Australian Dual Citizens Entering UK after February

[MEL_Traveller]

Eurostar will check ETAs electronically before they let you into the secure area.

If you manage to have a valid ETA in a foreign passport despite being a British citizen, nothing will be different.

France does not care about the UK's rules. In fact, having Eurostar enforce the ETA helps France.

Previously, France would not know who might be refused entry to the UK. Now, the majority of people who would have been denied entry to the UK, will be filtered out by Eurostar's ETA checks, so they won't even get to the exit controls of France.

Yes. That’s logical.

I guess it’s the same in most places… the airline/carrier does the checks… the actual passport control doesn’t!

 

[Peter D]

With Eurostar both outgoing emigration checks and destination immigration checks are done before one boards the train.

Last time I departed from Brussels the sequence was

1. Ticket checks (but I can’t remember if they wanted to check a passport as well).

2. Belgian outgoing passport control.

3. British destination passport control.

The platform and train was then a secure area. With no checks at London. Just walk out.

I had arrived in the Schengen area via Switzerland with an Australian passport, I mistakenly presented my British passport to the Belgian official for scanning who instantly knew what was happening and simply asked “do you have two passports”. He allowed me out on my Australian passport and 3 or 4 metres later I entered Britain presenting the British passport.

More recently departing from London to Amsterdam same sequence.

Eurostar ticket check. British departure controls and I think it was French officials controlling the entry for Schengen countries. All done in same place. Could then get off at any station in Belgium or Netherlands without further control.

 

[Zero]

1. Ticket checks (but I can’t remember if they wanted to check a passport as well).

2. Belgian outgoing passport control.

3. British destination passport control.

No passport checks in Step 1, but you now need to provide API to Eurostar before they will release your ticket. Eurostar does not seem to check that the person travelling is the person whose API was submitted - but people with invalid documentation such as no ETA will be caught by the actual border agents anyway.

More recently departing from London to Amsterdam same sequence.

Eurostar ticket check. British departure controls and I think it was French officials controlling the entry for Schengen countries. All done in same place. Could then get off at any station in Belgium or Netherlands without further control.

There are no British departure controls as such, it is just Eurostar staff who swipe passports and send the data to UKBF later. These staff don't have the means to do any checks (though very rarely actual UKBF agents may take over).

If you are a visitor you should obviously present the passport you used to enter the UK, so that your departure is recorded accurately and you don't get accused of overstaying in the future.

If you are British, you can provide any passport, because having no exit recorded against your UK passport has no effect on your right to re-enter the UK.

 

[Bundy Bear]

I am not sure if i should have read this before hand but i have paid some money got the documents from my parents and DHL them to UK today should arrive on the 20 Feb.
suggested 22 days turn around time.
63 days until first flight of the trip.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

No passport checks in Step 1, but you now need to provide API to Eurostar before they will release your ticket. Eurostar does not seem to check that the person travelling is the person whose API was submitted - but people with invalid documentation such as no ETA will be caught by the actual border agents anyway.


There are no British departure controls as such, it is just Eurostar staff who swipe passports and send the data to UKBF later. These staff don't have the means to do any checks (though very rarely actual UKBF agents may take over).

If you are a visitor you should obviously present the passport you used to enter the UK, so that your departure is recorded accurately and you don't get accused of overstaying in the future.

If you are British, you can provide any passport, because having no exit recorded against your UK passport has no effect on your right to re-enter the UK.

Eurostar says in their website there can be document checks… perhaps come 25 Feb they will put that into effect. But they won’t have a clue if a UK citizen is travelling on an Aussie passport as long as that passport has an ETA.

Question is… will the UK government cancel any ETAs which are also held by british citizens (passport holders) come 25 Feb? Ie for those that declared UK citizenship as part of their ETA application.

In that case Eurostar may get a ‘do not board’ message.

Same applies for the airlines… unless the UK govt cancels existing ETAs, the airline won’t know, or care, about dual nationality.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Interesting discussion on the British High Commission’s facebook page… people are asking the question ‘if I was born in Australia, have lived here all my life, never applied for a British passport, how does the UK government know I’m British’.

The replies… ‘they know from you birth certificate, and your parents’ place of birth’ and - wait for it - ‘all of that is contained in the microchip on your Aussie passport’.

Amazing if true!

 

[lovestotravel]

Interesting discussion on the British High Commission’s facebook page… people are asking the question ‘if I was born in Australia, have lived here all my life, never applied for a British passport, how does the UK government know I’m British’.

