Arrangements for return of overseas students announced

Seat0B

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NSW Treasurer has just announced that overseas students will start to return to NSW from July this year in a pilot program. They will arrive on chartered flights and quarantine in student accommodation facilities. Initially it will be 250 per week, working up to 500 per week. He was at pains to stress that no Australian wanting to return would miss out on a flight or a hotel quarantine place.
 

dajop

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If it is ok for foreign students to quarantine in their accommodation facilities, why can't returning Australians quarantine at home?
I thought the answer to that would be quite obvious, The way they will be accommodated presumably won’t be that different to hotel quarantine. They won’t be quarantining in shared student households!
 
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You thought wrong. If a student can quarantine in their student apartment ( which it more than likely is in this case) how is that any different than an Australian quarantining in their own apartment? Assuming neither are sharing households.
 

oz_mark

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You thought wrong. If a student can quarantine in their student apartment ( which it more than likely is in this case) how is that any different than an Australian quarantining in their own apartment? Assuming neither are sharing households.

Presumably they can put processes etc in place to make sure the students stay there.

One of the issues with home quarantine is the number of people that don't stay home, or having friends around.
 
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I understand your point but also that there are 30,000+ Australians desperately trying to get home. If we make special arrangements for a bunch of foreign students then we should make special provisions to bring our people home too.

How about a GPS connected ankle bracelet to stop you leaving home and a $500,000 fine for you and your friends if they decide to visit during your quarantine?
 

dajop

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You thought wrong. If a student can quarantine in their student apartment ( which it more than likely is in this case) how is that any different than an Australian quarantining in their own apartment? Assuming neither are sharing households.

I'm presume they will have central student accommodation dedicated to quarantine that will turn over after 14 days. Even if they don't, and students remain in the units originally allocated, I'd guess they'd all entering the same section (same building, same floors in same building) at the same time, and thus share common security, medical support, controls on entering/exiting etc, unlike people quarantining in their own apartments which would be dotted all over a city.

I'm not sure the circumstances are even remotely the same. I see student accommodation quarantine as just as an extension of hotel quarantine.

Here are the tender documents:

 
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I'm presume they will have central student accommodation dedicated to quarantine that will turn over after 14 days. Even if they don't, and students remain in the units originally allocated, I'd guess they'd all entering the same section (same building, same floors in same building) at the same time, and thus share common security, medical support, controls on entering/exiting etc, unlike people quarantining in their own apartments which would be dotted all over a city.

I'm not sure the circumstances are even remotely the same. I see student accommodation quarantine as just as an extension of hotel quarantine.

Here are the tender documents:

So the obvious response to that is that if there is accommodation that is available to house the incoming students, why is it not being used right now to bring in the 30,000+ stranded Aussies?

I have no objection at all to bringing in students. Only that we are prepared to cut special deals when Aussies are stranded.

If the government has the capacity to do more, it must do more.
 

dajop

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I understand your point but also that there are 30,000+ Australians desperately trying to get home. If we make special arrangements for a bunch of foreign students then we should make special provisions to bring our people home too.

I think it's more complicated than that. If that were the case, the backlog would be over in about 6 week, as Australia is taking around 5000+ a week.

Many are wanting to come back for visits, because no one is damn well allowed to leave to visit in the other direction, and some (yours truly included) coming back for a second or more visit. In fact its entirely possible that you get a family of 5 coming to Australia to visit, instead of 2 grandparents going in the other direction).

There are also some mismatches as to where people are and where the flights are coming from.

But I would dearly love it if they were able to find a way for people to do home quarantine - especially vaccinated people coming from low risk destinations. However such is the political poison (perceive or otherwise) around all of this, anything else is barely on the table.
 

Seat0B

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I think it's more complicated than that. If that were the case, the backlog would be over in about 6 week, as Australia is taking around 5000+ a week.

Many are wanting to come back for visits, because no one is damn well allowed to leave to visit in the other direction, and some (yours truly included) coming back for a second or more visit. In fact its entirely possible that you get a family of 5 coming to Australia to visit, instead of 2 grandparents going in the other direction).

There are also some mismatches as to where people are and where the flights are coming from.

But I would dearly love it if they were able to find a way for people to do home quarantine - especially vaccinated people coming from low risk destinations. However such is the political poison (perceive or otherwise) around all of this, anything else is barely on the table.
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Pushka

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That's where a $500,000 fine comes in. If you make the penalty large enough people will comply.
But it also needs to be enforced. Not to that extent but at least as a deterrent. Currently in several states all we seem to hear is mealy mouthed excuses, from authorities, for why people decide the rules don't apply to them.
 

MEL_Traveller

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That's where a $500,000 fine comes in. If you make the penalty large enough people will comply.

Or the opposite... the $66K fine and/or jail time for breaching the flight ban from India was met with such an outcry the government had to backpedal and say they wouldn't enforce them. Potentially makes it hard to enforce any rules around home quarantine.
 

Pushka

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Or the opposite... the $66K fine and/or jail time for breaching the flight ban from India was met with such an outcry the government had to backpedal and say they wouldn't enforce them. Potentially makes it hard to enforce any rules around home quarantine.
I think the outcry was more directed at banning people from returning to their country of citizenship which is just obnoxious, and then the big stick being the fines etc. It's the same thing as when SA banned its own residents from returning back home from Victoria in the midst of last year leaving its own residents stranded.
 

MEL_Traveller

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I think the outcry was more directed at banning people from returning to their country of citizenship which is just obnoxious, and then the big stick being the fines etc. It's the same thing as when SA banned its own residents from returning back home from Victoria in the midst of last year leaving its own residents stranded.

I dunno... I just googled the ban and majority of articles and headlines - both domestic and overseas - are focusing on the fines and jail time.. The govt had to retreat on the fines, but the ban still stood.

If the headline had just been 'we are suspending flights from India' I don't see how there could have been too many objections because the ban would not have been against citizens specifically, but more general in application. It was the fines that seemed to push public opinion over?
 

Pushka

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I dunno... I just googled the ban and majority of articles and headlines - both domestic and overseas - are focusing on the fines and jail time.. The govt had to retreat on the fines, but the ban still stood.
True. But everyone is so snugged about Zero that it was hard for the media to get a handle on that part but the fines were the easy target. The ban I think was likely appropriate if there were concerns about the authenticity of the Covid free certificates coming from India, at the time, given how lack of control in UK has seen their infection rate increase solely as a result of the new strain (alpha bravo Charlie delta or whatever it's called)
 

oz_mark

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I dunno... I just googled the ban and majority of articles and headlines - both domestic and overseas - are focusing on the fines and jail time.. The govt had to retreat on the fines, but the ban still stood.

If the headline had just been 'we are suspending flights from India' I don't see how there could have been too many objections because the ban would not have been against citizens specifically, but more general in application. It was the fines that seemed to push public opinion over?

The fines were not introduced specifically, but were the defined penalty for breaching the directions. The government would have been far better off not drawing attention to the fines/jail time. In any case, I doubt that the courts would have imposed any such penalties on anyone.
 

Duncan

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It has nothing to do with the NSW Treasurer but the Federal Minister of Immigration and Health. To my knowledge the request is still sitting in their respective in trays.
 

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