Australian living overseas. Is the grass greener?

[clazman]

The decision would be hard depending on if you plan to stay overseas or eventually return to Australia

No ideas what happens with the following

- Superannuation
- Government pensions
- Taxes on return

 

[bam71]

Isn't that only now that you are back in Aus? If you were still living in Abu Dhabi all year round you wouldn't pay tax on non Australian income. Also comes down to where you spend the majority of the year. If you spend more than 6 months in Australia you are considered a resident for tax need to pay.

Say i moved to Asia and rented my place out in Aus. I would only pay local tax and tax on the income from the rental back in Aus.

Our advise is they can still come after you. As such, we haven't done our tax for 2015/2016 yet - we need further advise on it and the best way to approach it.
https://www.ato.gov.au/individuals/international-tax-for-individuals/going-overseas/
Because we returned after only six months, even though it was not our original intent, they can ask us to pay the tax on the overseas income, even AFTER we had changed our residency status. Our argument will be that we did not PLAN on doing this, but we'll need professional advise on how to go about it. The question boils down to were we living overseas and the intent was to remain overseas, in which case no tax is payable, or were we just working overseas with intent to return, in which case tax is payable. its on a case by case basis.

 

[dajop]

The decision would be hard depending on if you plan to stay overseas or eventually return to Australia

No ideas what happens with the following

- Superannuation

Superannuation remains in tact, you can still make voluntary contributions to it whilst overseas.

 

[cove]

My US social security card says "Not valid for employment". That's great as I am happy not being employed in the US.
Folks in California really love their cars so I get used to parking my hired Kia or Hyundai poverty pack next to a new Rolls Royce or Porsche.
Living part time in the US is fun and we enjoy the extended shopping hours in California.
We just include any US income in our Australian tax returns as we are still Australian tax residents.

 

[LA10]

Following this thread with interest as I'm thinking of moving to Singapore in the second half of this year

 

[Sdtravel]

Following this thread with interest as I'm thinking of moving to Singapore in the second half of this year

Do you care to give a little insight into that? Reason for, timing & destination.

 

[williamsf1]

I'm in Kabul at the moment and the place is the nearest thing to hell I've seen (and I've seen some pretty frisky places). Makes me appreciate home like nothing else. Give me nanny state and taxes any time....

But i assume you are just there for the money ?

 

[Denali]

+1 and I met an expat that now lives in Serbia. Loves it. Only comes back to visit family.

We have a friend that lives in Mongolia, hes a geologist. Hes built a life for himself there, married, has a kid and has lived there for at least 10yrs. They all come back here for a visit every year or 3. Interesting life.

 

[Sdtravel]

Id be interested to know the decision influencers. What drew them to that location and whey they moved at the time if you know.

Anyone move overseas for work? eg relocated by company. Or decided there were better opportunities in a different city. I guess there will be the obvious moved to Hollywood for showbiz or perhaps went to silicon valley for the tech boom.

 

[seanpodge]

Moved to China (from Melbourne) a few years ago to teach English. Live in Harbin in China's northeast. Originally it wasn't meant to be a long term thing, but I'm pretty happy here now and it'll take a bit to convince me to move back to Australia.

Pros and Cons of living in Harbin/China
PROS
- Can actually afford a house. Have been saving up for a couple of years now. If I waited and saved for another couple of years, I could afford to buy a decent two bedroom apartment (NOT A DEPOSIT, A WHOLE APARTMENT! :shock
- Cost of living. My income is relatively low, but I only need to spend about 15% of it on regular expenses. So I am probably not much different to if I had a steady job back in Melbourne.
- No car needed. Harbin, like most major Chinese cities, has a public transport system that is cheap and actually works! Buses go everywhere and are frequent. My transport costs are about A$10-15 a month.
- "Development". Not sure exactly how to describe it, but just a general feeling that the place is on the up, ready to plan and actually build for the future rather than wait for the future to smack it in the face like in Australia. Over the last four years, Harbin has built or started building 3 new long distance train stations, connected to high speed rail, is expanding the airport, building three subway lines, a new opera house, an indoor ski field, etc.

CONS
- Air pollution. It is a serious issue in winter especially, although it has improved a bit over the last couple of years. Importantly, it seems that the government sees it as an important issue too (even if just from a self preservation point of view) so it should get better over time.
- Road safety/pedestrian amenity. Oh how I'd love the "nanny state" to take care of the drivers of Harbin and China in general. So much driving that is selfish and just flat out dangerous. Cars being allowed to park on footpaths is just another nice touch.

 

[Virgin Bart]

I'm in Kabul at the moment and the place is the nearest thing to hell I've seen (and I've seen some pretty frisky places). Makes me appreciate home like nothing else. Give me nanny state and taxes any time....

Would really love to hear more about life there, everyday things! And any photos you may have? Only if you can and can be bothered.