The replies… ‘they know from you birth certificate, and your parents’ place of birth’ and - wait for it - ‘all of that is contained in the microchip on your Aussie passport’.

Amazing if true!

Can't remember if I posted about this on here, but we are applying for 2 kids passports and we leave in 23 days.

They are eligible to apply for British passports.....

We were going to not apply and see if we could get on the plane. Lots of people said yes, but a few said no. Unable to get an official answer on how to get around the rules funnily enough...

So applied for passports, all documents received on 6th Feb.

Keep in mind the contact centre to discuss applications is run by Serco and another provider and they simply read notes. They can't even view documents sent........

Child 1 - Around 10th Feb - They asked for paperwork we had sent - Called them, first two people hopeless, 3rd person said only a few documents uploaded. They then found them all on Child 2's application and put it back to the assessor. Assessor then came back and said we need to handwrite a letter saying who the Grandparents of the child are, even thought that is all clear on the birth certificate.
5 hours of calls and live chats, no way to get around it, and of course, posting the document, so another $130 for international courier and another week delay. I asked time and time again for assurance this would be the last document they needed, no-one would guarantee that.

My issue was this document was not requested at time of application and will likely mean the UK part of our trip won't happen.

Child 2 - Heard nothing - Unable to escalate, totally impossible until after either 3 or 4 or 10 weeks. No idea at this stage.


The process, contact centre and implementation of this is beyond a joke

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Can't remember if I posted about this on here, but we are applying for 2 kids passports and we leave in 23 days.

They are eligible to apply for British passports.....

We were going to not apply and see if we could get on the plane. Lots of people said yes, but a few said no. Unable to get an official answer on how to get around the rules funnily enough...

So applied for passports, all documents received on 6th Feb.

Keep in mind the contact centre to discuss applications is run by Serco and another provider and they simply read notes. They can't even view documents sent........

Child 1 - Around 10th Feb - They asked for paperwork we had sent - Called them, first two people hopeless, 3rd person said only a few documents uploaded. They then found them all on Child 2's application and put it back to the assessor. Assessor then came back and said we need to handwrite a letter saying who the Grandparents of the child are, even thought that is all clear on the birth certificate.
5 hours of calls and live chats, no way to get around it, and of course, posting the document, so another $130 for international courier and another week delay. I asked time and time again for assurance this would be the last document they needed, no-one would guarantee that.

My issue was this document was not requested at time of application and will likely mean the UK part of our trip won't happen.

Child 2 - Heard nothing - Unable to escalate, totally impossible until after either 3 or 4 or 10 weeks. No idea at this stage.


The process, contact centre and implementation of this is beyond a joke

So… while citizenship may be ‘automatic’ there’s still a process behind ‘claiming’ it.

If we were to believe some of the comments all the above information would already be held and known by the UK government and there’s nothing further except asking for a passport!

If the call centre/passport office doesn’t have all of the above, how would an officer on the frontline at heathrow?

 

[lovestotravel]

So… while citizenship may be ‘automatic’ there’s still a process behind ‘claiming’ it.

If we were to believe some of the comments all the above information would already be held and known by the UK government and there’s nothing further except asking for a passport!

If the call centre/passport office doesn’t have all of the above, how would an officer on the frontline at heathrow?

Indeed, but for children born to a British Mum in Australia it's kinda automatic- Until it's not Like for us....

 

[Princess Fiona]

Interesting discussion on the British High Commission’s facebook page… people are asking the question ‘if I was born in Australia, have lived here all my life, never applied for a British passport, how does the UK government know I’m British’.

The replies… ‘they know from you birth certificate, and your parents’ place of birth’ and - wait for it - ‘all of that is contained in the microchip on your Aussie passport’.

Amazing if true!

Not a chance.
They are vastly overestimating UK border farce.

 

[Pushka]

So… while citizenship may be ‘automatic’ there’s still a process behind ‘claiming’ it.

If we were to believe some of the comments all the above information would already be held and known by the UK government and there’s nothing further except asking for a passport!

If the call centre/passport office doesn’t have all of the above, how would an officer on the frontline at heathrow?

They just need to apply for a passport and provide all the required paperwork, five times over. Simples

 

[LondonAussie]

And to apply for a passport you need to provide a lot of evidence that you’re a citizen, which they don’t seem to already have or know.

