full cost of J. Just fly out of BNE/PER (hopefully less competition for upgrades).
Don't discount sale fares either in J. These can be good. (But yes Y is typically on sale too).
Otherwise you can split your long trip into smaller and lots more legs in Y with stop overs to make it more tolerable but this sometimes is more expensive than Y direct on sale.

Some FFPs like NZ, VA, QR, AA give you upgrades to use each yr so you have to use them or lose them. Other FFP like QF, SQ you use your points. So if they're complimentary they're worth using.

I do fly some J which is mainly work related but the personal is mainly sale related flights (hate paying more than whats required), and aim to fly some F as a treat now and then but via points or upgrades.

I was lucky enough to have the row to myself in Y last November and it honestly felt like I'd won the lottery. I was very happy to have lie flat in Y. It's probably infrequent but its great if you do receive this. My dad came on a work trip and we were supposed to swap Y and J legs but he buggared up the plan and flew J on one leg only. He is very good at falling asleep sitting up!! I checked in on him a few times and he said he was ok. If he can do it then there isn't any way I should be complaining. Majority of people fly Y and I guess on the odd occasion I share my flying experiences with friends I'd like to be able to talk about Y long haul also. Even though I fly mostly Y domestically and TT east coast.

I believe Y has its place and I'm excited to try and find the best of it.

 

[daft009]

I have the same question... how much did you pay for your PE return?

it was a last(ish) minute work trip (self employed) and I had to hit the ground running. 4 countries in 16 days. paid ~$4500 for a Sydney-Munich return via Singapore Airlines. Went to the other countries from Singapore as they were all based in Asia so traveled normal economy on separate bookings (Colombo, Jakarta & Singapore itself)

 

[Warks]

Having flown J a reasonable amount when the shareholders were footing the bill but never since I have to disagree that you "can never go back". I couldn't believe the fares my company used to pay for OS trips. I used to manage one or two a year at best whereas more senior people were doing up to a dozen. No wonder there was never any money for pay increases or decent bonuses. Most of these trips were unnecessary anyway (except mine of course!)

I love the idea of J flying but when I weigh up the cost it really isn't worth it. When your airfare costs as much as the next two weeks' accommodation (or more) I can't see the value. Mind you, if I was wealthy enough not to care I'd stump up the cash in a flash. But having said that SYD-LAX is a doddle. With decent IFE and getting up regularly I don't find it too taxing. As I get older I find time seems to fly by so 14 hours is nothing much, four or five movies and it's over. QFF points aren't worth using for Y fares as many have noted but I would guess that upgrading an expensive Y fare to J is worth it. But who buys expensive Y fares? I chase the cheapest direct flights I can get and then have more dough to spend when I'm away.

But you are all free to spend your money as you will, you earned it, it's yours.

 

[leadman]

I couldn't believe the fares my company used to pay for OS trips. I used to manage one or two a year at best whereas more senior people were doing up to a dozen. No wonder there was never any money for pay increases or decent bonuses. Most of these trips were unnecessary anyway (except mine of course!)

Yes I can remember the halcyon days of the metals boom, companies would not even blink when F/J flights were with QF when others were so much cheaper. A group of us started to fly CX as the connections were better to China until we were told by that wonderful division of HR, that QF was the preferred airline even though we were saving over $3,000 per trip back 10 - 15 years ago. (It was the same department that released the travel policy saying that we could not fly on any airlines of India and China in those respective companies. When informed that QF doesn't fly local routes we were told to catch trains!! Never did)

 

[drron]

Of course it is worth it to use points to fly premium cabins.Advertised fares are nothing to do with the value aspect.
I just did a redemption in SQ F SIN-NRT-LAX.The points were transferred from Amex.If used to pay off my Amex bill the points would be worth $650.Plus $450 taxes.So return in F would cost me $2200.
Now if you Buy Y on SQ's Aussie site it is $2571.Though pricing on the Thai site was $1124 + I guess some CC conversion fee.So is F worth slightly less than Y?
B...... Oath it is.

 

[landl]

Having flown J a reasonable amount when the shareholders were footing the bill but never since I have to disagree that you "can never go back". I couldn't believe the fares my company used to pay for OS trips. I used to manage one or two a year at best whereas more senior people were doing up to a dozen. No wonder there was never any money for pay increases or decent bonuses. Most of these trips were unnecessary anyway (except mine of course!)

I love the idea of J flying but when I weigh up the cost it really isn't worth it. When your airfare costs as much as the next two weeks' accommodation (or more) I can't see the value. Mind you, if I was wealthy enough not to care I'd stump up the cash in a flash. But having said that SYD-LAX is a doddle. With decent IFE and getting up regularly I don't find it too taxing. As I get older I find time seems to fly by so 14 hours is nothing much, four or five movies and it's over. QFF points aren't worth using for Y fares as many have noted but I would guess that upgrading an expensive Y fare to J is worth it. But who buys expensive Y fares? I chase the cheapest direct flights I can get and then have more dough to spend when I'm away.

But you are all free to spend your money as you will, you earned it, it's yours.

I think though that most of this discussion is about using points to pay for J. I couldn't afford to pay cash although I'm interested to find out more about the purchase of miles that some have mentioned. That sounds like a reasonable option.

 

[Jacksond]

I'm having a hard time not upgrading to J on a Virgin flight from Melb to Hobart! A bit excessive I guess. I'll just pay for lounge access instead. No more Y on overseas trips for sure.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I think though that most of this discussion is about using points to pay for J. I couldn't afford to pay cash although I'm interested to find out more about the purchase of miles that some have mentioned. That sounds like a reasonable option.

lots of information here in AFF about buying miles. First step is to join a couple of programs... lifemiles (avianca airlines) and united airlines would be my recommendations. Both are free to join.

then do some reading here on AFF while you wait for the first bonus offer to come in. Current pricing including all taxes is around $1550 to Asia business class, and $3800-4000 return to Europe and USA.

 

[Muriel]

Hi Peter, I think much depends on the length of your journey - and your age. I have flown economy internationally to UK/Europe many times in my younger years, taking a few days stop over en-route to break the journey. We have also managed a couple of round the world trips in business class using points. However, now in my later years, I absolutely prefer to travel business class on any flight over 9 hours. The benefit of arriving at your destination feeling rested and well looked after, far outweighs the points cost. On one of out trips, we used Qantas partner airlines and when we arrived in London, were able to check in to the "arrivals" lounge, rest, have breakfast and a free massage, before catching an onward flight. Not sure about business class reducing the risk of dvt. Maybe that has much to do with an individual's current state of health, wearing elastic stockings during the flight, or getting up frequently and doing exercises. If you fly, say, to London, cheap flights to most parts of Europe including Paris are generally available - or take the Eurostar train one way, a great experience. You can buy cheap advance purchase seats in either first or 2nd class. Go 1st if you can. The journey is under 3 hours. Keep travelling - and enjoy!

 

[Dalmunzie]

Hi
Have you tried using Frequent Flyer Solutions ? I know this doesn't directly answer your question but it may be helpful when deciding the value of J vs Y
They came up with some amazing deals for me in Oct for a mid Dec trip to the UK in J.
Their Report back to me was not simply an email with a few options, but a full blown PDF Report detailing what they had done, what the result of those activities were and then their recommendations.
Sure, it does cost a wee bit to use them but that is money well spent for a totally professional job.mm