 

[JohnK]

Say i moved to Asia and rented my place out in Aus. I would only pay local tax and tax on the income from the rental back in Aus.

Are you sure? As an Australian citizen you would need to declare and pay tax on all income regardless of where it was earnt.

You would need to convince taxation that you are moving away permanently.

 

[ermen]

Are you sure? As an Australian citizen you would need to declare and pay tax on all income regardless of where it was earnt.

You would need to convince taxation that you are moving away permanently.

No that's not true for Australian citizens.
Tax residency is what counts.

 

[Warks]

Funnily enough my sister and family are moving back to Aus from Vancouver after 20 years (she's the only Australian) due to the nanny state there!

I think the expat thing works well if you're in it for the long term. A friend has been in Singapore for nearly 20 years and can't really come back here for work as he's on such a good wicket there. But he'll come one day - closer to retirement - as he wouldn't dream of retiring there. People I worked with at my former employer (European multinational) chased the overseas dream hard. Most who went for 3-5 years and came back regretted it. They'd had high flying jobs in Europe or USA and then had to come back to the domestic scene. The only ones who did well had gone away as a marketing manager but came back to a general manager job. Others ended up in the same old job and took redundancy as soon as they could.

 

[Archphoto]

Are you sure? As an Australian citizen you would need to declare and pay tax on all income regardless of where it was earnt.

You would need to convince taxation that you are moving away permanently.

If you pay tax in another country, it won't matter - and on your tax return there is a box (or at least there was) that asked if this was a Final Tax Return and if so, why. I've ticked that box twice in my working life - once when I moved to the UK, the second time when I moved to TH. As long as you're paying tax in one of the countries (AU or wherever you move to) the ATO is happy.

Obviously I'd be keeping tax returns from OS earnings, just in case you are asked why you didn't pay tax - yes, they've asked me that when I moved to the UK, despite notifying them on a Tax Return. My AU accountant handled that and never heard from them again.

Government departments seem to mislay important stuff all the time - same thing has happened with voting. Notified them I no longer live in AU, still get letters demanding to know why I didn't vote Every. Single. Election.

 

[dajop]

Are you sure? As an Australian citizen you would need to declare and pay tax on all income regardless of where it was earnt.

You would need to convince taxation that you are moving away permanently.

You nominate your leaving date and then stay outside Australia for >180 days a year, and ATO is fine with that, they take you on your word. It is evidential, not a matter of convincing them. For those making a permanent move it is not difficult. Where it gets into grey areas if you came back suddenly in < 180 days or where you appear to be "temporarily" living overseas (i.e. without the ability to show being tied down to a particular spot). Someone declaring non-residency for 7 months is probably going to raise a red flag and require an additional burden off proof. But staying away for 2 or 3 years with only fleeting visits back to Australia, is not going to be a problem.

In the grey areas - I have seen a case where someone was overseas for around a year, and on their departure card had nominated "Australian resident leaving temporarily" , had only stayed in hotel overseas, returned several times, and wife had stayed in Australia in family home - and ruling went against them. It seemed the departure card was a significant piece of evidence as to intentions.

 

[PineappleSkip]

I'm in Kabul at the moment and the place is the nearest thing to hell I've seen (and I've seen some pretty frisky places). Makes me appreciate home like nothing else. Give me nanny state and taxes any time....

Mmm. Did two years in POM and four more in KBL. PNG was more nanny state than Afghanistan, but I didn't get carjacked in the latter. Both were less nanny state than NSW.

When in such places I dreamed of the green, green grass is home.

Cheers skip

 

[AnnaB]

This is a really interesting thread to me as I did the reverse. I left Scandinavia and moved to a better life in Australia. Even though work is roughly the same and every day life is the same. You wake up and go to work, you come home and cook dinner, washing, cleaning and everything else is pretty much the same... but life overall is easier here.
The air is fantastic, I can breathe without a problem, the climate is amazing, I can see the sun The pace is slower and at the end of the day I have much more money in my pocket then I did back home.
I can have a life after work, plenty of holidays, do things I never dreamed of, I work to live, dont just live to work.

 

[burmans]

This is a really interesting thread to me as I did the reverse. I left Europe and moved to a better life in Australia. Even though work is roughly the same and every day life is the same. You wake up and go to work, you come home and cook dinner, washing, cleaning and everything else is pretty much the same... but life overall is easier here.
The air is fantastic, I can breathe without a problem, the climate is amazing, I can see the sun The pace is slower and at the end of the day I have much more money in my pocket then I did back home.
I can have a life after work, plenty of holidays, do things I never dreamed of, I work to live, dont just live to work.

As they say, life is always greener ....

 

[LA10]

Do you care to give a little insight into that? Reason for, timing & destination.

It's a place I've always loved and could see myself living there for a few years. I'm single and have no kids, so not as difficult to move as it is for some others. Job prospects seem relatively decent for my career too.