 

[lovestotravel]

And to apply for a passport you need to provide a lot of evidence that you’re a citizen, which they don’t seem to already have or know.

So update for Child 2

The pathetic HM Passport office now want

We need a hand-signed and dated letter with the following details about Child 2's mother’s own mother:
their first name
their last name
their middles names –
if they have them any previous names they may have had
their date of birth
their town of birth
their country of birth
their nationality
their marriage or civil partnership date
their British passport number, if they have a British passport their British passport issue date,
if they have a British passport their British passport expiry date, if they have a British passport


Now all the Grandparents details were on the original birth certificates and marriage certificates that were sent

I'm also 99% sure the passport number and details were entered by me when applying

This letter is 100% pointless, and it cannot be email and MUSt be posted
So another 5 + days wasted and another $112.50 for Australia Post/DHL

I will be seeking compensation for this once this is over, these requests are beyond pathetic

 

[Rebus]

So update for Child 2

The pathetic HM Passport office now want

We need a hand-signed and dated letter with the following details about Child 2's mother’s own mother:
their first name
their last name
their middles names –
if they have them any previous names they may have had
their date of birth
their town of birth
their country of birth
their nationality
their marriage or civil partnership date
their British passport number, if they have a British passport their British passport issue date,
if they have a British passport their British passport expiry date, if they have a British passport


Now all the Grandparents details were on the original birth certificates and marriage certificates that were sent

I'm also 99% sure the passport number and details were entered by me when applying

This letter is 100% pointless, and it cannot be email and MUSt be posted
So another 5 + days wasted and another $112.50 for Australia Post/DHL

I will be seeking compensation for this once this is over, these requests are beyond pathetic

May I ask if this letter is to be signed by Child 2's mother's mother? Or by either of Child 2's parents who, presumably, are submitting the application?

 

[luxury-lizard]

Interesting discussion on the British High Commission’s facebook page… people are asking the question ‘if I was born in Australia, have lived here all my life, never applied for a British passport, how does the UK government know I’m British’.

The replies… ‘they know from you birth certificate, and your parents’ place of birth’ and - wait for it - ‘all of that is contained in the microchip on your Aussie passport’.

Amazing if true!

Really - how can this be true - my Australian passport application (so I presume everyone's) did not ask for any information regarding my parents (names, birthplaces, DOB, nationality, ....) I am a naturalise Australian, born in Canada, mother born in Canada (and her parents), father naturalised Canadian born in Trinidad (his parents as well) - he was British. After extensive research some years ago (when the UK was still part of the EU) I tried to find out if I had the right to a British passport and it was extremely difficult to determine (in my situation) - eventually figured out I had the right to reside in the UK but was not entitled to citizenship (unless I first resided there for ?? years). So if this information is in the microchip in my passport it would be a miracle.

 

[lovestotravel]

May I ask if this letter is to be signed by Child 2's mother's mother? Or by either of Child 2's parents who, presumably, are submitting the application?

I, as the Father, submitted the application, the email was addressd to me, but it doesn't clearly say who should sign the letter.

Both of us, as parents will sign it.

 

[Pushka]

The UK have been in a bit of a cluster when their laws changed to included women in some of their classifications because previously it was quite discriminatory. Fathers was the gold standard. So they are playing catch up and becoming obsessed with females.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Really - how can this be true - my Australian passport application (so I presume everyone's) did not ask for any information regarding my parents (names, birthplaces, DOB, nationality, ....) I am a naturalise Australian, born in Canada, mother born in Canada (and her parents), father naturalised Canadian born in Trinidad (his parents as well) - he was British. After extensive research some years ago (when the UK was still part of the EU) I tried to find out if I had the right to a British passport and it was extremely difficult to determine (in my situation) - eventually figured out I had the right to reside in the UK but was not entitled to citizenship (unless I first resided there for ?? years). So if this information is in the microchip in my passport it would be a miracle.

Exactly.

I wonder if the UK gov is deleting posts with common sense, and leaving posts which support the official narrative?

The only real issue I can see would be a UK born parent turning up to the border with their child (born after 2006 for the sake of simplicity) who was travelling on an Aussie passport with an ETA.

The border might question whether the child is in fact British. But by then you’re already at the border and can’t be denied entry.

And there’s no ‘good character’ test for automatic citizenship, so they couldn’t refuse entry in the basis you’d been misleading on any applications. The character test only applies to people applying for citizenship.

 

[lovestotravel]

A week to go, lets see what happens at airports etc